House of Commons Hansard Debates for 7 Sep 1990

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excellent speech yesterday, it is essential that any action has the widest possible international support and is taken in accordance with United Nations resolutions, the UN charter and under international law.

President Bush and his chief Ministers have so far handled the crisis with great skill and intelligence. If any of my hon. Friends doubt that--we have heard one such expression--I urge them to consider what would be the situation if President Reagan were still in office. There would not have been the concern to create such a wide-ranging international consensus, or to work through the United Nations, or the circumspection and restraint that have so far been the hallmark of the speeches and statements of President Bush and Secretary of State James Baker.

Naturally, the Americans want to protect their oil supplies-- [Interruption.] This is a serious debate and it would be sensible for hon. Members to take it seriously. We all want to protect our oil supplies, and that goes for Japan, the countries of Europe and, as my right hon. Friend the Member for Bethnal Green and Stepney (Mr. Shore) said yesterday, the developing countries of the third world. We all want to protect our oil supplies and we are entitled to do so.

I do not believe that--as my right hon. Friend the Member for Chesterfield (Mr. Benn) hinted--it is the intention of the United States to set up a virtual protectorate in the Gulf. The reality, as we have seen from the tour by Secretary of State Brady, is that the United States can no longer afford permanent involvement on the scale that may well be required if security is to be maintained in the middle east.

I ask my hon. Friends to mark this point well. The new development in American foreign policy--and I believe that we must welcome it--is the realisation in the United States that although the United States remains a super-power, it must act within the widest possible international support. It is only sensible and wise for us to mark that.

My next point--the new and most welcome accord between the United States and the Soviet Union--has been mentioned by a number of hon. Members. It is not true to say that the Soviet Union is no longer a super-power if we judge that by the possession of nuclear weapons and of substantial armed forces. In that sense, the Soviet Union is a super-power. If we had had a middle east crisis on this scale five years ago, we could now be on the brink of world war. The fact that we are not marks the real change and shift that has occurred. In this crisis, the United States and the Soviet Union are co-operating in the Security Council.

The Soviet Union is taking a resolute line with Iraq, its former client. That was illustrated by the polite, but firm reception given to the Iraqi Foreign Minister in Moscow this week. This weekend, President Bush and President Gorbachev will meet in Helsinki, at the request of President Bush, to discuss common strategy over the crisis. That is an enormously welcome development.

The new relationship between the Soviet Union and the United States has breathed new life into the United Nations and has helped to make the response to the Iraqi invasion so international and so effective. We must welcome that and we must hope to build on and develop that constructive accord, which is so promising for the world and for the future of peace.

There is general agreement in the House that we must look beyond the immediate situation and that we must try

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to reach a long-term settlement in the middle east. It is interesting and significant that both Secretary of State James Baker and the Foreign Minister of the Soviet Union, Eduard Shevardnadze, have been talking about longer-term objectives and, above all, about the need to create a more stable order in the middle east, an area which is so vital to the world.

I do not have time to run over what should be included in that long-term settlement. Clearly, we must settle some of the basic disputes, especially, of course, the Palestinian issue. It is vital that we settle that. It is also vital that we come to our senses about exporting arms to the middle east. None of us should forget--and we all have a responsibility here--that the west helped to build up the military might of Iraq. We must draw the appropriate lesson from that and about chemical bans as well.

We must have a new security guarantee in the middle east. I was pleased to hear the Prime Minister talk about the possible role of the United Nations. The Arabs must be involved as well.

I will join my right hon. Friend the Leader of the Opposition in voting for the Adjournment today, not because I am giving the Government a blank cheque--none of us should give any Government a blank cheque--but because I support the Government's actions so far and, above all, because, like my right hon. Friend, I support the case for an effective international response to a clear case of aggression by Iraq.

12.39 pm

Rev. Ian Paisley (Antrim, North) : The gravity of the situation cannot be overstated. All right-thinking people do not want war, hate war and want it to be avoided. However, we have to face the fact that there may be war because of Iraqi aggression against Kuwait. The debate is overshadowed by three factors that we should keep in mind. First, we are threatened with a war that will bring into play modern chemical weapons. That is to be dreaded and, if possible, avoided. Secondly, large numbers of our citizens and large numbers of the citizens of our allies are already in the hands of Saddam Hussein. We must never forget the hostages. Thirdly, Saddam has a master card. He could turn his attention to Israel and thereby unite almost all the Arab nations behind him. We should face up to those dark shadows. Many hon. Members have used the words, "God forbid that this should happen." I echo them. I call on the Prime Minister to go to see Her Majesty the Queen and advise her that this nation should have a day of prayer and humility to ask almighty God to avert this calamity. The battle does not go to the strong or the swift. It is more honourable and ethical to ask for the avoidance of calamity than to call for deliverence from calamity once it has come.

