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House of Commons
Tuesday 11 June 1991
The House met at half-past Two o'clock
PRAYERS
[Mr. Speaker-- in the Chair ]
Oral Answers to Questions
EMPLOYMENT
Labour Statistics
1. Mr. Martyn Jones : To ask the Secretary of State for Employment if he will make a statement about the current level of unemployment.
The Secretary of State for Employment (Mr. Michael Howard) : Unemployment in the United Kingdom, measured on the consistent seasonally adjusted series, was 2,175,000 in April 1991. It remains the case that there are now 1.3 million more jobs in Britain than in 1979 and over 3 million more jobs than in 1983. Job prospects will again improve following the resumption of economic growth.
Mr. Jones : The Minister's statement will not offer any hope to the quarter more people in my constituency who have become unemployed since last year. Does he agree with the Chancellor of the Exchequer that such levels of unemployment are a price well worth paying for the faint or, should I say, vague signs of recovery that only his right hon. Friend discerns in the economy?
Mr. Howard : The point made by my right hon. Friend the Chancellor was that it is essential to overcome inflation if we are to restore competitiveness to our economy and create the conditions in which jobs can once again grow. If the hon. Gentleman is as concerned about unemployment as he claims to be, will he talk to his colleagues on the Opposition Front Bench and get them to abandon their job destruction package, which will destroy so many jobs in Britain?
Mr. Charles Wardle : Would not the greatest threat to jobs be to let inflation go unchecked or to impose a national minimum wage or, worse still, to do both? Is not that precisely what would result from the wild promises made repeatedly by the Opposition?
Mr. Howard : My hon. Friend is absolutely right. The Opposition cling to that absurd policy which is denounced on both sides of the House and which would undoubtedly destroy jobs on a devastating scale ; yet they claim to be concerned about the fate of the unemployed.
Mr. Wallace : With an estimated 5,500 compulsory or voluntary liquidations in the first quarter of this year in England and Wales, can the Secretary of State give us some idea how many jobs have been lost in small businesses this year? As banks are allegedly charging
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interest rates well above the base rate, what advice does the Minister with responsibility for small businesses give to the banks?Mr. Howard : The hon. Gentleman will recognise that one would need to take net figures for job creation if one were considering small businesses separately. The latest figures that we have show that during last year over 800 more businesses a week were starting up than were going out of business. It is typical of Opposition Members that they are keen to talk about businesses closing down, but they consistently fail to recognise the new businesses that are starting up and being created every day in Britain.
Mr. Ian Bruce : Does my right hon. and learned Friend agree that the minimum wages policy which exists, perhaps in name only, throughout the European Community and America is allowed to exist only because the levels of wages under it are so low and that the entry of the East Germans, whose attempt to raise wages artificially has created enormous unemployment, shows that if the Opposition were to try to impose their policy it would undoubtedly create enormous unemployment and dislocation in the labour market?
Mr. Howard : I hope that my hon. Friend will forgive me if I take this opportunity of correcting a fabrication that is being put about by the Opposition. It certainly is not the case that a statutory minimum wage exists within the EC. That is far from the truth. A statutory minimum wage exists in only four countries in the Community. In those countries, the points made by my hon. Friend are absolutely right : the minimum wage is honoured more in the breach than in the observance. If Labour Members are interested in reducing unemployment, they would do well to recognise that in socialist France and Spain, which have a statutory minimum wage policy, unemployment is far higher than in this country.
Mr. Blair : Will the Secretary of State confirm that this country has not only the fastest rising unemployment of any nation in Europe and in the western world, but falling output and investment and it is also cutting training for the unemployed? When will that unique combination of economic failure and political indifference end? When will the Government start to restore the training budget for the unemployed by introducing the work experience programme that they need and taking responsibility for the unemployment that they are creating?
Mr. Howard : The hon. Gentleman knows that only a short time ago I announced an increase of £120 million in resources for employment training. It is beyond dispute--the hon. Gentleman consistently fails to face up to this--that had Labour been in office over the past few years, unemployment would be much higher than it is today. Were Labour to gain office again in the future, unemployment would be very much higher than it is today. That is why the British people will never make the mistake of electing Labour to government.
