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years ago, ICI opened in Taiwan its largest single overseas investment. Other major British companies such as Glaxo already have huge investments there.In the commercial world, we find that business men look at the whole Chinese situation, not merely one small part of it. The time has come for our Foreign Office and the Government to reconsider the matter and to realise that changes must be made in the way in which we handle Taiwan.
8.31 pm
Mr. Michael Colvin (Romsey and Waterside): It is a pleasure to follow my hon. Friend the Member for Corby (Mr. Powell), who is chairman of the British-Taiwan group. Perhaps we should say, the Republic of China on Taiwan, because that is what it really is. He is so right to draw attention to the importance of the Pacific rim, and to the way in which Taiwan is leading growth in that region. It is significant that growth in that region still increased during the world recession that we have just been through. As a measure of economic activity, civil aviation is a good guide, and civil airlines of the far east and Pacific rim were still showing enormous growth in traffic when the rest of the world was in recession.
I was interested to hear the comments of my hon. Friend the Member for Harrow, East (Mr. Dykes), who is chairman of the British-China group. He follows the late Robert Adley, a distinguished chairman, who was an expert on China. I dare say that his interest in China may have originated from an interest in its trains. It is still one of the countries laying down considerable lengths of track. That is fairly unique and shows the way in which the economy of the People's Republic of China is growing.
Part of the object of all-party groups is to build up a better understanding of the countries with which we are twinned. It would be worth while putting on record our debt of gratitude to Jung Chang, the author of that memorable and unique book "Wild Swans". If ever one wants to get a picture of China's chaotic political past over three generations, that is the book to read. I am sorry that it has not been mentioned this evening.
I was interested in what my right hon. Friend the Member for Brent, North (Sir R. Boyson) said. He has been the only person to mention the through- train concept, which was worth following. I am sorry that it has been dropped. It is important to safeguard the system that we want to see established in Hong Kong to the year 2047 and beyond, and the through-train concept was likely to ensure that that was done. When I was preparing my notes for this debate, I realised that I was sitting just below a print of the East India Company ships that helped to build Hong Kong into one of the world's greatest trading centres. The picture was published in 1843, the year in which the first Governor of Hong Kong took office--the right hon. Sir Henry Pottinger. I want to recall some appropriate words of the present and, I hope, last Governor of Hong Kong, Chris Patten. I pay tribute to the work that he has done as Governor of Hong Kong. I applaud his energy, dedication and what he has delivered.
The hon. Member for Rotherham (Mr. MacShane) made an interesting speech. He struck a sour note, but he did the debate a service because he reminded us of
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China's problems, of the need to understand that country better, and of its human rights record, which we should never forget. He said that Mr. Patten was a prisoner of Conservative philosophy. I dug out a slim volume written by Chris Patten in 1982-83, called "The Tory Case". It may be slim, but it contains some weighty words. On the subject of principles of the Conservative party, he said that three strands of thought"have run through the history of the Party. First, there was opposition to systems, to political blue-prints and to utopianism . . . Secondly, there was the defence of property and order and an organic view of society. Thirdly, there was an unashamed patriotism, a defence of Crown and of country".
Chris Patten has applied those principles to his job as Governor, and he has done well.
The first of those principles is especially important in relation to Hong Kong. It is the opposition to systems. We have heard repeatedly this afternoon that Hong Kong's future is based on the slogan, "one country, two systems", but the free enterprise culture that has so characterised Hong Kong is much more than a system; it is a total way of life unencumbered by rigid constitutional rules or dogma. It is unlike the People's Republic of China, where communism still rules--never let us forget that.
I hope that the marriage of two systems will be no less dramatic than that between old imperial Britain and the Hong Kong Chinese more than 150 years ago. That new marriage has the potential to create the same hybrid vigour that will ensure that Hong Kong continues to prosper in the years to come. That will happen because no doubt exists that the People's Republic of China is changing fast. The world circumstances in which responsibility for Hong Kong will pass to the People's Republic of China on 1 July 1997 will be different from those that prevailed when the Sino-British joint declaration on Hong Kong's future was signed in 1984 or, for that matter, when Chris Patten wrote his book in 1982-83. The world has undergone a fundamental political change with the collapse of communism in eastern Europe. The People's Republic of China was a key player in bringing that about and deserves credit for it. I ask the House to think back to April 1985, when Mikhail Gorbachev first launched his ideas on perestroika. That was never going to work unless it was coupled with glasnost--perestroika meaning "reform", glasnost meaning "the open door". Immense pressures were being brought to bear on the Soviet Union at the time--pressures involving not only military matters such as the arms race, but satellite dish and international communications. People in the Soviet Union were beginning to be able to see what life was like the other side of the iron curtain. He found those pressures impossible to resist and the economy was beginning to crumble anyway. He needed perestroika and, therefore, an open door so that he could begin to communicate with the west.