I associate myself with the sympathy expressed to the families of our colleagues who have died since we last met. As an hon. Member representing Northern Ireland, I pay tribute to Ian Gow. He was a personal friend of Northern Ireland and the sympathy of the Province goes to his wife and sons. Ian Gow agreed with the Unionist representatives in their attitude to the Anglo-Irish Agreement.

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Many people have castigated the United States and others for their attitude, but it was well for us that we had America and that it was able to do what is has done.

Mr. William Cash (Stafford) : And Great Britain.

Rev. Ian Paisley : Yes. Think of what a situation we should be in if America did not have the ability to respond to the call for help from the Saudis.

I support the Prime Minister for backing America from the start. I have never advocated a blank cheque approach in support of American policies. However, there is an inconsistency which galls the Unionists. Let us suppose that an hon. Member suggested that Kuwait and Iraq should have an agreement, and that that agreement should consist of the setting up of a conference with equal numbers of representatives from Iraq and Kuwait, or that the dictator himself should preside at the conference, and that the Kuwaitis should make every effort to agree with what Iraq wants and should bend their energies to that end, and that if at any time the Kuwaiti people wanted to vote themselves into Iraq the Governments of the world should support that. Any hon. Member who said, "That is the answer", would be cried down with the fury of the House. Yet the House, by an overwhelming vote, agreed to the Anglo-Irish Agreement. Hon. Members should remember that the root cause of the trouble in Northern Ireland is a claim of territory.

It is all very well castigating other people for their remarks, but we should look to this House today. In Northern Ireland we have had 3,000 people killed and 10,000 people maimed. A warship being prepared for the Royal Navy was bombed yesterday in the Belfast shipyard. Two nights ago, the police station at Lochgall, where the IRA were defeated a year ago, was devastated in an attack. And the deaths continue. When hon. Members agree to the course that the House is rightly taking, they should have a thought for Northern Ireland and should support the efforts being made to ensure that the Anglo-Irish Agreement is set aside and a new constitutional settlement achieved in Northern Ireland.

I want to say a word about the hostages, the refugees, the countries that are suffering as a result of the embargo and especially the families of the hostages. I pay tribute to the hon. Member for Blaydon (Mr. McWilliam), who spoke of Douglas Croskery, who was an Ulsterman and the first man to die in the Kuwaiti trouble. I should like to say, on behalf of the family represented by my hon. Friend the Member for North Down (Mr. Kilfedder), that we deeply appreciate the remarks made by the hon. Member for Blaydon. I should like to associate myself with the other remarks that have been made about the suffering of the hostages. I hope that the House will not only take into consideration the countries that are suffering as a result of the embargo, such as Egypt and Jordan, but will remember that many businesses in our country are beginning to suffer and that unemployment will be the result of the pressures of this embargo. I hope that the Government will bear that in mind. I heard on television this morning a statement from the Government that "We must stand up for our ethical principles. Therefore, if people are unemployed it is just too bad." I hope that that is not the official Government view. I hope that they are prepared to help unemployed

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people who are put on the dole simply because of the embargo. They deserve the attention of the House and of the Government. I trust that this war will be averted and that the House will keep its strength and show the world that we will not tolerate aggression. I hope and pray that the matters that we are discussing will continue to have the support of the world community. I believe that if they have worldwide support we have a sharp weapon against Hussein, who may say that this is a west-Arab struggle. That lying propaganda must not be given any credence whatever.

12.48 pm

Mr. David Winnick (Walsall, North) : One thing is certain : no hon. Member who has spoken in the debate so far has criticised the recall of Parliament. When the invasion occurred on 2 August I took the view that it would be right for the House to be recalled as quickly as possible. I remembered that in 1968, when I was a Member for another constituency, the House was recalled almost immediately following the invasion of Czechoslovakia.

Earlier this year, on 5 April, I had an Adjournment debate in which I urged

"that the banning of all forms of high-level technology to Iraq should be given the highest priority and that every effort should be made urgently to seek co-operation on that, certainly from the countries of western Europe". --[ Official Report , 5 April 1990 ; Vol. 170 c. 1352.]

I also argued that sanctions should include the ending of trade credits to the regime.