Mr. David Martin : Is my right hon. and learned Friend aware that employment in Portsmouth is much better than it was at the time of the last general election and that the policies of private enterprise are the best to carry forward employment prospects? Will my right hon. and learned Friend keep emphasising that Labour's job-destroying
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policies are the last thing that the people of Portsmouth want and that every previous Labour Government have left office with higher unemployment than they inherited?Mr. Howard : I agree entirely with my hon. Friend. It is true that every Labour Government has left behind higher unemployment than when they took office. My hon. Friend's comments about the fall in unemployment in Portsmouth since the last general election apply across the whole country. [Interruption.]
Several Hon. Members rose--
Mr. Speaker : Order. Let us move into calmer waters.
Rotherham TEC
2. Mr. Hardy : To ask the Secretary of State for Employment how many people were employed in training agencies and how many were engaged in full-time courses on 1 February in the area served by Rotherham training and enterprise councils ; how many people are now so employed ; and what is the change in the number of full-time training places since February.
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Employment (Mr. Robert Jackson) : On 1 February 1991, there were 2,977 people in training in the area served by Rotherham training and enterprise council. On 30 April 1991, there were 2,392 people in training. The number of people employed by training providers is a matter for the providers themselves.
Mr. Hardy : A moment, ago the Secretary of State used the word "devastating". Does the Minister accept that areas that have been economically devastated during the past decade, such as South Yorkshire, should benefit from improved and more meaningful training, rather than suffer the cuts and curbs that have been inflicted on them in recent months? Does the Minister accept that we must prepare for the day when we have an intelligent Government who will encourage and revive industrial investment?
Mr. Jackson : I agree with the hon. Gentleman that we must do everything that we can to help unemployed people. That may involve training, but also other measures, such as helping them to find work through building their confidence and motivation, and so on. The Government are providing a wide range of opportunities, which are leading to 100,000 people being placed in work every month.
Training Credits
3. Mr. Hind : To ask the Secretary of State for Employment if he will make a statement on the measures that he has taken to implement his proposals for training credits for 16 to 19-year-olds.
Mr. Howard : The first 11 pilot schemes started in April and are offering training credits to around 45,000 young people--about 10 per cent. of the 16 and 17-year-olds leaving full-time education this year. The White Paper presented to the House on 20 May set out our aim that within the lifetime of the next Parliament, every 16 and 17-year-old leaving full-time education will have the offer
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of a place on a training scheme. I shall shortly be issuing a prospectus inviting bids from TECs to run a second round of schemes to operate from April 1993.Mr. Hind : When my right hon. and learned Friend visits west Lancashire and Skelmersdale on Friday, will he point out to the employers whom he will meet that unemployment in west Lancashire is 37.5 per cent. lower than it was at the last general election? Will he point out also the advantages of his training credit scheme, the flexibility that it offers 16 and 17-year-olds, and the overall improvement in skills that it will offer to the work force in my constituency and in the north-west of England?
Mr. Howard : I look forward greatly to visiting my hon. Friend's constituency on Friday. I shall certainly take the opportunity of drawing the attention of employers there to everything that he said--although I expect them to know all about it already, as they are probably far too sensible to be taken in by the constant misrepresentations of the Labour party.
Mr. Madden : Will the Secretary of State visit Bradford, which suffers from soaring unemployment and has been known for years as "low-pay city"? Will he take my advice and refrain from lecturing the unemployed about the inequities of the minimum wage? What they would like is an explanation of why the right hon. and learned Gentleman has cut the city's training budget by £2 million, why training workshops stand idle and why training providers have been made redundant. That is what the unemployed want to hear ; they do not want third-rate lectures about the minimum wage.
Mr. Howard : I have paid many enjoyable visits to Bradford in the past and look forward to visiting it again soon. Bradford has a particularly effective training and enterprise council, which is addressing its training needs in a particularly effective way. I hope that the hon. Gentleman will want to associate himself fully with its excellent work.
Mrs. Currie : Is my right hon. and learned Friend aware that this year nearly 60 per cent. of 16-year-olds are staying on at school or going to college, which is what they should be doing if we are to catch up with our international competitors? For the minority of youngsters who still leave school at the earliest possible opportunity, my right hon. and learned Friend's training credits proposals are flexible and sensible and will enable those young people to make proper choices about the training that they take up.
Mr. Howard : I am grateful to my hon. Friend for her support. I entirely agree with her comments.
The training credits scheme--which is a world first for this country-- epitomises the difference between the Government and the Labour party. We believe in giving young people opportunities and placing buying power in their hands ; Labour believes in the dead hand of compulsion and that is the only policy that it has to offer.