No one opens his front door without ensuring that his back door is safe, and the Soviet Union's back door stretched all the way from Afghanistan to Vladivostok--3,500 miles, with Chinese all the way. It is greatly to the credit of the People's Republic of China and its leadership that it held a summit meeting, the first for 20 years, at which agreement was reached with Gorbachev to ensure that his back door was safe should he decide to open his
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front door. We should not forget the role that the Chinese played in promoting glasnost and reform and therefore helping to trigger the collapse of communism all over the world, although not in their own People's Republic.Once the process of reform in the former Soviet Union had begun, the dominoes began to fall everywhere else. The mistake that the Soviet Union and so many of the other countries in eastern Europe made was to rush for political reform, setting up new political democratic structures without first establishing the free market economies essential if those new administrations were to succeed and be sustained in the longer term.
The People's Republic of China recognised the impending chaos, and was far more cautious. The Chinese were determined to see the free market economic structure well in being before they would ever start thinking about changing political structures. The Chinese think long term, and they knew that once the free market was up and running, the political changes that they wanted would almost certainly follow, as night follows day. There is no doubt that that is good for Hong Kong.
Bilateral relations between the United Kingdom and the People's Republic are ever improving. Our relationship with China is now broadly based-- commercial, cultural, and covering political issues, too. Business between our two countries is booming, and we are the largest European investor in China, with new investment last year 50 per cent. higher than it was in 1993. And my right hon. Friend the President of the Board of Trade is to take 100 British business men to China on a trade mission soon.
Our links are not only in business, but are cultural. We have many Chinese students in this country--about 5,000 in all--and that number is growing all the time. That form of cultural diplomacy is probably the best that one can have.
China also shares with the United Kingdom important international responsibilities as a global power, such as our joint membership of the United Nations Security Council. We also look forward to welcoming China as a member of the World Trade Organisation. Those are all good reasons why it is in China's national interests to honour her agreement to the one nation, two systems arrangement in Hong Kong. The fragile business and political confidence there will then be preserved, so that Hong Kong can continue to expand its contribution to China's economy--it produced about 26 per cent. of China's gross domestic product in 1993--to the advantage of all the Chinese people.
There are two territories sitting on the sidelines watching all this with great interest, and with as much anxiety as the people of Hong Kong. The first, Tibet, is concerned about its political autonomy, which we rightly recognise. We hope that China will not only improve its human rights record in that country but give Tibetans a greater say in running their own affairs.
The other territory is Taiwan, the last remaining province of the old Republic of China, which we have just heard about from my hon. Friend the Member for Corby. It has been deprived of its seat at the United Nations and is not now recognised as an independent state, although effectively it operates as one. Taiwan is an important trading partner of the United Kingdom, and 90 per cent. of its investment in Europe comes to Britain. It also sends about 8,000 students here, all young ambassadors for their country. No doubt they are just as ambassadorial in representing us back home.
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Taiwan's economic relationship with China is not unlike Hong Kong's. Just as China can regard 1997 as a step towards national reunification with Hong Kong, the circumstances that might lead to reunification with Taiwan are also beginning to emerge. First, China is changing. Even following a change in China's leadership, I do not think that the People's Liberation Army would let the present impetus towards economic and political reform be lost.Secondly, Taiwan has established democratic structures that seem to be working. Thirdly, its economy is becoming more and more closely linked with that of the People's Republic of China. It is significant that manufacturing has now almost moved out of Taiwan. In Hong Kong, there is now a substantial fall in manufacturing employment and a big increase in service industries, marketing, banking and finance. In Taiwan, which has one of the highest per capita incomes in the world, unit labour costs are 20 times higher than those on the Chinese mainland, and it is hardly surprising that much of its investment in manufacturing now takes place on the mainland.
The stepping stone that Taiwan has hitherto used for its investment in manufacturing in the People's Republic of China--Hong Kong--is being reunited with China, so effectively Taiwan will be dealing directly with China after 1997. If the PRC really wants reunification with Taiwan, it must demonstrate that the one country, two systems arrangement can be made to work in Hong Kong.
If a constructive dialogue between the PRC and Taiwan about reunification begins, would the Government consider granting diplomatic status to the Taipei representative in London? For 40 years, the Republic of China on Taiwan has held out as representing the whole of China, but in 1991 that changed and it established a mainland affairs council to work out policies for reunification, to add a political dimension to what was already beginning to happen, economically.