When the Minister of State, Foreign and Commonwealth Office, the right hon. Member for Bristol, West (Mr. Waldegrave), who replied to the debate last night, answered my Adjournment debate he disagreed with me on trade credits. His comments were quoted this week on "Panorama". He argued that if we stopped trade credits to Iraq, other countries would step in. That is indeed a familiar argument. I believe that this country, though not so much as France or the Soviet Union, has some responsibility for the build-up of the armaments industry in Iraq. We should recognise that and learn the lessons from it for the future when allowing weapons to be supplied to dictatorships of the most brutal and terrorist kind. According to the "Panorama" progamme, it appears that the company, located in Britain, that has contributed to Iraq's nuclear build-up continues to do that work. That is something which the Government must look into urgently.

I take the view, of course, that the invasion of Kuwait was an act of outright criminality. It is, as we all know, a blatant lie that the Iraqis had been invited in by opposition elements. That lie hardly lasted a single week. Shortly after we were told that Kuwait was just another province of Iraq and that that could not be changed. People such as myself, who were not around here at the time but who know it from contemporary history, must surely recall what happened in 1938 when Nazi troops marched into Austria. It was said then that, arising from the wish of the Austrian and German people, it was one greater German nation. The same familiar lie has been repeated now in endless propaganda from a terrorist dictatorship.

I also take the view that the Security Council acted correctly and promptly. The resolutions on sanctions and the blockade that have been approved should ensure that Kuwait is freed from enemy occupation. The international community should not be satisfied with anything less.

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Kuwait must be freed. If that is not achieved, everything that we are doing will have been a waste of time. The primary objective is that Kuwait should be freed from occupation. There can be no negotiations, no deals on that basic demand.

I do not accept that in return for ending the occupation, some offer should be made to the criminal regime in Iraq. Various suggestions have been made on the international scene and by a few hon. Members in our debate. It has been suggested that an island here or an island there should be given to Iraq. That would be rewarding the aggressor. It is not the job of the inernational community to find ways in which a dictator can, somehow, save face. He took upon himself the responsibility of that invasion. He must bear that responsibility to his own people and to the international community. Some have argued that what is required is an international conference--it has been said by some of my hon. Friends and a few Conservative Members--to try to settle a number of outstanding issues in the middle east, including the present crisis. I agree with some of the aims of such a conference. Much reference in the debate has been made to the Palestinian issue. I have never disagreed that that is a very important problem. I speak as one--I have never been ashamed of it--who believes that it was right in 1948 that the state of Israel should have been set up, for obvious reasons. But if the Jews have a right to a homeland of their own, so have the Palestinians. I have harshly criticised, and I shall continue to do so, the outlandish and hawkish ways in which successive Israeli Governments have acted. I took part here in some of the exchanges in 1967. It is true that at that time Israel took upon itself that aggression, but, by heavens, it was provoked into so doing. In 1973 it did not, rightly or wrongly, take upon itself that initiative, but in 1967 it came to the conclusion, as most people did, that, as in 1948, the Arab world was going to invade. As a result, the occupied territories were taken. There were no occupied territories before then. My criticism of Israel is that, having gained those occupied territories, it should have used them for negotiating purposes, rather than taking the line that has unfortunately been taken and stating that the land is all part of Israel and should remain so.

Surely the difference between Kuwait and the occupied territories, is that since 1948 there has been a state of war between Israel and most of the Arab world ; there was no state of war between Iraq and Kuwait. If Kuwait is to be criticised, it must be for the way in which, over the past few years, it has done everything possible to appease the dictatorship in Iraq, advancing loans of every conceivable kind.

When some of my hon. Friends say, "Let us have an international conference in the first place", my mind goes back to 1956. I was not a Member of Parliament then, but on Sunday 4 November I demonstrated up the road in Trafalgar square. I was deeply angered, shocked and humiliated by what the Tory Government had done : in my opinion it was a criminal act with no justification, and, although that view may have been shared by a minority in the country, it was a pretty sizeable minority.

I did not say with others opposed to the aggression then that an international conference should first take place ; nor did my right hon. Friend the Member for Chesterfield (Mr. Benn), who at that time represented a different constituency. We said, first and foremost, that what the

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Eden Government had brought about--criminal aggression--must be ended. For all sorts of reasons, as we know, it was ended. If Labour Members were right to say that 34 years ago, when aggression was perpetrated by a Government in this country, how can we now be indifferent to what a terrorist dictatorship has done in Kuwait? How could we be consistent if we were not equally angry and dismayed, and as determined about the freeing of Kuwait as we were 34 years ago about the Suez operation? I see no inconsistency. I believe that we should always oppose aggression in all its forms, and I shall continue to do so.

