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Mr. Maxton: Will the right hon. Gentleman give way?
Sir Hector Monro: Of course I shall give way to my pair.
Mr. Maxton: I am grateful to my pair for giving way. If he has read the Library research paper on the subject, he will know that, despite the large vote here against the experiment at that time, the public opinion polling evidence was then in favour of retaining the experiment, not getting rid of it.
Sir Hector Monro: The House should not legislate on the basis of public opinion polls and pressure groups. We should legislate as Members of Parliament representing our constituents. Those who oppose the Bill believe that
their constituents do not want it. The vote of 1970 should not be disregarded, as it was important and a true reflection of the opinion of the House. British summer time was discounted then, and is discounted now, as has been shown by the countless letters and newspaper correspondence over the past couple of months.
It is also wrong for my hon. Friend the Member for Bournemouth, West and others to disregard the De Montfort university research paper, which is just as well-founded as any of the other research papers that have mentioned. Research has been carried out at Heriot-Watt university, the Road Transport Laboratory and the Scottish transport office; they all have points to make that must be considered, not disregarded, as my hon. Friend did earlier.
Following the 1970 vote, a consultative Green Paper was introduced--Cm. 722 of 1989--and came to no conclusions. It rehearsed the history of the 1916 introduction for wartime reasons, and the 1939 defence regulations. But those measures were designed to help the war effort, and no assessment was made of their popularity at the time.
Cm. 722 accepted that there were severe disadvantages for many people and many widely different types of employment, but the Bill's supporters rubbish the attitude of those from Scotland, the north of England, Ireland, Wales and, of course, the west of England. The paper said that 86.2 per cent. of the responses from Scotland were in favour of the status quo, which did not include double summer time. There were only 25,000 responses in England in favour of the change to summer time.
Scottish opinion has been backed up by the Scotland on Sunday poll and by the Edinburgh Evening News poll, which were both conducted in recent weeks. Everyone should read the informed debate of the Royal Scottish Geographical Society, which came down firmly on the side of the status quo.
Mrs. Anne Campbell:
The right hon. Gentleman is a Scottish Member. Has he consulted the Scottish skiing industry, one of the most up-and-coming tourist attractions in Scotland? At new year, one of the most popular times for skiing in the Cairngorms, there is little daylight at the end of the day--it starts to get dark at 3.30 pm, and people are driven off the slopes. Does not the right hon. Gentleman consider that a change would improve the prospects for that important industry in Scotland?
Sir Hector Monro:
It would not make the slightest difference. People have only to get up and be on the slopes at daylight, and they are ready to ski.
Mrs. Margaret Ewing (Moray):
I have heard representations from the skiing industry, which is important in my area--I am sure the right hon. Gentleman appreciates that, as he frequently comes to my constituency. He will be aware that the last thing the ski industry wants is the possibility of people leaving the ski slopes at the very time that school buses, minibuses and parental cars are collecting children and are on the roads, as that would enhance the possibility of accidents rather than decrease it.
Sir Hector Monro:
The hon. Lady makes an important point. If one is a keen skier, one will be on the slopes at the crack of dawn and daylight, and will remain there until dusk; it does not matter what the clock says.
Mr. Bill Walker:
With his long experience of the sport, my right hon. Friend will have a greater understanding of what goes on on the ski slopes than the hon. Member for Cambridge (Mrs. Campbell). Does he recollect that most of the business is carried out at the weekends? I say that as someone in whose constituency the skiing industry is active. As most of the work is done at weekends, changing the hours will not have any effect.
Sir Hector Monro:
My hon. Friend is right--what the skiing industry needs is not more daylight, but more snow. We cannot be governed by polls or referendums. The polls very much depend on the question asked and the emotion put into it--particularly in relation to schoolchildren.
I know that my hon. Friend the Member for Bournemouth, West believes in democracy, and it is not just a matter of simple majorities; we must understand the impact of such measures on all people; one must be considerate of others when making decisions. He said that the subject was a north-south issue, but it is as much an east-west issue. We must take into account the fact that Edinburgh is west of Liverpool--there is a north-west/south-east slant in the United Kingdom. The further west one goes, as the hon. Member for Western Isles (Mr. Macdonald) knows, the more serious the problem becomes.
What would the people of London say if the Bill were imposed on them and they were in darkness at 10.15 in the morning? I think that there would be a riot.
Mr. McWilliam:
It would be a mistake to regard the vote as a Scottish-British one. Although I have a Scottish accent, I live in England, but I can see Scotland from my bedroom window. I think that I live slightly further north than the right hon. Gentleman.
Sir Hector Monro:
I agree--I am delighted that the hon. Gentleman has such a splendid view of something worthwhile when he gets up. But he would not see it at all if the Bill were to be enacted. I absolutely support him, and the north of England Members.
Apart from the hon. Member for Cathcart, no hon. Member north of Leicester has sponsored the Bill. People who know what the reality is would not sponsor the Bill, and I am surprised at the hon. Gentleman, although I do not want to disagree with him. When I drove to the Scottish Grand Committee in the morning on Monday, I had my car headlights on at 9.15 am--that would have been 10.15 am had the Bill been passed. It is ridiculous to think that we should be governed by pressure groups that advocate the Bill.
There has been no proper test of public opinion since the Vote in the House of Commons. I am disappointed at the number of pressure groups that have been peddling inaccurate information. Some people say that we should have two time zones in the United Kingdom. I am glad that my hon. Friend the Member for Bournemouth, West has never accepted that proposal, which is ludicrous. I live within 10 miles of the border, and if the time zone changed at the border, it would create problems involving trains, work and other matters. We should not even consider such a proposal.
The 1989 Green Paper, which was inconclusive, notes the strong opposition to change among those involved in trade, agriculture, forestry, the construction industry, and the manufacturing and distributive industries in the United Kingdom, and particularly in Scotland and Northern Ireland.
It was not right to rubbish the contribution of the Communication Workers Union. The letter from the deputy general secretary makes it clear. It states:
The union does not shilly-shally by saying that the Bill will not make any difference. It believes that the Bill would make a difference, and that is why I strongly advocate its view.
The Convention of Scottish Local Authorities has also produced an excellent brief on the Bill. One cannot dismiss that document lightly, because COSLA represents all the local authorities of Scotland. It has gone to immense trouble to canvass each authority for its view, including my authority of Dumfries and Galloway, which is firmly against the Bill.
Mr. Maxton:
The right hon. Gentleman was a Minister in the Government who introduced the poll tax in Scotland. COSLA sent him a brief condemning that outright, so why did he not listen then to what it said?
Sir Hector Monro:
The hon. Gentleman is the last man I want to have a row with in the House, but he must not try to divert me into a discussion about issues in the dim and distant past.
The briefing from COSLA makes it absolutely clear:
We should support that well-argued brief.
Mr. David Marshall:
COSLA has also expressed concern about the additional heating costs that would be incurred as a result of the Bill. It refers to public buildings, but the same argument could be extended to private buildings and domestic ones. People are having trouble paying their heating bills because of the imposition of VAT, so does the right hon. Gentleman not think it is nothing short of disgraceful that they would have to burn their heating for even longer should the Bill be passed? Does he share COSLA's concern about that?
"On all these counts--and not least the effect this dangerous move will have on the country's postal workers--I ask you to vote against the Bill when it comes to the House . . . next week."
"The introduction of Central European Time is rejected as this would only lead to darkness in Scotland continuing well into the morning."
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