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Mr. Julian Brazier (Canterbury): The hon. Gentleman has made a profound point. Change will not be achieved

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primarily through legislation but by a change of ethos among employers. One of the reasons why the Americans, Australians and Canadians have been more successful than us in changing that ethos is precisely because of the point he made five minutes ago: they have senior reservist generals in their Ministries of Defence to advise Ministers on how to devise operating systems that will most be appreciated by employers and the wider civilian community.

Mr. Murphy: I have a great deal of sympathy with that point. Perhaps it could be expanded on when we consider the Bill in greater detail.

While employers and employees require a proper system of appeal for exemptions from call-out, we shall need to examine in some detail in Committee some of the provisions with regard, for example, to general offences and other matters. The Minister referred to the tribunals. I welcome that reference because it is important that there should be an opportunity for people who want to be exempt from call-out to be dealt with swiftly and fairly. As good as the National Employer Liaison Committee is, we must involve many more organisations in the tribunals--for example, the Confederation of British Industry, the Trades Union Congress, the Institute of Directors and, of course, our large businesses and the Federation of Small Businesses. However, that is largely a matter of detail. I hope that it can be dealt with in Committee, along with the detailed arrangements for exemption, call-out, pay and organisation.

Opposition Members agree with the Select Committee on Defence when it concluded that


About a century ago, my grandfather, who was a miner, joined what was then the equivalent of the Territorial Army--the Monmouthshire Militia. He was very proud of doing so. Today, tens of thousands of men and women are equally proud of being members of the reserve forces. The House owes it to them and to the reservists who will follow to make sure that this legislation will stand the test of time.

5.30 pm

Sir Hector Monro (Dumfries): The speeches of the hon. Member for Torfaen (Mr. Murphy) and of my hon. Friend the Minister of State for the Armed Forces show that we shall have in Committee a constructive and worthwhile debate that will make the Bill even better than it is already. It is a good Bill because there has been lengthy consultation within the services, the reserves and the territorial, auxiliary and volunteer reserve associations, not only throughout the country but withthe Territorial, Auxiliary and Volunteer Reserve Associations Council.

As the regular forces are run down, it is vital that we retain an effective military capability. Many of us think that we are perhaps under strength and over committed. That was highlighted by the sad loss of so many Royal Air Force

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service men last week. In this situation, the reserves are more important than ever before, because they provide immediate front and rear line cover and support for the regular forces. I know that "Front Line First" has become a slogan, but, in reality, the front line is only as good as the reserves. That goes for the Royal Navy, the Territorial Army and the Royal Auxiliary Air Force.

I should declare an interest as the Inspector General of the Royal Auxiliary Air Force and Honorary Air Commodore of 2622 Squadron. I have overall responsibility for the auxiliaries with the inspector and have the generous help of the Controller of the Reserve Forces at Innsworth. I have direct access to the Chief of the Air Staff, and we have constructive, cordial and regular meetings. I was certainly impressed by the Select Committee's recommendation that the Territorial Army should have something similar--a reservist who is a director general of the reserves and who therefore has an important part to play within the Ministry of Defence.

The Royal Auxiliary Air Force and the Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve are small, and many regular officers know little of their quality and capability unless there happens to be a unit on their station. I shall outline one or two details of the history of the Royal Auxiliary Air Force and what it has achieved.

The Royal Auxiliary Air Force was formed in 1924, so it is only seven years younger than the Royal Air Force. It had 20 flying squadrons in 1939, based on cities and counties--the 600 Squadron from the City of London, the 601 from the county of London, the 602 from Glasgow and the603 from Edinburgh, a squadron that I joined later.

The squadrons fought in the battle of Britain with Spitfires and Hurricanes and were credited with shooting down one third of all enemy aircraft that were destroyed. It is true to say that the battle of Britain could not have been won without the Royal Auxiliary Air Force. Members of this House took a particular interest in the Royal Auxiliary Air Force--Aiden Crawley,Vere Harvey, Grant Ferris, the Duke of Hamilton, the Earl of Selkirk and others were much involved, along with Honorary Air Commodores such as Sir Will Darling from Edinburgh, Sir Anthony Eden and, of course, Winston Churchill, who was the famed Honorary Air Commodore of 615 Squadron. Members of the royal family are Honorary Air Commodores and, of course, the Queen has always been our Air Commodore-in-Chief.

The Royal Auxiliary Air Force was reformed after the war and flew Spitfires, Mosquitoes, Vampires and Meteors. Sadly, it was disbanded in 1957--perhaps that was not one of our best decisions. However, the tradition of the auxiliaries was carried on through the maritime headquarters unit. From 1980 onwards, there was a steady expansion with regiment squadrons, gun squadrons--guns were retrieved from the Argentine in the Falklands war--and the defence force flight.

"Options for Change" put the expansion into reverse, which was perhaps an ill-advised decision, as the hon. Member for Torfaen said. We lost three squadrons and four defence force flights. That was a bit of a slap in the face to keen, enthusiastic volunteers who were doing what they could to help their country by being members of the reserve forces.