There have been 14 rounds of talks already on a wide range of issues, political, cultural and economic. The democratic process that has now been established in Taiwan confirms that the Chinese people who live there like what is being done on their behalf by their leaders, which will help to maintain their economic leadership. I was sorry to hear that the Taipei representative in London, Dr. Eugene Chien, was burgled the other night. Although it does not accord him diplomatic status, it might be worth the Foreign Office considering offering him some of the niceties usually afforded to the representatives of other countries here. The police are normally on guard at diplomatic residences, and we ought to consider such facilities for Dr. Chien, who is an important person in the economics and politics of his country and also a vital link between this country and Taiwan.
I have little time for the alarmist rhetoric of some members of LegCo, such as Martin Lee, the chairman of the Democratic party, but I share his concern that after 1997 the rule of law in Hong Kong must be safeguarded, so as to maintain the open and free system that instils and maintains confidence and attracts inward investors. I also agree with him that an independent statutory human rights commission with teeth should be established to enforce the Bill of Rights already in existence. I agree that the Court of Final Appeal must be set up well before 1997,
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according to the requirements set out clearly in the joint declaration and the Basic Law, and not watered down in any way by China.Concerns are also expressed by Christine Loh, another LegCo councillor, about the functions and status of the Chinese Communist party in Hong Kong. If the CCP is just another political party, I know how many seats it is likely to win in future municipal and national elections in Hong Kong. But it is not an ordinary party; it holds supreme power in a totalitarian state. It is important that the CCP realises that its system in China cannot be extended to Hong Kong without the wholehearted consent of the Hong Kong people, which is not likely to be given.
I believe that Hong Kong post-1997 will continue to be a shining example of what free enterprise and the individual freedoms thus engendered are all about. Confidence will be maintained. It is in everybody's interest, not least China's, that it is maintained. I also believe that the unique special administrative region, as it will be known, will be an economic locomotive for the whole of China and, by its example, could well also become a political locomotive. 8.49 pm
Mr. Nigel Waterson (Eastbourne): Several hon. Members have referred to the fact that there are only some 796 days left before Hong Kong is returned to the People's Republic of China. It seems a great shame that at this crossroads in the history of Hong Kong and, indeed of China, despite some bright spots such as
progress--finally--over the airport and over the disposal of the defence estate, we are still seeing far too much megaphone diplomacy between Peking and the Governor of Hong Kong.
I take this opportunity, as other hon. Members have, to pay tribute to the former Member for Bath, Chris Patten, who has been conspicuous in exercising grace under pressure since he became Governor of Hong Kong. Some people are far too glib, especially Hong Kong's business community, which attributes the sort of difficulties that we have seen to his arrival. In fact, historically, they stem not from that moment in history but from the tragic events of Tiananmen square, which, as we have heard, had two distinct effects: one on the leadership in the People's Republic of China and one on the population of Hong Kong, many of whom had never given much thought until then to democratic systems and the like.
There are, let it be said, growing worries in Hong Kong about press freedom, about the status and independence of the judiciary and of civil servants, about the statutes and regulations that need to be dealt with, about the rule of law itself and about the impasse over such matters as container terminal 9. I shall touch on two difficulties over the rule of law: the Court of Final Appeal and the problem of local statute law and regulation.
I have, sadly, come to the conclusion that to protect Hong Kong after the handover in 1997, democracy is simply not enough of a bulwark. Whatever the troubled history of trying to introduce democracy over the years in Hong Kong--there was an attempt, for example, shortly after the second world war --much of what we have done has been too little, too late, despite excellent intentions.
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The Patten proposals are very laudable indeed, albeit fairly small beer by United Kingdom standards, which makes it all the more worrying that they have caused such annoyance in Peking. The business community in Hong Kong, or large sections of it, has little interest in political matters and is antipathetic to what Governor Patten is trying to do. Indeed, even now, although there is growing enthusiasm, voter registration and participation in elections is still somewhat disappointing.So the so-called through train now seems certain to be derailed in 1997, or at least the passengers will be required to disembark and will be subjected to some form of vetting by their new political masters before some of them are permitted to continue their journey. There are fears, of course, that part of that vetting process will involve some kind of loyalty test to the People's Republic. All that is happening despite the fact, whatever arguments there may be about the small print, that the joint declaration clearly envisaged the evolution of Hong Kong's political system, not only up to 1997 but beyond and well into the future. It is all the more surprising perhaps that in recent urban council and regional council elections, there has been a respectable showing for the pro-China Democratic Alliance for the Betterment of Hong Kong. Certainly, it took part with considerable enthusiasm in those elections. I assume that it will do the same in September in the LegCo elections, which will be the last elections under British administration. I suspect, however, that the real preference of the PRC is for the more traditional type of so-called functional constituencies, which, apart from anything else, are somewhat easier to lean on in difficult times.