Disabled People
4. Mr. Ashley : To ask the Secretary of State for Employment what are the latest steps that he has taken to improve the employment prospects of disabled people.
Mr. Jackson : My Department has continued to develop the wide range of mainstream and specialist services that
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can help people with disabilities to get and keep employment. From this April, we have given unemployed people with disabilities priority access to four of our main employment and training programmes. In April, we also announced changes to improve the effectiveness of our specialist disability services and our local and national advisory bodies.Mr. Ashley : Notwithstanding those steps, is the Minister aware that disabled people suffer from serious discrimination in the jobs market, although they are entitled to the same protection under the law as has been enjoyed by ethnic minorities and women for the past 15 years? The United States has introduced wide-ranging and effective anti-discrimination legislation ; when will we follow suit?
Mr. Jackson : We have attempted to deal with that problem through, for example, the quota system, which has been in place for some 40 years but has not proved particularly effective.
The Department does not believe that the introduction of the legislation described by the right hon. Gentleman would be effective in combating discrimination, but we are doing a great deal to help people with disabilities. In 1989-90, the most recent year for which we have all the figures, about £400 million was spent to assist people with disabilities. That is a considerable increase on the spending of past years.
Mr. Hannam : I congratulate my hon. Friend on the increased opportunities that are being given to training and enterprise councils for training the disabled. Is he aware that the main colleges that train people with disabilities for industry--colleges such as St. Loyes in Exeter--rely increasingly on TECs to provide the necessary input? Will he give his full support to the pilot scheme that has enabled some regional TECs to come together to ensure that that input is provided?
Mr. Jackson : My hon. Friend is absolutely right. It is very important for TECs and colleges--and, indeed, others representing the interests of disabled people--to work closely together. It is interesting that 11 per cent. of the total spend on employment training carried out by the TECs goes to people with disabilities.
Mr. Irvine : Can my hon. Friend confirm that nowadays every disabled 16 and 17-year-old youngster has an opportunity to take up a training place ? Can he also confirm that such opportunities were not available to disabled youngsters when Labour was last in power ?
Mr. Jackson : My hon. Friend is absolutely right. Disabled young people in the age group to which he referred benefit from the youth training guarantee, which was not available when the Labour party was in office. Furthermore, youth training was not available then, either. Only 6,000 young people had training places in 1979, compared with hundreds of thousands today.
Labour Statistics
5. Mr. Ron Brown : To ask the Secretary of State for Employment how many people under the age of 25 years are currently unemployed ; and if he will make a statement.
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Employment (Mr. Eric Forth) : In April 1991 there wer
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662,078 unemployed claimants under 25. That compares with 1,025,939 in April 1987 and 1,286,182 in January 1985. Latest comparable figures from the European Commission show that United Kingdom unemployment among the under-25s, at 12.3 per cent., is lower than the European Community average of 16.4 per cent.Mr. Brown : Is not it true these days that many young people leave school with no job, no hope and no future ? The reasons are obvious. In my constituency, for example, Ferranti is closing Bellesk house, Ranks Hovis McDougall is closing the Caledonia mills, and SAI, under Government pressure, is closing its fertiliser plant. That is a disgrace. Would not it be more appropriate if the Government got on their bike and allowed a socialist Government to take over ? That is what is being demanded from outside.
Mr. Forth : I shall leave the hon. Gentleman to decide whether a socialist Government is on offer to the country. He may wish to discuss that with his hon. Friends.
The hon. Gentleman mentioned his constituency ; he would want me to remind the House that when he was last elected, in 1987, 6,635 people were out of work there. He will rejoice with me that today only 4,300 people are out of work in his constituency. I hope that the hon. Gentleman will join me in celebrating that fact and that instead of coming to the House and running his constituency down he will come here with tales of how successful the employers in his constituency can be and say that he will help them to continue that success.
Sir Robert McCrindle : As white-collar unemployment, not least among the under-25s, appears to be rising, arguably faster than unemployment in other sectors of the economy, will my hon. Friend reconsider some of the training programmes and initiatives--especially, perhaps, some of the advertising by his Department to aid the jobless? There are clear signs that the advertisements seem rather more clearly directed at those seeking jobs in manufacturing industry, whereas the fastest rise in unemployment is in evidence in the service sector, not least in London and the south-east.