Now, we have a much brighter future and enhanced opportunities under the Bill, which implements much of what is required. The call-out in the Gulf was a case in

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point. The restrictions of the Reserve Forces Act 1980 revealed deficiencies and, of course, there was some indecision in the Ministry of Defence about the status of reserves.

All members of the Royal Auxiliary Air Force are volunteers and ready to go at the drop of a hat. The two squadrons that were called out--the 4626 Medical Squadron and the 4624 Movement Squadron--were ready to move in 72 hours. They did valuable work in the Gulf and at Brize Norton where they were also helping. There were no problems, because the normal procedures were in place for those who could not go to put a case to the tribunal. One or two exceptional cases were accepted.I am glad that the matter is to be spelt out in more detail.

It was, however, certainly frustrating for the auxiliaries who were keen to go but unable to be called out for one reason or another. There were so many things that they could have done, such as guard duty on stations. The engineers and other tradesmen were hard pressed to keep our front-line aircraft serviced, but had to do guard duty. The reservists could have done it for them but not, apparently, under the law at the time.

In addition, employers had given reservists time off year after year for continuous or weekend training and asked why, when there was an international crisis, the reservists were not called out. It seems that their enthusiasm to help the auxiliaries was not reciprocated in an international crisis. I hope that such problems will be righted and dealt with in Committee.

I am glad that the humanitarian aspects of dealing with disasters are to be dealt with. We have always been keen to help. Territorials were involved at the time of the Lockerbie disaster, and even last month, during the particularly heavy snow falls, the TA was keen to help and did so when required.

In many ways, high-readiness reserves are similar to the Royal Auxiliary Service, because they are ready to go at the drop of a hat. The change of emphasis means that, whereas the auxiliaries operate as a unit, members of the HRR will operate more as individuals. We must be careful in Committee, because we do not want to create a feeling within a unit that some are getting more resources because they are on the HRR list than those which are ready to go but are not on the list. We also have to balance employers' attitudes to call-out for six or nine months. From reading the debate in the Lords and from considering the matter myself, I am sure that the Government are right that nine months should be the period. That allows time for training, going away for sixth months, returning, debriefing, perhaps retraining for a civilian task, which the hon. Member for Greenock and Port Glasgow(Dr. Godman) mentioned, and for leave. Six to nine months is what we should consider in Committee. I read, too, the National Employer Liaison Committee paper on call-out exemptions, which made many sensible suggestions.

The Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve has done a wonderful job and has the same great traditions as the Royal Auxiliary Air Force. The two living recipients of the Victoria cross in the Royal Air Force were both in the volunteer reserve during the war. On 1 April 1997, subject to the Bill going through the House, the volunteer reserve flights--intelligence, interrogation, meteorology and so on--will come into the Royal Auxiliary Air Force to make one force. That is all to the good. The reservists are

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keen on that. There is an amicable relationship. We are looking forward to a great ceremony next spring when the volunteer reserve and the auxiliaries will be united. I hope that my hon. Friend the Minister will ensure that it does not happen on election day.

We in the reserves are keen to maintain a welcome place for women. We have women in the regiment squadron, and many serve in the maritime headquarters unit and, of course, in the movement squadron. They all do the most valuable work and we must maintain a prominent place for them.

The hon. Member for Torfaen talked about the medical side. We have the area medical squadron with a flight detached to Edinburgh. Doctors are in short supply in the reserves, especially the highly trained consultants that are needed to deal with the exceptional injuries that occur in war--particularly with aircraft.

The auxiliaries are doing well and we look forward with confidence to the immediate future. We have cadreised squadrons--27 and 48 squadrons--where auxiliaries work with regulars who operate Rapier. That is good. There are plans for composite squadrons. That is the way that we will go in future. We will not have squadron units like the present regiment squadrons, but composite squadrons full of skilled tradesmen and men of great experience who may be hived off one, two or three at a time to assist the regular Air Force at times of need. That is an important change of emphasis.

I am sure that my hon. Friend the Minister will agree that we also need a geographical change. Units are concentrated in the east and the south-west because that is where the aerodromes at which the auxiliary squadrons are based are located, but we have little in the west midlands or the north of England. I would like able men or women who are keen to be reservists to have the opportunity to join reserve units. There should be something near to where they live.

We are having successful flying trials with the Wessex and Hercules. I should like to have a look at the Hawk and do some search and rescue work as the opportunity arises. In return for all the high morale and hard work,I hope that the MOD will give us adequate opportunity to train abroad. Every two or three years, squadrons should go to Cyprus, Germany or the United States of America, because that is a great incentive that is warmly welcomed by all reservists.

We must also think of reservists' families, which give up husbands, boyfriends and other relatives for long periods while they are away doing their volunteer training. As the hon. Member for Torfaen said, when we ask them to do so much, let us not waste time with red tape. There is far too much paperwork in the MOD and the auxiliary air force. I go berserk trying to translate all the sets of initials. I do not have a clue what they stand for.

Last, the RAuxAF, like the Territorial Army and the Navy, asks for stability. We have gone through a traumatic period. We should now concentrate and build for the future. The Bill gives us a great opportunity so to do. It is a valuable step forward. It is tremendous that reservists have this year a Bill that we will discuss in detail in Committee which will give them a real opportunity to serve their country, which they appreciate so much.

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5.44 pm


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