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Scott Report
9. Mrs. Clwyd: To ask the Deputy Prime Minister what disciplinary action is being taken against civil servants in respect of the findings of the Scott report. [20687]
Mr. Freeman: Disciplinary action would not be appropriate if officials acted conscientiously, in good faith and in accordance with Government policy. The great majority of civil servants identified in the Scott report are in this category. Where there is evidence to the contrary, Departments will consider whether disciplinary action is appropriate.
Mrs. Clwyd: Is it not true that, if civil servants had been free to reveal to Parliament the truth about arms sales to Iraq and those involved in them, there would never have been a Scott inquiry or any prosecutions and £610 million of taxpayers' money would not have been lost in respect of lost export credit guarantees?
Mr. Freeman: There is, as the hon. Lady knows, a new code of practice in force for civil servants. If they feel that they have been asked to act improperly or have been subjected to political interference or direction, they have a right of appeal through their permanent secretary to the First Civil Service Commissioner.
As the hon. Lady will also know, a review is under way in the Ministry of Defence, as my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Trade and Industry and I reported to the House in the Scott debate. My right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Defence will also have something to say in due course about the degree of disclosure on arms sales.
Secondments
10. Mr. John Marshall: To ask the Deputy Prime Minister how many temporary civil servants are currently seconded from private industry. [20688]
Mr. Willetts: Two hundred and eighty people were seconded from the private sector to Government Departments during 1995.
Mr. Marshall: Does my hon. Friend accept that many people feel that there should be greater cross-fertilisation between the practical men of the private sector and the civil service?
Mr. Willetts: I very much agree. That is why my right hon. Friend the Deputy Prime Minister has announced a target of a 10 per cent. increase in secondment to and from the private sector for 1996-97. I might add that the numbers involved in longer-term secondments as between the private sector and the civil service have trebled since 1979.
Mr. MacShane: The Minister is said to be one of the intellectuals or theoreticians of modern Conservatism. May I therefore put it to him that this mixing of the private and public interest may turn out to be unfortunate? It may prove impossible to distinguish between the private and profit-making interests of companies and the public
interest, which concerns defending and representing the interests of the citizen. I invite him to consider that there may be a serious problem in that regard.
Mr. Willetts: The hon. Gentleman says that he is concerned about this issue. I assure him that of course the Government take steps to avoid any conflicts of interest. Any secondment must be looked at by the Department involved to ensure that there is no risk of any impropriety. I believe that the overall benefits to the quality of public sector management and civil service advice from secondment outweigh the risks about which the hon. Gentleman is worried.
Deregulation
11. Sir Sydney Chapman: To ask the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster if he will make a statement on Her Majesty's Government's policy in respect of deregulation with particular reference to health and safety. [20689]
Mr. Freeman: The programme to review health and safety legislation recommended by the Health and Safety Commission will simplify the mass of legislation. New enforcement procedures have been introduced which are designed to improve fairness, transparency and consistency without jeopardising any necessary protection.
Sir Sydney Chapman: As there seems to be misunderstanding, whether genuine or contrived, will the Minister confirm that the purpose of the deregulation initiative is to get rid of unnecessary bureaucracy and in no way to compromise anyone's health or safety? Does he accept that there are at least some so-called health and safety measures which have nothing to do with protecting the individual or looking after their safety? Does he agree, therefore, that there should be an explanation of the purpose of every regulation and how it will be enforced?
Mr. Freeman: As I said in an earlier answer, there is no intention to remove necessary health protection for the consumer or for anyone else. We are after reductions in unnecessary bureaucracy, such as the abolition of 33 statutory notice and poster requirements. Many hon. Members will know of unnecessary and outdated regulations about posters, which are sometimes difficult to read. With the aid of modern technology, there are better ways to inform the work force of those regulations.
I can confirm that my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for the Environment has issued guidance to all Health and Safety Executive officers informing them of new and sensible procedures to take, whereby inspected firms are informed of what is wrong with the premises and what must be put right and they are given an informal right of appeal before, ultimately, an appeal is made to the courts.