The only realistic bulwark in favour of Hong Kong, to protect it after 1997, is the rule of law. That is the lasting legacy of this country in Hong Kong. First, it underpins entirely the phenomenal commercial success of Hong Kong, of which we have heard so much this evening. Secondly, it does so much to control corruption. It has always been there, bubbling away under the surface in Hong Kong and at times there have been problems.
The two main aspects of the rule of law, as I said, fall into two distinct categories. First, there is the problem of statutes; the technical side of tidying up thousands of pages of statutes and regulations such as those affecting references to the Crown, to the British Government, matters of property and matters of company law. That may sound very dry and uninteresting to some hon. Members, but those statutes are, in fact, pretty crucial, when one thinks about it, to ensuring the continued success of the free enterprise capitalist system that is Hong Kong. There are also rather more sinister laws and regulations such as those referring to sedition, some of which are throw-backs to colonial days, as other hon. Members have said. It arouses considerable concern--I hope unjustifiably--in some quarters in Hong Kong that the PRC was so very annoyed when some of those old regulations were removed, unilaterally, as it turns out, by the Governor.
The Court of Final Appeal is vital. Other hon. Members have referred to it, and rightly, because it is such a crucial issue. It is difficult to exaggerate its importance in sustaining confidence in Hong Kong up to and beyond 1997. We know that it featured in the original discussions with the Peking Government and that a separate agreement was reached in 1991, which dealt with the constitution of the court. Admittedly, progress was
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delayed when LegCo rejected part of the agreement, limiting the number of non-permanent judges, including overseas judges, who would sit on the court. But support for the agreement in Hong Kong and, indeed, in LegCo has been growing recently, which allowed the Government in Hong Kong in May 1994 to give the Chinese Government the text of a draft Bill designed to put the 1991 agreement into effect.The Peking Government have reiterated their commitment to the 1991 agreement, but despite various technical discussions--we heard from my right hon. Friend the Foreign Secretary that there are to be more shortly-- the Chinese have yet to support the introduction of the Bill into LegCo. It is important that that court is established soon, in good time for the handover to Peking, to give it an opportunity of building up a body of jurisprudence and, indeed, of respect within the Hong Kong community. That would give an enormous boost to confidence in Hong Kong.
One of the dangers that threatens the success of Hong Kong after 1997 is the growth of corruption, eating away from the bottom the success story that has been Hong Kong. I am not talking about the more mundane signs of corruption, but of privilege and
influence--perhaps the growing pressure, when organising joint ventures with the mainland, to include one of the so-called princelings in the arrangements, which is the sort of influence that one sees in certain parts of business in the PRC. That concern, among others, underlines the need for a through train, if not on the democratic reforms, at least for the rule of law.
I would say to the PRC tonight, "What are you worried about? Why be so churlish and seem so intent on hurling abuse at the retreating back of a former colonial power that is leaving voluntarily, peacefully and by agreement in less than 800 days? That power is bequeathing you reserves that are several times the size of those originally promised, not to mention a thriving economy, including a major new airport structure and other infrastructure projects, as well as a sophisticated financial centre." The problems of the Vietnamese refugees have largely been dealt with and we are leaving a stable and well-run Administration.
The concept of one country, two systems, was bold, courageous and novel when it was first announced by Deng Xiaoping. It has far-reaching implications for the PRC's status in international affairs and such matters as the World Trade Organisation and, not least, for its future relationship with Taiwan, as was pointed out by the ever-perceptive, late Mr. Richard Nixon and many hon. Members. It also has the far-reaching implication that the Chinese Government are seen to do the right thing within the one country, two systems principle.
I call on the PRC to put past misunderstandings and mistrusts behind it. It has everything to gain, and a great deal to lose by further obstructionism. It should get on with the task in hand, to which Her Majesty's Government are fully committed--to produce a smooth and efficient handover of that dynamic and successful asset--because, to use the words of Governor Patten,
"Standing still is not an option".