What if the sanctions and the blockade do not achieve our objective? I have already stressed that that objective must be the freeing of Kuwait, and I accept the possibility that the sanctions and the blockade will not achieve it. I believe, however, that it is essential to allow time for sanctions-- strictly applied--to work. The regime is not likely to be brought to its knees within a few weeks : it has a certain amount of reserves and resilience. Nevertheless, it appears that sanctions are already beginning to bite, and, if that is happening after such a short time, it would indeed be foolish to conclude that they are not going to work. We should give them time--and that view should, I believe, be adopted by the leading player in this matter the United States. If I had to choose between the editorials in The Times and those in The Daily Telegraph, I would opt for The Daily Telegraph, which has argued strongly for caution and for allowing the sanctions policy to work.

On the other hand, if sanctions ultimately do not work--I shall speak frankly ; we are all responsible for our words--I believe that force should be used. To say otherwise would be inconsistent with what I have already said : that Kuwait should be freed from enemy occupation. Let me strongly urge, however, that the broad alliance that has come into being be maintained. My right hon. Friend the Leader of the Opposition was absolutely right : if force is to be used, it must be used with the approval of the United Nations. A broad consensus should be maintained at all times to isolate the terrorist regime, and to ensure that as much international support as possible is maintained by Britain, the United States, other powers and those Arab countries that understand how essential it is for the consequences of the aggressive act committed on 2 August to be brought to an end.

12.58 pm

Sir David Price (Eastleigh) : The last time I addressed the House on the subject of a crisis in the middle east was 13 September 1956. On that occasion I followed the then hon. Member for Bristol, South-East ; yesterday we heard from him again, wearing the rather different motley of the right hon. Member for Chesterfield (Mr. Benn). Then, as now, we took rather different views of the crisis. To put it at its simplest at this late hour in the debate, the right hon. Gentleman profoundly distrusted the Government. This time he has added his profound distrust of the Americans. On both occasions I express my trust of the Government and on this occasion of the Americans.

At this late stage in the debate the House will be relieved to hear that I shall not attempt to give my analysis of what has happened in the middle east over the past 34 years and

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of how we should handle the crisis. I shall raise only one or two human problems which I hope will command the attention of the House and further action by the Government.

I hope that the House will agree that it is insufficient to say that we support the implementation of the international rule of law. We must also pick up the casualties of such implementation even though the origin of their situation is Iraqi aggression. As my right hon. Friend the Minister of State, Foreign and Commonwealth Office, said last night in his winding- up speech, we are talking about Saddam Hussein's refugees. However, the plain fact is that we have to cope with the situation as we find it. Our embassies in Kuwait and Baghdad are doing everything that they can for our own people. The criticisms that have been made are ill-placed, given the remarkably difficult circumstances in which the embassies have been working. Before this debate is over, we should make it clear that we pay the fullest tribute to what our staff there are doing. When those British subjects get out of Iraq and Kuwait we should do more. First, when the aircraft come back full of British refugees there should not only be immigration officers to meet them but people from the Department of Social Security to offer immediate help. Although the majority have families to go to, there is evidence that some arrive penniless and dispossessed. I am sure that the House will agree that they have a call upon our resources just as our prisoners of war did at the end of the war when they came back from various camps in Germany and the far east.

Secondly, my hon. Friend the Member for Kingswood (Mr. Hayward) told the House about some of the problems that he has encountered in his self-help group. I suggest to the House that we have reached the stage at which it is insufficient to rely upon voluntary assistance, and it should be taken over officially because the scale of the numbers is too great to expect purely voluntary organisations to cope with it.

Moving from the subject of our own people to the problem of the many foreign nationals who have been caught in Kuwait and Iraq--some 2.5 million people--we have heard of the plight of many of these refugees when they reach the Jordanian border. The figures are uncertain, but it is thought that about a quarter of a million people are on the Jordanian side of the border. As part of the world community and as co-sponsors of the Security Council's resolutions, we have a responsibility for these people, and that has been acknowledged by my right hon. Friend the Prime Minister. Last night she gave us the good news that we are to increase our contributions to a certain international organisation, and that is greatly to be welcomed.

I suggest that there are four specific measures that the British people can take through the Government now. The first is to make use of that admirable body the Royal Army Medical Corps. It has field ambulances which are self- contained so that when it goes on a job it does not make any demands on the resources of the country that it is going into. It did excellent work in Nepal two years ago and this would be a proper civilian use of military personnel. One of my hon. Friends made the suggestion in general terms that the military should be used, and here is an excellent opportunity to do so at once. As I have some experience of the Royal Army Medical Corps, I can assure the House that it is excellent.