OVERSEAS DEVELOPMENT
Sub-Saharan Africa
26. Mr. Hain: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what assessment his Department has carried out of the impact of debt on the provision of basic social services in sub-Saharan Africa; and if he will make a statement. [20706]
- The Minister of State, Foreign and Commonwealth Office (
Mr. Jeremy Hanley): We are concerned about the low level of basic social services in sub-Saharan Africa. When debt reaches unsustainable levels, it has an impact on the whole of a country's economy, including the social sectors. That is why we have taken action, and why we are pressing for more action, to reduce to sustainable levels the debt of the poorest, most indebted countries and those which are pursuing sound economic policies.
Mr. Hain: The Minister's reply does not measure up to the scale of the problem. There is now £135 billion of debt in sub-Saharan Africa--more than three quarters of the region's annual income. Surely the Government should be supporting measures such as the use of World bank reserves, special drawing rights and the sale of International Monetary Fund gold stocks? If that action is not taken, sub-Saharan Africa will continue to drown in debt and there will be no possibility of eradicating the enormous poverty problems, let alone of rebuilding the economies. Will he discuss such proposals to solve the problem with the Debt Crisis Network?
Mr. Hanley: I accept that debt is a serious problem, but Britain has been ahead of most countries in dealing with it. The British Government have written off aid debts of 31 of the world's poorest countries--to the value of £1.2 billion--and for many years all new aid to the poorest countries has been on grant terms so as not to increase their debt burden. The British Government have also taken the lead in pressing for solutions to the official bilateral and multilateral debt burdens of the poorest and most indebted countries. I believe that we have made excellent progress.
Mr. Jacques Arnold: Is not one of the principal ways to help sub-Saharan Africa cope with its debt the writing off of the public sector debt to those countries? Is it not worth bearing in mind that it was a Tory Chancellor of the Exchequer who first put that idea forward at the Trinidad conference, which brought about the Trinidad terms which have already done so much to help those countries with their public debt problem?
Mr. Hanley: My hon. Friend is absolutely right. At the Paris club of Government creditors, 14 countries have now benefited from the Naples terms reschedulings which, as my hon. Friend says, were first introduced in 1990 by my right hon. Friend the Member for Huntingdon (Mr. Major) as the Trinidad terms. The British Government have also pressed for action on multilateral debt. At last year's annual meetings of the IMF and the World bank, it was our Chancellor who called on all international financial institutions to examine further measures to deal with the problems of multilateral debt for the poorest and most indebted countries. That work is currently under way and we expect firm proposals at the spring 1996 meetings of the World bank and the IMF next month.
Miss Emma Nicholson: Is the Minister aware that in Zambia President Chiluba inherited a situation in which his country pays more in debt interest than it can afford to spend on health and education? Given the impact of that on mothers and children, can the Minister assure me
that he will do his very best to get Zambia and Tanzania, which has the same problem, included in the new IMF-World bank proposals?
Mr. Hanley: It has also been said that United Kingdom aid should not be used to service the debts owed to multilateral financial institutions, as with Zambia. The UK programme of aid to Zambia was used for that purpose in 1994-95, but that was exceptional. Our allowing it enabled the Zambian Government to allocate more of their own money to the health sector, and our aid was directly linked to a World bank programme which included conditionality to protect and enhance the share of public expenditure devoted to basic education and health care services in Zambia. Zambia is one of the countries where there has been great success, and where debt rescheduling has helped tremendously and I believe that Zambia is the better for it.
Mr. Foulkes: As countries in sub-Saharan Africa are forced to transfer four times as much to northern creditors as they spend on the health of their citizens, does the Minister agree that much more urgent action on debt is needed? When the Chancellor proposed at the IMF that gold stocks should be sold, he knew fine that it would be almost impossible to get agreement because it would need the support of 80 per cent. of the shareholders. What are the Government doing to get the necessary agreement on debt relief before more innocent children in Africa die? We need urgent action at the IMF, not fine words in the House.
Mr. Hanley: I do not mind fine words in the House--it is nice of the hon. Gentleman to say that my words are fine--because the fine words reflect a fine effort. We are making serious progress. After all, sub-Saharan Africa received nearly $1 billion more from the World bank than it paid in debt service in 1993, the last full year. The Paris club of official creditors has made tremendous progress in rescheduling debts, increasing the figure from 50 per cent. to 67 per cent. in suitable cases. As I have said, 14 countries benefited; they include Chad, Guinea, Guinea-Bissau, Cameroon, Mauritania, Senegal, Togo, Uganda and Zambia, and this week there will be a rescheduling for Sierra Leone. So tremendous progress is being made--it is not just fine words.
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