9.1 pm
Lady Olga Maitland (Sutton and Cheam): May I warmly welcome the fact that this debate has taken place today? It is significant that it is the first such debate in
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this Parliament and the fact that so much time has been devoted to it should demonstrate the importance that we attach to it. My knowledge of Hong Kong is relatively new. I flew there last year and it was a memorable experience. The landscape was dramatic. The mountains, surrounded by a soaring forest of dazzlingly designed skyscrapers and high-rise buildings, all descending to the sea, gave a first taste of what I found when I landed. On the ground, I discovered a dynamic and exhilarating community, whose energy is rightly the envy of the world.I arrived last September, as the guest of the Hong Kong Government and accompanied by my husband, to discover for myself at first hand exactly what is going on there. I found it a stimulating, worthwhile and highly illuminating exercise. I had an intensive programme, covering all the principal aspects of the world of business, bankers, shipowners, entrepreneurs, lawyers, academics, politicians, civil servants, and the people themselves. I found a jewel of a territory, with a thriving economy which, in just 796 days, will be in the full possession of China.
Logic would suggest that the Chinese Government would be delighted at getting such an asset, which will arrive with reserves at an unprecedented level of $HK151 billion. That is way ahead of the original estimate of $HK25 billion, and $HK31 billion more than was forecast just a year ago. Add to that the exchange fund of $HK30 billion and the new airport, which will bring handsome dividends--I welcome the news that the financial arrangements have finally been agreed--and the new container terminals, all of which could be considered handsome dowries to secure even greater prosperity. Hong Kong's thriving economy will be a boon to the People's Republic as it will represent 23 per cent. of China's GDP. The colony's real average GDP growth is 7 per cent., twice that of the world's economy as a whole. Some 1,000 British companies operate in Hong Kong, including some enterprising businesses from my own constituency of Sutton. Record profits, low taxation and high reserves make any country envious of Hong Kong.
Why, then, is there such a sour taste in the mouth of the Chinese Government? In truth, it is caused by a cultural gap, which is unlikely to be bridged properly in the short term. We are hindered by the history of old imperialism. The Chinese just do not believe that any colonial power could be so altruistic as to hand over a generous endowment without any strings attached. They believe that they will be landed with a heavy bill at the end, despite all the evidence to the contrary. They do not believe that they are really getting a gift horse. They do not believe that Britain's sole policy is to do what is best for Hong Kong. We have no selfish interest; we see our role there as a duty.
That is why, regrettably, the Governor of Hong Kong, Chris Patten, will most likely be criticised by the Chinese Government until the very moment of his departure. The truth is that whatever plan of action he took would be criticised. If he did nothing to secure the best possible deal in the interests of the people of Hong Kong, he would be labelled a lame duck. By his taking typically direct action, in his own way--admittedly a somewhat House of Commons style--political mistrust, which has existed for a long time, has now been able to focus on the Governor,
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and he has been made a scapegoat. China has used that as an excuse for dragging its feet and delaying progress on the handover arrangements.The Chinese see democracy, as proposed by Mr. Patten, as a means of thwarting the full exercise of Chinese sovereignty, even though they have agreed to it in principle under the joint declaration. As a result, they have resorted to xenophobia, personal insults and appeals to Han nationalism to encourage rejection of the proposals. They are on weak ground, because they have persistently refused to put forward any alternative proposals, and instead have retreated behind a wall of angry rhetoric.
In fairness to the Governor, it takes two to tango and without one partner, the Chinese, it is difficult to make much progress at all. I agree that we should be positive, approachable and maintain contact at all levels no matter what the provocation. One does, however, need a response. To that end, I am proud that the Governor has not wilted under the pressure from Beijing. He needs broad shoulders to cope with the constant flow of carping criticism and negative positions. He has, however, added to his personal dignity by being scrupulous in not engaging in direct attacks on Chinese tactics.
I resent the utterly unworthy remarks about Chris Patten made by the hon. Members for Motherwell, South (Dr. Bray) and for Rotherham (Mr. MacShane).
Dr. Bray: The hon. Lady would do well to read my speech, because I was explaining the political position in the House of Commons, as we understand it very well, to a highly intelligent public in Hong Kong. I believe that she has got the matter upside down.
Lady Olga Maitland: If I have somewhat misrepresented the hon. Gentleman's comments, I shall withdraw my remark, but I got the impression that his references to the Governor were not worthy. I stand by my assertion that the speech of the hon. Member for Rotherham did not reflect the dignity of the speech of the hon. Member for Livingston (Mr. Cook).
In the end, history will be kinder to the Governor. It is a tribute to Chris Patten that he has sparked an open debate and galvanised opinion in the manner of a democratic society. It may, of course, be true that the quieter, continuing efforts to develop an independent administration for LegCo may be more effective in the long run. However, long after the Governor has left and the proud Union Jack no longer flutters above Government House, the Chinese will realise that he left a territory that is an opportunity for China to build on, not a threat. After all, Hong Kong has been largely created by people who fled from the old China, who desperately want the new China to do well.