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I would like us to send also members of the Royal Engineers--some field squadrons of sappers, who are extremely versatile. We talk about refugee camps, but none exist. Something must be built as temporary accommodation. The Corps of Royal Engineers is superb at that kind of task, being extremely efficient and adaptable. Right hon. and hon. Members referred also to the need for drivers and to maintain trucks under difficult conditions in the desert. The Royal Corps of Transport is extremely experienced in such work. Anyone who is worried that sending British soldiers to do a civilian job in Jordan would create problems with the Jordanians may be assured that that would not arise. King Hussein above all knows the merits and the capabilities of the British armed forces, having himself been trained by them and having had a long association with them. I am sure it is a challenge that our armed forces would take up willingly.

Finally, I suggest to my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs that there are surplus civilian aircraft available for charter as we come to the end of the holiday season which should be used now to take foreign nationals from the Gulf to their various home countries, such as India, Pakistan and Bangladesh.

I hope that my right hon. Friend will respond to those four specific proposals so that something can be done now. The scale of the problem is quite hideous. If we ask ourselves the old question, "Who is my neighbour?", I am clear that the refugees near Amman are my neighbours.

1.6 pm

Sir David Steel (Tweeddale, Ettrick and Lauderdale) : As we near the end of our two-day debate, we can be thankful that the tone was set at the very beginning, in the speeches of the Prime Minister and the Leader of the Opposition, and has moved the House towards a fairly clear consensus on how the Government should react to the events in the Gulf.

There has been total agreement in the House that a unique attempt to obliterate a member state of the United Nations must be reversed. There has been almost total agreement in the House that the economic blockade should be supported and made effective. There is almost universal hope in the House that sanctions will work, and there is the nearly unanimous view that if they do not or circumstances make it necessary, force may have to be used on behalf of the Government and people of Kuwait.

There was also a general echo of opinion on both sides of the house that if it proves necessary to use force, the widest possible international agreement is essential. There is a widespread feeling in the House that any kind of single United States adventure, with the United Kingdom in tow, would not be welcomed. There is a broad view across the House that further agreement in the United Nations is desirable, and, if that is not available, at the very least, that all 20 nations involved in the present forces, plus the two super-powers, should have to consent to any military activity. That is why this weekend's summit between Mr. Gorbachev and President Bush will be so important.

In the light of what I perceive to be a great consensus in the House, some of us repudiate the comments made yesterday by the right hon. Member for Chesterfield (Mr. Benn). I do not doubt his sincerity in such matters, but I

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am not alone in resenting his suggestion that those of us who vote in the Aye Lobby this afternoon will somehow be voting for war, while he will somehow be voting for peace. That suggestion cannot be allowed to stand, because it is not true. When my right hon. and hon. Friends and I go into the Lobby this afternoon in support of the Government, we shall be saying that we acknowledge that hundreds of our own civilians, as well as thousands of our troops, are at risk in the Gulf. We recognise that the Government have access, which we do not have, to intelligence reports and, increasingly in this day and age, to satellite reports on the situation in Iraq. Therefore, Opposition Members and Government Back Benchers must wish Ministers well in the appallingly difficult judgments that they may have to make in the weeks ahead. That is the spirit in which we shall go into the Lobby today. It is nothing to do with advocating war as against peace.

I have just four points to make. First, we have not paid enough attention to the refugee problem. It is right and natural that the Government and the House should express great concern about the hundreds of our people whose lives are at risk in the Gulf. That is wholly proper. But we should also recognise that hundreds of thousands of people have been dispossessed as a result of Saddam Hussein's actions.

The right hon. Member for Chesham and Amersham (Sir I. Gilmour), who has been to Kuwait far more often than I have, made a telling point when he said that after the invasion nobody could be found in Kuwait to man a substitute Government on behalf of Saddam Hussein. The truth is that Kuwait was, as we know, a rentier economy. A great proportion of its population sent remittances home. It comprised Bangladeshis, Pakistanis, Indians, Filipinos and so on. The image that Saddam Hussein tried to create of his marching in against a privileged royal family is not true. He has wrecked the hopes and the livelihoods of thousands of the poorest people of the world.

Mr. Ian Bruce (Dorset, South) : Will the right hon. Gentleman give way?

Sir David Steel : I am reluctant to give way, because, like everybody else, I want to be brief.

Welcome though the extra money announced by the Prime Minister yesterday is, the refugee problem will not be solved by the signing of cheques. I echo what the hon. Member for Eastleigh (Sir D. Price) and the right hon. Member for Old Bexley and Sidcup (Mr. Heath) have said. If we have spare aeroplanes, now is the time for them to be sent to Jordan to help in an immediate airlift to deal with the refugee problem.

