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Capital and Corporal Punishment
11. Mr. Nicholas Winterton: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department what plans he has to review the possibility of restoring to the courts the option of capital and corporal punishment. [1363]
Mr. Howard: None. Capital punishment is a matter for the will of the House. I am not satisfied that corporal punishment would be useful in practice. It had virtually fallen into disuse some time before it was abolished.
Mr. Winterton: I am sure that my right hon. and learned Friend would not expect me to be happy with that reply. Does he accept that, as I believe, a decent and civilised society should be permitted to protect itself against an uncivilised, heinous and brutal act? I refer to the killing of women following rape, the killing of children following sexual molestation, the killing of police and prison officers in the course of their duty, killings resulting from terrorist bombs and bullets and killings resulting from premeditated armed robbery.
Is it not right that a civilised society should be able to protect itself from those brutal crimes, and is not the only answer capital punishment? Does my right hon. and learned Friend agree with me, speaking as a grandfather and father, that the phrase, "spare the rod and spoil the child" is more applicable today than it ever has been?
Mr. Howard:
I tend to agree with my hon. Friend's last observation, and of course I agree with him that any civilised society must protect itself against barbaric behaviour of the type that he described. Where we differ is that I believe that there are other ways in which that protection can be provided, including the sentence of life imprisonment, but it is important that someone
Mr. Soley:
If the Home Secretary decided to support capital punishment, would he give an absolute guarantee to the House that he would first develop the scientific skills that were necessary to restore life to a person who had been wrongfully convicted?
Mr. Howard:
It is true that the danger of miscarriages of justice and the impossibility of remedying them is one of the strongest arguments against capital punishment.
Mr. Hawkins:
Does my right hon. and learned Friend agree that it is highly likely that, if there were a referendum on the re-introduction of capital and corporal punishment, voters would vote for it, as my hon. Friend the Member for Macclesfield (Mr. Winterton) has said?
Does my right hon. and learned Friend also agree that the Leader of the Opposition might consider corporal punishment for his Front-Bench spokesman on inner cities for his appalling racist comments reported on
"Dispatches" on Channel 4 last night?
Mr. Howard:
We condemn and deplore racist comments, whenever they are made, wherever they are made and whatever quarter they come from. I hope that the Opposition will take seriously the observations that were made in the House this afternoon and take appropriate action.
It is my impression that the Leader of the Opposition administers corporal punishment to members of his Front-Bench team almost daily.
12. Mrs. Anne Campbell:
To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department what assessment he has made of the relationship between crime levels and unemployment. [1364]
Mr. Maclean:
A wide range of research studies, including those conducted by my Department, have failed to uncover any consistent causal link between unemployment and crime.
Mrs. Campbell:
There is no excuse for committing a crime--[Hon. Members: "Hear, hear."]--but does the Minister consider that Government policies that produce high youth unemployment, inadequate youth training programmes and cuts in benefit for the under-25s create conditions in which crime and law breaking can thrive?
Are not the Government's policies responsible for the continuing high level of crime?
Mr. Maclean:
The admission in the first part of the hon. Lady's supplementary question will keep Alastair Campbell spin doctoring for the rest of this afternoon. If she does not want to believe Home Office research studies and studies from other independent researchers, perhaps she will believe the highly respected chief constable of Strathclyde who, last Saturday, poured cold water on her pet theories about unemployment and crime. If police chiefs throughout the country can see that, and we see it in our research studies, perhaps one day it will get through to the Opposition; but I am not hopeful.
13. Mr. Spring:
To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department what plans he has to tackle the international trade in illegal drug trafficking. [1367]
Mr. Howard:
The Government are committed to vigorous action at home and abroad to tackle international drug trafficking and other serious organised crime. My right hon. Friend the Prime Minister recently announced a series of measures to improve law enforcement in that field, including a role for the Security Service in support of the police. We are also pursuing, with our European partners, an international initiative to improve drug interdiction in the eastern Caribbean.
Mr. Spring:
Does my right hon. and learned Friend agree that if illegal drug trafficking is to be combated, a high level of international co-operation will be required?
Is he aware of the success of Operation De Niro which, with considerable British help, resulted in 88 arrests world wide and the seizure of $52 million, $11 million-worth of paintings and 9 tonnes of cocaine?
Mr. Howard:
I entirely agree with my hon. Friend, and I am grateful to him for giving the House that example. The resources available to many of the organisations that are involved in international drug trafficking are far in excess of those available to a number of nation states. International co-operation, in which we play a prominent part, is essential if we are to combat the activities of those organisations effectively.
Mr. Bermingham:
Does the Home Secretary agree that one of the problems involved in fighting crime such as drug trafficking is the fact that Great Britain is an island? Does he agree that the fact that the Government have cut the number of drug enforcement and customs officers and the number of officers available to both coastguards and others, has not really helped to stop the importation of drugs?
Mr. Howard:
I entirely reject the hon. Gentleman's allegations. We are now concentrating on more effective measures--particularly the use of intelligence--so that we can target the offenders and deal effectively with this menace.
14. Mr. Ian Bruce:
To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department what representations he has received regarding the problem of illegal immigration and bogus asylum applications. [1368]
15. Sir Michael Neubert:
To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department what steps he is taking to tackle bogus asylum claims and illegal immigration; and if he will make a statement. [1369]
The Minister of State, Home Office (Miss Ann Widdecombe):
I have received numerous representations on a wide range of asylum and immigration issues. My right hon. and learned Friend announced to the House on 20 November the further measures that he proposes to take to tackle the problems caused by unfounded asylum claims and illegal immigration.
Mr. Bruce:
Does my hon. Friend agree that, by speeding up the handling of applications by genuine
Miss Widdecombe:
My hon. Friend is right on every count. Nothing in our Bill is intended in any way to disadvantage the genuine asylum seeker. Britain has a proud record of looking after those in need of a place of safety, and we shall continue to maintain that record.
The Opposition have consistently accused us of introducing a racist measure. That sits ill with what was said by their spokesman, the hon. Member for Leicester, East (Mr. Vaz). Before Opposition Members accuse us of racism, perhaps they will apologise for their spokesman.
Sir Michael Neubert:
Did my hon. Friend read the story, earlier this week, of a man from Zaire on benefit who defrauded the British people of £1 million while awaiting a decision on his application for asylum? Does that not make our right hon. and learned Friend the Home Secretary's action on asylum applications and illegal immigration very welcome? Would not any political party that failed to support such measures--Labour, Liberal or Monster Raving Loony--be absolutely barmy?
Miss Widdecombe:
That is perfectly true. Moreover, only the Conservative party is prepared to tackle the problem. Indeed, the Opposition have not made up their minds whether to acknowledge that there is a serious problem. They say that, even if there is a problem, we should not get round to tackling it. It is true that our asylum procedures are heavily abused. It is also true that our social security system acts as a magnet for the unworthy, as does the ease with which people can work illegally in this country. We shall support British taxpayers, no matter what their ethnic origin. We shall ensure that those who are here lawfully are not taken for a ride by those who abuse our system.
Mr. Timms:
I welcome the assurance given by the Home Secretary last week that Nigeria is not now being considered for inclusion on the white list. Will the Minister now put the minds of many people at rest by giving a similar assurance in respect of Sri Lanka, where many thousands of people have been forced to flee their homes in recent weeks because of the civil war?
Miss Widdecombe:
We have made it very clear that, at an early stage of consideration of the Bill, we shall give an indication of our thinking on which countries should be designated. I am not willing to anticipate that announcement, and the hon. Gentleman must possess himself in patience.
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