Hong Kong is not asking for the moon. It is simply saying, "Hang on; we want to have a say in the running of our own affairs." The people of Hong Kong have a vested interest in ensuring that their society continues free of corruption, with a fair and just legal system--hence the importance, as we have heard today, of the Court of Final Appeal. They want a society free from the fear of the knock on the door by the secret police in the middle of the night, a society with a free press and freedom of speech and political thought. Those are the best guarantors of a prosperous, thriving society.
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Admittedly, different interest groups have different perspectives on the future. I ran into a heavy wall of flak from the business community. Those people bent my ear very hard, individually and in groups. The Hong Kong chamber of commerce had a clear message; its members feared that attempts by the Governor to press forward with a limited democratic programme would cause a backlash from Peking, which would affect their business prospects, although they admitted that there was no evidence that that was happening.Reading through the notes that I took at the time, I read that members of the chamber of commerce claimed that the Governor was "insufficiently flexible--he should co-operate more with Beijing--he should focus more on relations with China because that ultimately is where the future lies."
Perhaps there are touches of truth behind some of the comments about the Governor's style, but there was also an unattractive tinge of self-interest --a case of, "I'm all right, Jack," because the big businesses are doing extremely well in China. In many cases, they have moved all their factories out of Hong Kong into China, and they do not want to rock the boat.
If those business men paused for a moment to consider, they would realise that the tremendous boom and prosperity that has occurred in Hong Kong did not happen by accident, but by ensuring an ordered, corruption-free society, with an effective judicial system which guaranteed the security of their commercial dealings. What of the people left behind? What about the man in the coolie hat with his street stall? How will he fare? Who will report openly and fairly what the ordinary man's fortunes are likely to be?
As a former journalist, I paid a call on the Foreign Correspondents club--a salutary lesson, for the foreign press corps is already beginning to pack its bags in preparation for 1997. Those correspondents have repeatedly learned of Chinese colleagues who have been arrested and disappeared for being too frank with the news. The Peking Government have made it very clear to them that the freedom of speech that they are used to in Hong Kong will not be allowed to continue. They were warned by the New China News Agency that reporting must be "accurate--and objective". In shorthand, it meant, "no criticism".
I therefore welcome the Hong Kong Government's plan for 41 regulations to help maintain that important democratic freedom. In my opinion, that is an urgent priority.
Human rights are important. I am not altogether comfortable with putting all our faith in the Bill of Rights, worthy as it is, introduced after the Tiananmen square massacre. I am not convinced that the Bill of Rights alone would guarantee human rights. It would be bolstered if supported by a human rights commission with teeth. It would give human rights a higher profile with a greater infrastructure around it.
I congratulate many of the brave politicians in Hong Kong on their efforts in that direction. We would be failing ourselves utterly if we were not persistent in our vigilance in that regard. I believe that a firm approach to human rights will not affect our ultimate relations with China, in much the same way as it did not affect our relations with the former Soviet Union when we drew attention to human rights there.
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I shall now discuss the importance of democracy as it has developed. The district election campaigns were going on when I was in Hong Kong. I went out to watch two of the parties, the United Democrats and the Democratic Alliance, canvass for supporters in Kowloon.The Governor was right. The ordinary Hong Kong citizen was interested in political representation. I attended a public meeting at which all the local candidates were present. About 40 sat on wooden benches in a school. It was not so different from meetings in this country. Local issues were discussed such as transport, noise pollution, pensions and so on--the latter being a major topic, for state pensions were unknown before they were introduced by Chris Patten. I accompanied candidates on the doorstep and found that there was polite interest. Not one door was slammed in the face of a candidate.
A local opinion poll showed a high percentage of genuine interest. Some 90 per cent. of the people were aware of the elections in which they could vote. Ultimately, both the district board elections in September 1994 and the elections for the municipal councils in March ended in convincing wins for pro-democracy parties. I expect that this September's elections will produce a similar result and, as befits major elections, will have a higher turnout. A taste for democracy has come and will remain.
The issue of the boat people is outstanding and must be addressed. At present, 21,000 migrants remain in camps waiting to be repatriated--some will go voluntarily, some will not. I made a point of visiting the camps after reports of human rights abuse. The allegations were not borne out, save for the fact that when injuries occurred, it was because fighting had broken out between the inmates.