Secondly, one of the lessons of this episode is that the world community must now come to grips with the appalling problem of the free sale of arms and equipment round the world. There is nothing more deeply hypocritical than the way in which the developed nations have poured arms into the middle east and then stood around collectively wringing their hands the minute they were used. We have reaped the benefits of the profits of arms sales from all round the world. The two biggest suppliers to Iraq were two of the permanent members of the Security Council--the Soviet Union and France. My mind goes back to a speech made in 1980 at the Liberal international congress by Hans Dietrich Genscher,

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the German Foreign Minister, calling not for a stop to arms sales--we are not as romantic as that--but at least for an international register of arms manufacturers and sales under the authority of the United Nations. It is time, 10 years on and in the light of what has happened, that that idea was firmly pursued by the world community. We cannot continue to traffic in the weapons of death for profit in the irresponsible way in which we have. Thirdly, many hon. Members have referred to the wider situation in the middle east. It is true that the Israeli occupation of the west bank and Gaza has gone on for a long time. Again, my mind goes back to my time as a young Member of Parliament when I was dispatched as a member of the parliamentary delegation to the United Nations General Assembly in the autumn of 1967. That was the time when Lord Caradon, whose passing we all mourn this week, was our Minister at the United Nations. To him more than anyone else were attributed the efforts to secure the passing of resolution 242. That was a great act of international statesmanship. But the trouble is that, for 23 years, resolution 242 has remained nothing but a piece of paper. Action on it has not taken place. That was because of the continuation of the cold war. The Soviet Union saw in the middle east the possibility of latching on to a conflict, and using it as part of its expansionist plans. That meant that resolution 242 could never be put into effect and become a reality.

Unhappily, when the thaw came, we and the rest of the world were, understandably, taken up with other excitements. With the dismantling of the Berlin wall and events in southern Africa, we took our eyes off the middle east. But we must return to it now and admit that that area of conflict has been neglected for many years.

I agree with those who yesterday said that King Hussein of Jordan had been rather badly treated. We have not recognised the great difficulties that he, in particular, has had in his country. I do not deplore his efforts at continued dialogue and discussion, together with the Secretary-General of the United Nations. Like the Minister of State, I regret the decision of the Palestine Liberation Organisation to support Saddam Hussein, but we must analyse why that has happened. In May, I went to Tunis to meet Yasser Arafat and the Secretary-General of the Arab League. I took careful note of what they said to me. They both registered their dismay at the lack of positive response from Israel and the western powers to Yasser Arafat's initiatives. They said that most radical and extremist forces were liable to say to them, "What is the use of promising to abandon terrorism or recognising Israel's right to exist if it produces no peace?" They said that the pressure for war and terrorism thus increases, so that so-called moderate Governments in the middle east come under threat from fundamentalists hostile to the lack of progress towards a peace settlement and the lack of justice for the Palestinians.

Unhappily, those words have come true, only a few weeks after they were uttered, through the support that has been given to Saddam Hussein and the way in which he has been able to latch on to the Palestinian grievance and attempt to undermine--thankfully, so far unsuccessfully--the Governments of Jordan and Egypt.

The House has an obligation to tell the Government that, because we have such good support from so many

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Arab friends in the current operation, we should say to them that when the crisis is over we will recognise that we have been a little lax--especially successive Governments of the United States--and that we will deal with the Palestinian grievance and with the wider issue of the middle east peace settlement. We must return it to the front of the international agenda.

Fourthly, when in the past I have discussed with Israeli politicians the question of a demilitarised zone in the west bank, they have pooh-poohed that because of the vulnerability of their territorial position--and they had a point. However, are we now moving into a more hopeful era? I welcome what the Prime Minister said yesterday about a better world order, in which the United Nations, because of the co-operation of the super-powers, will have real bite and authority. In such a position, to talk of a long-term United Nations role in the middle east, as part of the peace settlement, is no longer fanciful but a realistic proposition.

Out of this great turmoil must come some signs of hope. I welcome what the Prime Minister said yesterday and I am glad that she has moved away from her unfortunate remarks in Helsinki when she criticised the lack of effort by our fellow Europeans, and I am glad that the Secretary of State for Defence paid tribute to them today. It was rather as though Churchill, in the middle of the last war, had said, "We do not think that the French Resistance is doing enough." The Prime Minister's observation was not helpful, and neither was her vision of NATO instead of the United States becoming the new world policeman in out-of-area operations.