Mr. Forth : I regret that my hon. Friend has got that impression. We have tried to take great care to ensure that advertising by the Department covers the full spread of activities. The answer to my hon. Friend's reasonable request is that the network of training and enterprise councils is almost complete throughout the land and that we are giving TECs the flexibility to identify local training needs in their communities and to tailor training programmes appropriately. Both the Secretary of State and the Department give that aspect great emphasis and my recent contact with TECs has given me enormous confidence that they can deliver a sensitively tailored local package of training for each area. I hope that the TEC in my hon. Friend's area is doing the same--I am sure that it is.
Mr. McLeish : Why do young people continue to bear the brunt of the Government's incompetence and mismanagement of the economy? Will the Minister tell the House why in the rest of Europe unemployment among the under-25s has been rising at 1 per cent. over the past year, whereas in Britain there has been a spectacular 32 per cent. increase? Will the party of mass unemployment tell us
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now when it will take that issue seriously, or does it once again agree with the Chancellor of the Exchequer, who said that unemployment was a price well worth paying?Mr. Forth : Let us take as an agreed starting point the figure that I gave in my original answer, which was that unemployment among the under- 25s in this country is 12.3 per cent. I must tell the hon. Gentleman that, so far from having 12.3 per cent., socialist Spain--a country with which he will no doubt feel an affinity--has 29.9 per cent. unemployment among the under-25s. In Italy, which was run by a coalition Government when I last looked, the figure is 29.4 per cent. In France, a country often cited by the Opposition--at least when it suits them--the figure is 18.7 per cent. Our record may not be perfect, but the record of the continental countries is a jolly sight worse.
Mr. Rowe : My hon. Friend is far too young to remember what it was like when there was last a Labour Government, but can he remind us from his records what was the usual practice for the majority of 16 and 17-year-olds when the previous Labour Government were in power and what is now on offer for them?
Mr. Forth : My hon. Friend makes a very good point. I am glad that he reminded me of what happened under the last Labour
Government--although I shall have to take his word for it, for reasons that he gave. The Labour Government abandoned young people to the dole queue, whereas this Government have introduced positive and imaginative schemes to ensure that no 16, 17 and 18-year-old need be unemployed except from his own choice. That shows more clearly than anything the difference between this Government and the Opposition in terms of attitudes and policies.
Training Places
6. Mr. Win Griffiths : To ask the Secretary of State for Employment how many training places are available under (a) training and enterprise councils, (b) other Government programmes and (c) local authority programmes ; and how many were available under Government and local authority programmes in 1989 and 1990 in the United Kingdom.
Mr. Howard : The information is not available in the form requested. In March 1991, 547,000 people were in training provided through TECs and local enterprise companies. The corresponding figures for March 1990 and March 1989 were 554,000 and 553,000 respectively.
Mr. Griffiths : I am sorry that the Minister cannot give me the information in the form in which I requested it. Nevertheless, his reply shows that there has been a reduction in training places. Has there been a massive reduction in TEC-provided training places for the disabled? That has certainly happened with Mid Glamorgan TEC and I have the impression that the disabled have generally been forgotten by the TECs.
Mr. Howard : I assure the hon. Gentleman that that is not the case. I suspect that he may be confusing training providers with those who benefit from training. It is true that there have been particular difficulties in Mid Glamorgan, arising from the fact that many voluntary providers of training places have failed to achieve
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approved training organisation status, but I assure the hon. Gentleman that the needs of the disabled are fully taken into account by the TECs.Mr. Paice : Does my right hon. and learned Friend agree that one of the most important questions to be taken into account in considering training places is the number of people available for them? Is not it true that we face a substantial decline in the number of young people of school- leaving age and just above, added to which there has been a welcome but substantial increase in the number of young people staying on at school and undertaking further education, and that that is a perfectly understandable reason why there should be less need to have so many training places available for people in that age group?
Mr. Howard : My hon. Friend is absolutely right. We maintain a guarantee of a youth training place to every young school leaver aged 16 or 17 who is unemployed and we shall continue to honour that guarantee.
Mr. Leighton : Can the Secretary of State tell us the name of a single chairman of a training and enterprise council or of a single member of a TEC board who supports the cuts that he made in his Department's training budget? At a time when trainers are being made redundant right across the country, why is he sabotaging the TEC movement?