Some refugees had been in the camps for five years. Children had been born there and knew no other life. I had total freedom to mix and talk to the Vietnamese. I concluded that they were largely economic refugees, not political refugees. The programme of flying them home has now been streamlined. Only yesterday, Wednesday, another 44 departed. Another 17,000, who have been able to prove that they had been victims of political violence, have been granted asylum and are now in the process of being resettled in other countries. I can hardly blame the boat people for initially trying to reach Hong Kong. When people are desperate, they try anything. But it must be said that Vietnam has changed dramatically, not just by the year, but by the month. Economic progress has been enormous, as I discovered when I flew to Vietnam after my visit to Hong Kong. Returning home may be difficult for the migrants, but it will not be nearly as arduous and tough as it was under the former, rigid rule of communism. I therefore support the Hong Kong Government's efforts on repatriation. It would be cruel indeed to leave the refugees to the uncertainties of Chinese control.
Another matter that I came across was that of the 52 or 53 war widows who have been refused full British passports. Their husbands served and died in the British Army. It is hurtful that the Government cannot grant them full British citizenship. They deserve sympathy--a special stamp in their current papers entitling them to come to the United Kingdom is not the real thing and makes them feel like second-class citizens. I understand that their situation needs primary legislation, but is it beyond the realms of possibility to look more positively at their cases? As we
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approach VE day and the spirit of reconciliation, surely that is one case that we should not pigeonhole as being too difficult to tackle. I pay tribute to Jack Edwards, an old prisoner of war, who has fought so hard on their behalf.I conclude with the view that, come 1997, we should feel proud that we have more than honoured our obligations. We shall have strived to the end; I trust that the handover arrangements will be complete--I know that it is a race against time. We shall regretfully have to accept that we have not been able to secure the through train on democracy that we would have hoped, but we shall leave Hong Kong with pride and honour. We also know that by playing fair by Hong Kong we helped to give Hong Kong a chance to contribute its uniqueness to China.
9.18 pm
Mr. Paul Murphy (Torfaen): I am sure that all of us would agree with the hon. Member for Harrow, East (Mr. Dykes) that the standard of debate for the past five or so hours has been high. If the debate is being watched on television in Hong Kong, it will certainly prove that the House of Commons has not lost its reputation as a deliberating Chamber.
The significance of the debate for China was highlighted by the right hon. Members for Mid-Sussex (Mr. Renton), for Old Bexley and Sidcup (Sir E. Heath) and for Guildford (Mr. Howell), and by my hon. Friends the Members for Rotherham (Mr. MacShane) and for Motherwell, South (Dr. Bray). It was fascinating to hear my hon. Friend the Member for Motherwell, South talk about his first speech 32 years ago, when he talked on the subject of Hong Kong.
I accept the point made by the hon. Member for Corby (Mr. Powell) about the position and importance of Taiwan not just in the context of this debate-- clearly, what happens in Hong Kong will be watched very closely by those in Taiwan and in China itself--but because my predecessor in this place, Leo Abse, was one of the first Members of the House of Commons to visit Taiwan and to take an active interest in that country. I am sure that all hon. Members would agree with the hon. Gentleman's comments.
I come to the debate today as my party's spokesman on Northern Ireland and that significant and very important peace process which will dominate the proceedings in the House for the next couple of years. However, the importance of Hong Kong in international as well as British affairs in the next two years cannot be underestimated. In the debate on the Queen's Speech in November last year, the Foreign Secretary referred to Britain's links with Hong Kong--the 3.5 million British passport holders, the 1,000 British companies and the £90 billion in British investment.
But they are not the only links that Britain has with Hong Kong. I suspect that there is hardly a family in Britain which does not have a family or a friendship link with someone who has lived or worked in Hong Kong. Hong Kong is very much a part of our lives. Michael Yahuda, a distinguished academic with a wealth of knowledge in such matters, recently wrote:
"The Hong Kong negotiations constitute, without a doubt, the most important set of bilateral negotiations in which Britain has been engaged since the Falklands War".
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The consequences of any failure in the negotiations in the next two years would be dramatic, not least for the industrious, educated and highly productive Hong Kong people who, in this of all years, we remember withstood four years of Japanese occupation. Another writer, Gerald Segal, wrote last year:"The real Hong Kong crisis will begin in 1995-96, some 12 to 18 months before the date of the official handover, and it might even coincide with the next British election".
Of course, it will coincide with that election.
