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The Prime Minister: I am grateful to the right hon. Gentleman. The answer to his last point is yes. I certainly see the talks starting as speedily as we can manage and invitations being issued within a few days. I hope that all those who receive those invitations will both join in those talks and join in them at senior decision-making level within their parties because that is important.
The right hon. Gentleman is right that there is a balance of advantage, a very clear balance of advantage, in working with the Irish Government. We do not agree on every aspect; both the Taoiseach and I would state that quite plainly. There is no doubt that there is a different perspective on some of the matters that we have been discussing, but the prospects for success are infinitely greater if the two Governments can continue to work together in this process rather than apart. There were efforts during the past few months by some of the parties involved to seek to provoke differences and breaks between the two Governments. We are well aware of the number of occasions on which they tried to do that and we have resisted.
I am grateful to the right hon. Gentleman for what he said about decommissioning. As I said a moment ago, that was set out in the Downing street declaration. It is not a matter of dogma but of practicalities. No one has yet found an alternative way of providing confidence. The hon. Member for Upper Bann (Mr. Trimble) once said that if there were other ways, of course one could look at them. But no one has yet provided another way. We shall wait to see whether one is provided. As for an elected assembly, I do not need to reiterate what the right hon. Gentleman said: I agree with it.
Mr. Andrew Hunter (Basingstoke):
In warmly welcoming yesterday's communique and my right hon. Friend's statement, may I ask him to confirm that the international body will be purely advisory, that it will have no executive role and that both Governments will be free to respond to its suggestions in the way that they wish?
The Prime Minister:
Yes, I can confirm all my hon. Friend's points. It will have an advisory, not an executive
Mr. David Trimble (Upper Bann):
I note that the communique that was issued last night is in its essentials identical to the one that would have been issued at the beginning of September if the Irish Government had not given way to IRA threats at that time. In his statement the Prime Minister referred to paragraph 10 of the Downing street declaration and said that meeting the requirements of paragraph 10 are an essential condition. He will know that one of those requirements is the need to establish a commitment through exclusively peaceful means. I welcome what he said in the statement with regard to the decommissioning requirement and I welcome that clear restatement of the Government's position, but does he agree that there is also stated in paragraph 10 of the Downing street declaration a need for parties moving into all-party talks to have a democratic mandate and to show a willingness to abide by the democratic process? Does he agree that that mandate can be obtained, and that willingness to abide by the democratic process can be shown, only by the parties submitting themselves to an election and showing a willingness to participate in an elected body, and that, therefore, the sooner we have such an election and such a body, out of which negotiations can subsequently be developed, the better?
The Prime Minister:
There is a great similarity between the agreement that would have been reached in September and the communique that was issued last evening. One difference of course between the two, as the hon. Gentleman will know, is that the communique issued yesterday was far more detailed in its content than the relatively brief communique that was still-born in September. To that effect, the time that has been lost has not been wholly lost because we have made some progress in the detail of the matters.
The hon. Gentleman quotes paragraph 10 correctly and that is, of course, one of the ways in which parties may achieve a democratic mandate. We said clearly in paragraph 10 that
Mr. Peter Robinson (Belfast, East):
Does the Prime Minister accept that my colleagues and I have always been willing to meet him and to express our views on how political progress can be made and that we shall continue to do that, but that we are not prepared to be included in a process in which Sinn Fein-IRA plays a part while it still holds on to its semtex and weapons?
Will the Prime Minister explain to us how it is fair and just in paragraph 4 of the communique that constitutional and legitimate political parties should be treated on an equal basis to a political group that is a support organisation for a terrorist organisation, which, in turn, still holds on to its weaponry? Will the Prime Minister explain in relation to paragraph 3 what the term "widespread agreement" in that context is intended to convey? Is it possible for a talks process to begin without the support of all the Northern Ireland political parties?
The Prime Minister:
We certainly seek as broad as possible participation and I hope that we can have universal participation. That would certainly be the best guiding star to achieving a satisfactory outcome and I hope that the hon. Gentleman and his party, who represent a great deal of important opinion in Northern Ireland, will play a constructive role. They have an important role to play. The proposals that he and his hon. Friend the Member for North Antrim (Rev. Ian Paisley) brought to me recently were constructive. The hon. Member for Belfast, East (Mr. Robinson) will see the echo of them in the reference to an elected assembly in the communique that was issued yesterday. I should like to continue that constructive approach and I hope that he and his party will contribute to these discussions at a senior decision-making level.
As the hon. Gentleman knows, we are seeking the prospect of a proper dialogue for peace, but there is a dilemma for the two Governments in that respect: we cannot ensure that dialogue ourselves. We can only encourage it. The hon. Gentleman and other hon. Gentlemen with political responsibility for parties in Northern Ireland can deliver it and I very much hope that they will do so. They can help to ensure peace or they can help to prevent peace. I very much hope that they will work to ensure it.
As we have seen in the sad history of Northern Ireland, it is very easy to prevent peace. All that is necessary is to play to the old script, stand on the sidelines and play on the old fears and there will be no lasting peace. We know that that is the case. The history of Ireland has sadly told us that, but there is an alternative: if the people of Northern Ireland, who have shown great courage, can find a similar courage in all their political leaders--courage and determination to banish the old enmities--then, in joining in these discussions, those leaders can provide a more secure future for Northern Ireland than it has ever known in the past. That is a very great prize. It is a prize that is worth examining very carefully. It is worth examining all the options, including the option of deciding to engage in these preparatory talks.
The hon. Gentleman set out correctly what is necessary before one can move to what one might call the mainstream constitutional talks. We are here talking about the preparatory talks, and I hope that he and his party will show the same constructive spirit as they showed when they called upon me recently in Downing street, and will join in the talks, for the sake of the contribution that they can bring to making them a success.
Mr. Clive Soley (Hammersmith):
Will the Prime Minister accept that we should not take the present ceasefire for granted? That is why the talks last night were so welcome, because they prevented the ceasefire from beginning to fray at the edges, as some of us feared that it might, given that there are always a few people who would like to return to violence. More importantly, will the right hon. Gentleman confirm that the British and Irish people expect the parties to participate in the preparatory talks, and that failure to do so would cause enormous damage to the communities that they represent in Northern Ireland?
The Prime Minister:
I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for what he has said. Certainly it is not wise to take the ceasefire for granted. One illustration of the extent to which that is true is that although, mercifully, we have had 15 months free of bombings and murder, emphatically we have not had 15 months free of crime and thuggery. Day after day, on both sides, punishment beatings have occurred, and people utterly defying the normal rule of law have taken it upon themselves to enter homes and break them up with baseball bats, and to break the arms and legs of teenagers with baseball bats for not toeing what those people thought was the appropriate party line in their particular part of Northern Ireland. That is not peace as I understand it, and it provides an illustration of the dangers that lie there.
"democratically mandated parties which establish a commitment to exclusively peaceful methods and which have shown that they abide by the democratic process, are free to participate fully in democratic politics".
That has been our guiding position from the outset and it remains so.
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