What we must look for, and the Prime Minister rightly referred to this yesterday, is the possibility of the United Nations, because of the way in which it has tackled this matter, realising the dreams of its founders and becoming an effective world policeman. If that happens, some good will have come out of this terrible tragedy. 1.18 pm

Mr. Churchill (Davyhulme) : It is always a pleasure to follow the right hon. Member for Tweedale, Etterick and Lauderdale (Sir D. Steel), and I congratulate him on his robust remarks. I endorse his call for Britain to take the lead in establishing an airlift to transport the refugees from Jordan.

The debate has shown a remarkable degree of unanimity in all quarters in condemning the Iraqi invasion and in expressing determination to see the liberation of Kuwait and the restoration of its legitimate Government.

I preface my remarks by joining those who have paid tribute to our late and valued colleague, Ian Gow. He was a loyal servant of this House, a courageous patriot and a dear friend to many on both sides of the House. He will be sadly missed. Our condolences go to his widow, Jane, and their two sons.

How tragic it is that just as 45 years of cold war confrontation was coming to an end, and we seemed to be moving into smoother waters, we should find ourselves confronted by a grave threat from an entirely different quarter. This is not a crisis which has crept up on us unannounced. Ten years ago, on 11 July 1980, I had occasion to warn in an article in The Times of the determination of the Iraqi Government to acquire weapons of mass destruction, and was the first to report the fact that the Government of France had delivered to

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Iraq 72 kg of weapons grade enriched uranium, sufficient to make three nuclear weapons. It would be difficult to conceive of a more reckless or more venal action by a democratic Government. Thus, it is not just private companies have enabled Saddam Hussein to acquire weapons of mass destruction. Governments have done so as well, including one of our principal partners within the European Community. I find that both appalling and unacceptable. Of course, a year later the Israeli air force took out the Osirak facility, thus nipping Iraq's nuclear capability in the bud and postponing its realisation for an entire decade. For that act Israel was roundly but, in my view, wrongly and regrettably condemned by the world community.

Iraq's invasion of its defenceless neighbour Kuwait was a clear act of war, a flagrant aggression and an act of defiance against the entire international community. Were Iraq to be allowed to get away with such behaviour, international relations would be back to the law of the jungle. That is why the Iraqi dictator must be stopped. Saddam Hussein has thrown down the gauntlet to the world. There can be no doubt that, but for the magnificent and swift response of the United States and Britain, Saddam Hussein's forces would today be occupying Saudi Arabia, and the United Arab Emirates would be under threat. At a stroke, he would have gained control of over half the world's proved oil reserves and posed a mortal threat to all the industrialised nations.

We owe a great debt to President Bush and our United States ally as well as to Her Majesty's Government, my right hon. Friend the Prime Minister and my right hon. Friends the Secretaries of State for Defence and Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs for their swift and sure response to the crisis. It is at times such as this that the British nation appreciates the qualities of the strong and decisive leadership of my right hon. Friend the Prime Minister.

I congratulate also the Leader of the Opposition, who has spoken so robustly for Britain and not in a party political way. He has given his wholehearted support to the Government in calling for the defeat of Saddam Hussein. It is heartening that that robustness has been echoed in every quarter of the House.

Round one has gone to the Allies. The Iraqi conquest of Saudi Arabia has been forestalled. But what next? It is possible, of course, that Iraq will strike at the allies. As each day goes by, however, that becomes less likely. Nor is it by any means impossible that Iraq, with its back to the wall and isolated even within the Arab world, will launch a surprise attack against Israel, to turn a blatant act of aggression against a Muslim and Arab neighbour into an Arab-Israeli confrontation. In either case, that would mean war. But, what if Saddam Hussein does not strike? Of course, we all wish to see the crisis resolved without further military action, but, barring a coup in Baghdad, that seems increasingly unlikely. It is argued from many quarters that we should allow time to let sanctions work, but what exactly is meant by that and of how long are we talking?

It is true that the United Nations has never been so unanimous in the face of aggression. It is important that the international coalition that has been put in place should be kept in being as far as possible. It is also true that, given Iraq's geographic position and the political line-up against her, there is greater prospect of sanctions being effective in this case than in any other. No Iraqi oil

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is being exported and no oil revenues earned. Even so, it will be many months before the oil embargo brings Saddam Hussein to his knees.

The logic of the position adopted by those opposed to allied military action in any circumstances is that they favour a policy of mass starvation of the Iraqi nation, and the hostages being held by Iraq, and ultimately, if that policy were to fail, there would be an ignominious withdrawal by the allies. That would leave Saddam Hussein as the victor, the conqueror of Kuwait, possessed of weapons of mass destruction posing a constant and immediate threat to Saudi Arabia and all the Gulf states. That would be a catastrophe of enormous proportions which would leave Iraq's Arab neighbours and Israel at the mercy of a monster who has chemical weapons at his disposal that he has repeatedly used against combatants and non- combatants alike in the Iran-Iraq war, and even against his own civilian population in Iraqi Kurdistan.