The hon. Member for Harrow, East made the very telling point that perhaps some of the problems in understanding the matter arise out of the differing attitudes, styles and languages of the Chinese and British negotiators. China viewed Governor Patten's proposal as a U-turn. However, we are given to understand that the two countries' diplomatic styles are very different indeed. China adopts struggle diplomacy and deals in agreements which, to us, seem broad and somewhat vaguely worded. Our tradition favours much greater detail. That is why in my view--I am certain that it is my party's view also--there is no evidence to suggest that Mr. Patten went to Hong Kong seeking a confrontation with the Chinese. I believe that part of the problem derives from the clash of styles and political cultures of the two sides.
The right hon. Member for Guildford chaired the Foreign Affairs Committee and it is important to record our thanks to the Committee for producing a highly instructive and extremely valuable report. It said:
"It is difficult to avoid the conclusion that Britain and China have, throughout all the negotiations since the Joint Declaration was signed in 1984, been looking at its provisions through differently coloured spectacles."
I suspect that there is a great deal of truth in that statement. A number of right hon. and hon. Members referred to the incident at Tiananmen square and the effects of that tragedy. We all viewed it, correctly, as a great blow to democracy. As my hon. Friend the Member for Livingston (Mr. Cook) said, in China the effect was also significant because it deepened suspicions about democracy, which is now seen as a source of instability and a threat to the Chinese regime. It also led to an increased demand for some sort of proper democracy in Hong Kong. I believe that China had agreed initially to some sort of democracy in the territory. That is enshrined in the joint declaration and in the Basic Law. The two Governments committed themselves to effect what they called a
"smooth transfer of Government in 1997".
The Foreign Affairs Committee report described Governor Patten's actions as perfectly legal in international law and said that there was nothing improper or untoward about them.
As my hon. Friend the Member for Motherwell, South and the hon. Members for Harrow, East and for Eastbourne (Mr. Waterson) said, democracy has increased considerably over the past couple of years. In the early days, the people of Hong Kong declined to agitate for greater democracy because, I suspect, they feared the reaction of China and were busy making money, but Tiananmen square changed all that. As the hon. Member for Eastbourne said, they have developed a taste for democracy. Although the recent local government
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elections were not exactly successful in terms of turnout, they were a start. Although the new breed of democratic politicians in Hong Kong have had only about 13 years of experience in democracy and government, they will doubtless wish to continue that experience. It is a great tragedy that the "through train", which has nothing to do with the train to which the hon. Member for Romsey and Waterside (Mr. Colvin) referred, the great Robert Adley or an interest in Chinese trains, will be derailed and democratic institutions may be disbanded after 1997. The "through train" was one of the most important aspects of the original agreement and, if we are to take his view seriously, it is tragic that the Chinese ambassador, in this building yesterday, talked about dismantling all those democratic institutions after 1997.The right hon. Member for Guildford and my hon. Friend the Member for Ilford, South (Mr. Gapes) rightly referred to the role of the Chinese Communist party in Hong Kong after 1997. It is not the same as having just another party in that territory. Are we to see a replication of what has occurred in China, where that country's constitution hardly recognises it even though it is all-powerful in China? We know that the head of the New China News Agency is effectively the head of the Communist party of China in Hong Kong. The Government must deal with that over the next 800 days. What will happen to the Hong Kong civil service? Will civil servants have to pass some sort of loyalty test in order to be employed after 1 July 1997? The right hon. Member for Tweeddale, Ettrick and Lauderdale (Sir D. Steel) and my hon. Friends the Members for Ilford, South and for Rotherham were right to refer to the problem of human rights in China. No one who represents a constituency in this House of Commons, with all our traditions, could turn a blind eye to the problems of human rights and democracy in China. That matter intensely worries people in Hong Kong as much as it disturbs us. The rule of law must be retained at all costs. It is the fundamental principle that underlies all institutions in Hong Kong.
I hope that when the Minister of State winds up, he will refer to the points made by the Foreign Affairs Select Committee about international human rights conventions and say where the Government stand on those. The Committee rightly argued for an independent human rights watchdog and said that the Hong Kong Government should be supported in strengthening human rights before 1997. The problem is that China has not ratified those international conventions. Is some bilateral agreement between the UK Government and China sufficient to ensure that the rights enshrined in the international covenants are applied in Hong Kong after 1 July 1997?
It is important to ensure that, after 1997, the Court of Final Appeal is seen internationally as an independent and proper judiciary which the people of Hong Kong can feel confident will safeguard their freedoms and rights.
The right hon. Member for Guildford and my hon. Friends the Members for Livingston and for Ilford, South mentioned the plight of the widows of ex- service men, a matter that has still not been addressed. I believe that there are only 52 such people. Although the matter concerns the Home Office, I hope that when he winds up the Minister of State will say what he believes is the case and whether the Home Office will take another look at it.
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