Mr. Howard : The hon. Gentleman knows very well that the TEC movement is going from strength to strength and is far from being sabotaged. Members of TEC boards would take the hon. Gentleman's criticisms very ill indeed. He knows, as Chairman of the Employment Select Committee, that, as a result of surveys that we carried out, we carefully considered the provision needed. We have adjusted the balance of training places and other provision, and this year we are providing up to 100,000 extra opportunities for unemployed people in job clubs and under the job interview guarantee scheme.
Mr. Batiste : When evaluating the more than 500,000 training places that are available today, will my right hon. and learned Friend recall how many such training places were available in 1979 under the Labour Government ?
Mr. Howard : I can give my hon. Friend the figures. When the Labour party left office in 1979, 6,000 young people were receiving training ; the comparable figure today is 350,000
Disabled People
7. Mr. Tom Clarke : To ask the Secretary of State for Employment what steps are being taken by his Department to encourage training initiatives for people with disabilities.
Mr. Howard : Training and enterprise councils and local enterprise companies in Scotland are required to set out in their business plans how they intend to provide training for people with special needs, including those with disabilities. These plans form the basis of their contract. From April this year, people with disabilities are being given higher priority than before by being included in the aim group for employment training.
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Mr. Clarke : Will the Secretary of State meet the Royal Association for Disability and Rehabilitation, which will provide him with concrete evidence of how young disabled people are being denied their training rights? Will he inform the training and enterprise councils that they have a contractual responsibility to deal with these matters, and that they should meet it ? Will he discourage his ministerial colleague from complaining about the quota system as Departments have an appalling record, and his own is no exception ?Mr. Howard : I will not answer the last part of the hon. Gentleman's question because the Government's position on the quota was explained fully a few moments ago by my hon. Friend the Under-Secretary of State. My hon. Friend or I would be happy to meet the organisation to which the hon. Gentleman referred. We are happy to discuss these matters with it, and I can confirm that training and enterprise councils are contractually bound to make available training places for people with special needs, including people with disabilities.
Mr. Bill Walker : Will my right hon. and learned Friend confirm that the Government introduced the legislation that ensures that all 16 and 17- year-olds, including disabled youngsters, are entitled to training, and that that legislation did not exist under the Labour Government? It is humbug to pretend otherwise.
Mr. Howard : My hon. Friend is right. There was no guarantee for young people, disabled or otherwise, when the Labour party was in office. It is no use Opposition Members parroting from sedentary positions matters relating to unemployment at that time, because we know very well that Ministers in the previous Labour Government wanted to introduce schemes such as we have introduced but did not have the resources to do so because of the abject failure of their economic policy.
Labour Statistics
9. Miss Lestor : To ask the Secretary of State for Employment if he will give the unemployment figures for Eccles for (a) April 1990 and (b) April 1991.
Mr. Jackson : On the unadjusted basis, there were 3,609 unemployed claimants in the Eccles parliamentary constituency in April 1991, compared with 2,919 in April 1990.
Miss Lestor : May I remind the Minister that every time the Government change the method by which they calculate unemployment and knock hundreds of people off the register, it does not alter the reality that the people who have been knocked off the register are still unemployed? Furthermore, will he recognise that we do not have a minimum wage in Eccles, in the travel-to-work area of Salford or in the north-west, but we have a growing number of unemployed people, particularly among those under 25? Does he think that that is more likely to be explained by a lack of investment and a lack of training than by anything else?
Mr. Jackson : As the hon. Lady referred to the minimum wage, she must say whether it would help to improve employment prospects in Eccles.
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Equal Pay 10. Mr. Ashton : To ask the Secretary of State for Employment how many women now have equal pay with men.
Mr. Jackson : The information is not available. Between 1970 and 1990 the differential between men's and women's full-time average hourly earnings narrowed significantly. This demonstrates that the labour market, reinforced by equal pay legislation, is working to the advantage of women.
Mr. Ashton : Is the Minister aware that when Labour introduced equal pay legislation in 1974, every Tory said that it would cost 1 million women's jobs and that it would decimate the retail industry and catering? It did not. Is he aware that the minimum wage of £3.40 an hour proposed by Labour would not either? McDonald's would sell just as many hamburgers after the minimum wage is introduced as it does now. The only difference would be that McDonald's employees would receive a damned good pay rise, but there would be the same number of jobs.
Mr. Jackson : I am sure that the progress that has been made towards equal pay for men and women has occurred because of the operation of the labour market and of demographics rather than legislative intervention. Intervention in the form of a minimum wage as proposed by the hon. Gentleman would certainly reduce the availability of jobs, which would be especially damaging to the interests of women and of disabled workers.