Today, Iraq possesses not only chemical weapons, but biological ones, together with the means of dispensing them by air, by multiple rocket launchers, with Frog and Scud missiles. The Scud missiles have been modified by the Iraqis to give them a range of 600 km and they now hold the entire population of Israel under threat. It will not be long before Iraq acquires nuclear weapons, which it has been working to secure for more than a decade.

If there is to be peace and stability in this part of the middle east, Kuwait must be liberated, Iraq deprived of its weapons of mass destruction and Saddam Hussein defeated. That will almost certainly require military action. By taking the initiative, the allies will drastically reduce the casualties to our own forces, as well as limit the suffering and loss of life among the Iraqi population that would result from a prolonged siege.

Britain's prompt deployment of Royal naval ships and Royal Air Force squadrons to the Gulf was an entirely appropriate response to deter the invasion of Saudi Arabia and enforce a naval blockade. Mr. Flannery rose --

Mr. Churchill : I am sorry, but I shall not give way.

The confrontation in the Gulf is now moving into a new phase, with more than 100,000 United States forces so far deployed. If Kuwait is to be liberated, Britain must play her part on the ground as well as in the air and at sea. The time has come to deploy to the Gulf ground forces with elements of 5 Airborne Brigade, 3 Royal Marine commando brigade and armoured forces. It is becoming urgent for a unified allied military command to be established under a United States supreme allied commander. That must be a structure in which Britain, as well as Saudi Arabia, plays its part.

We have full confidence in our armed forces ; there are none finer in the world. We know that they will acquit themselves with distinction if they are called upon to engage the enemy. As a precursor to the liberation of Kuwait, if our own and allied casualites are to be kept to a minimum, which is of the essence, the allies must not shirk from making a pre-emptive strike, if need be, to take out Iraq's air force, missiles and weapons of mass destruction. Thereafter, the Iraqi army, the fifth largest in the world, will be at the mercy of the high-tech weapons deployed by the allies. The crews of Iraq's 5,000 tanks will be running for all they are worth to escape their fiery coffins.

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Let there be no doubt that time is running out for Saddam Hussein. Let the message go out from this House today that if Her Majesty's Government and the Government of the United States decide on military action to resolve the crisis, they can count on the full- hearted support of the House and the nation.

1.29 pm

Mr. David Young (Bolton, South-East) : There is little divergence of view in the House about the action that has so far been taken. But there are no winners in war. While war might eventually happen, we must give sanctions a chance and try to see that diplomacy and sanctions create the result that we want to achieve.

There is no anti-Americanism in asking that militarily we proceed under the rule of the United Nations. If a pre-emptive strike allowed it to be argued that America had used an international force to secure national oil interests, that would be the death of the United Nations for the foreseeable future.

The Arabs represent the key to achieving a solution. The average Arab sees America as the country that could have brought the Israeli Government to the conference table and, that opportunity having been ignored, he then watched on his television the smashing of the limbs of prisoners held by the Israelis.

We seek the removal of Saddam Hussein's troops from Kuwait without conditions being applied to that withdrawal. The settlement thereby achieved must represent the backcloth to future peace throughout the middle east, with countries of Arab and other nationalities conforming to the same rule of law. We are seeking not simply to put down one dictator but to preserve everlasting peace in an area in which war may come to the people not only of that area but of the whole world.

I beg that the refugees in Jordan are seen as people whose only fault was to be in the wrong place at the wrong time. The whole world must help to resolve their plight.

I have constituents who are relations of people held in Iraq. They do not want to hear threats about bringing dictators to trial. That does not make them feel that their relations, who might have to give evidence, will be safe. They appreciate that the blackmail that Saddam Hussein is attempting to inflict cannot determine British policy. But the refugees are our people and we must seek not only to get them all returned but give active Government support financially to the relations here. For example, a constituent of mine had her quarterly telephone bill doubled when her husband was mising for just 10 days. Such people require Government as well as voluntary support.

I shall support the steps that are being taken so long as we proceed under the aegis of the United Nations. In saying that, I believe that I speak for hon. Members in all parts of the House.

Mr. Speaker : I call Mr. Gerald Kaufman.

Miss Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) : On a point of order, Mr. Speaker. I appreciate very much your difficulty in balancing the debate and in calling speakers. However, it is important to point out that men make wars and that women bear the consequences. Not one women Member from any party has been called--

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