Miss Emma Nicholson : Does the Minister recognise that women do not wish to be patronised by the Labour party and that the Labour party's commitment to women and to minimum wage levels would better be demonstrated if it gave women minimal opportunity in the trade union movement?
Mr. Jackson : My hon. Friend is absolutely right.
Mr. Tony Lloyd : Does the Minister agree with the assessment of the Equal Opportunities Commission that our present equal pay laws are a paradise for lawyers, but hell for women? Will the Government continue with their present line of hypocrisy and incompetence when dealing with equal pay? Most of the gains were made in the early days of the equal pay legislation under the previous Labour Government. Do the Government intend to respond positively to the Equal Opportunities Commission's demand for tougher laws on equal pay and if so, will they do so soon?
Mr. Jackson : I have discussed these issues with the Equal Opportunities Commission. It is difficult to find a way around the problem of establishing in law what is equal value for equal pay and of applying it in particular cases. It requires extensive advice from experts, which draws out the proceedings. I must say that we have succeeded in improving the position of women workers. We have the second highest proportion of women at work in the European Community and there are more women working in Britain--about 12 million--than in any other country in the European Community. That suggests that we have been doing a good job for women.
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Education and Training
11. Mr. Arbuthnot : To ask the Secretary of State for Employment what representations he has received on the White Paper "Education and Training for the 21st Century" ; and if he will make a statement.
Mr. Howard : The White Paper has had a very positive reception. Training and enterprise councils and local education authorities have welcomed our proposals and are keen to contribute to the delivery of education and the development of their responsibilities in this area.
My Department is making rapid progress in implementing those of the White Paper's proposals for which we are responsible. I shall be sending a prospectus to TECs next week inviting bids to run the 1993 training credit schemes. A prospectus inviting bids for new compacts will follow. Progress is also being made in taking forward partnerships between TECs and LEAs for supervising the careers service.
Mr. Arbuthnot : Is not it correct that training credits will give our young people choice and incentives in training rather than the incentive to stay on the dole offered by the Opposition? The Opposition's policies would reduce the number of jobs, reduce choice and reduce the incentives to train.
Mr. Howard : My hon. Friend is absolutely right. He is clear about the difference between the parties on that subject. I wish that the same could be said for the hon. Member for Sedgefield (Mr. Blair) who, when questioning me on the White Paper, said that he would see how the training credits progressed, although he knew perfectly well that training credits were entirely inconsistent with the policy of compulsion pursued by the Opposition.
Mr. Fatchett : Is not it clear that despite the very expensive public relations launch of the White Paper, it contained no figures on the cost of introducing the measures proposed? Does not that make it clear that the Government, who have already made cuts in training at a time of rising unemployment, have neither the political nor the economic will to ensure that this country secures the best educated and best trained work force in western Europe? The Government need to consider not their White Paper, but their record. If trainers do that, they will realise that they have no future to look forward to.
Mr. Howard : The hon. Gentleman could not be more wrong. When the White Paper was introduced, I gave the additional cost of the training credit proposal--of £14 million and £35 million--in the first two years of its operation. The hon. Gentleman simply does not know what he is talking about. I had hoped that he would rise to clarify the confusion that exists in the mind of his hon. Friend the Member for Sedgefield (Mr. Blair) on these matters.
Mr. Simon Coombs : Does my right hon. and learned Friend agree that those who opposed the technical and vocational education initiative, who fought against youth training and who opposed the introduction of the youth training scheme are utterly discredited on any question of education and training? Will he give the Labour party one last chance to come into the 20th century and to recognise the contribution that all those schemes have made to training for young people?
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Mr. Howard : I am not optimistic that the Labour party would take that opportunity. The Labour party has opposed tooth and nail every training initiative that the Government have introduced over the past 12 years. Labour has no credentials to talk about training.
Labour Statistics
12. Mr. Haynes : To ask the Secretary of State for Employment if he will list the unemployment figures for 1979-80 and 1989-90.
Mr. Howard : On the consistent seasonally adjusted basis, United Kingdom unemployment averaged 1,072,500 in the financial year 1979-80 compared with 1,702,200 in 1989-90.
Mr. Haynes : Does not the Secretary of State feel ashamed of himself? Is he aware that a Secretary of State not far from him is on his way, according to the newspapers? The whole House will agree that it is time he went.
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