| Previous Section | Index | Home Page |
Mr. Corbyn: Is my hon. Friend aware that, in all previous United Kingdom elections, the candidates have been people who happen to be members of parties, whereas it is now the parties that are contesting the elections--a fundamental change? Is he also aware that the Secretary of State is giving himself powers to exclude equally legitimate political organisations from contesting the elections? What we have here is the introduction into United Kingdom law of a kind of political censorship that has never existed before.
Mr. Canavan: My hon. Friend is perfectly correct. The Bill is in danger of bringing the United Kingdom's electoral system into disrepute.
About the only positive thing that I can see emerging from the Bill and the White Paper is the firm commitment--I hope it is a firm commitment--to start all-party negotiations on 10 June.
I would also like to refer to paragraph 24 of the White Paper, and the Minister may be able to respond to this point. It says:
How on earth will it be determined whether a decision is supported by "a clear majority" of the communities? We are entitled to some explanation of that point.
I hope that, despite the Bill, all the relevant parties will get together on 10 June. When I say relevant parties, I mean those parties which accept the six principles of the Mitchell report. Like other hon. Members, I hope that Sinn Fein is able to deliver an absolutely unequivocal ceasefire on the part of the IRA, because it would be a tragedy if the people who vote for Sinn Fein in the elections find themselves disfranchised and not represented at the negotiating table.
Once all the parties get round the table on that basis, I hope that there will be a new constitutional settlement put by way of a referendum not just to the people of Northern Ireland but, in accordance with what has been agreed by both Governments, to an all-Ireland test on both sides of the border. It would be helpful if both referendums were held on the same day.
Mr. David Wilshire (Spelthorne):
Using elections to select negotiating teams has to be right. Permanent peace and justice for all in Northern Ireland will, I suspect, come only through democracy. If the hon. Member for North Antrim (Rev. Ian Paisley) will allow me, I will assert some views of the people of Northern Ireland. These views, I believe, have the wholehearted support of the overwhelming majority of those I meet in Northern Ireland, and, if I understand the messages coming from the political parties in Northern Ireland, they have the total support of all the major parties in the Province.
I am totally committed to an exclusively democratic approach to solving the difficulties in Northern Ireland, and it is because of that that I am an enthusiastic supporter of all efforts to press ahead with a real peace process. We must do all we possibly can to hold all-party talks as quickly as possible, for exactly the reasons given earlier by the hon. Member for Upper Bann (Mr. Trimble). It is also for those reasons that I am happy to back this attempt to hold elections. It follows that I am happy to vote for the Bill's Second Reading.
I must offer an apology to the Ulster Unionists on the Opposition Benches because I do not feel able to support their amendment. I believe that we need elections as quickly as possible, and that the best approach is to try to change the detail during the debates next week. There is one other reason why I consider it useful to explain why I will not support them. It does me no harm at all once in a while to take the opportunity of proving that I am my own man, and that I am not an unofficial member of either of the Unionist parties. So I will not be supporting the amendment.
Having said that, I caution the House against believing that the Bill, the elections or the proposed talks will guarantee the permanent peace we want, or justice for all. My reading of the past 18 months suggests that the Bill, the elections and the proposed talks will not achieve what we all want. My reservations about the entire process have been far too well recorded over recent months for me to need to repeat them now. Suffice it to say that my reservations remain, and were well and truly reinforced last night by yet another atrocity in London.
I note, rather surprisingly, that in Northern Ireland and the Republic there are some who are against elections in general and this scheme in particular. The people I have in mind are Sinn Fein-IRA, whose representatives regularly explain that they are against elections. I also have in mind a significant number of Irish Members of Parliament whom I meet in Dublin, who also explain that they are against these elections.
I find it extraordinary when I hear in Dublin that there is a body of opinion in the Republic which considers that "elections are not appropriate in Northern Ireland". All I can say is that such sentiments are deeply damaging and dangerous, and the people concerned should be ashamed of themselves for saying such things.
We are all familiar with Sinn Fein-IRA's regular denunciation of these elections. I can only assume that they are so opposed because they wish to prevent the world from being reminded of how few people vote for
Sinn Fein in a secret ballot. They may also be anxious that the world should not be reminded that their power comes from the bullet and the bomb and not from the ballot box.
All I can ask of those who are against elections is: "What are you afraid of? Could it be that you are afraid of democracy? Could it be that you are afraid of the people of Northern Ireland?" I have always believed that the best and really the only test of a true commitment to democracy is one's ability and willingness to accept from the people a verdict with which one does not agree. That is the exact opposite of the message we are receiving from those who oppose the elections.
Although I wholeheartedly welcome the elections and the principles that underpin the Bill, I suspect that it will come as no surprise to my right hon. and learned Friend the Secretary of State that I am yet another person with reservations about the detail. I hasten to reassure my hon. Friends from the Whips Office that none of my reservations will bring me remotely close to wanting to oppose the Bill. However, some of my reservations will lead to amendments, and I will probably want to divide the House on Monday or Tuesday next week.
I have two major reservations: the electoral system that is proposed in the Bill and the use of a Command Paper to avoid putting the detail of the negotiations and the process into the Bill. I had hoped that the parties in Northern Ireland would have agreed on the way forward for the electoral system. That would have meant that I would simply have had to support them. I suppose, on reflection, that that was rather too much to hope. Therefore, I have to decide for myself on the best way forward.
I am nervous about extending the precedent of using proportional representation in United Kingdom elections, although I probably concede that we have to on this occasion. I am not persuaded that using individual constituencies is the best approach. I am opposed to any scheme that adds in the unelectable as an afterthought just to make up the numbers.
I sense that all those reservations could have been overcome if we had used a single constituency, because, above all else, that would avoid having to give seats to losers--people who could not get themselves elected by the people of Northern Ireland.
Using a Command Paper to spell out the detail is very worrying. It means that the detail in the paper is not really debatable, and it is certainly not amendable. If anything is undemocratic, I believe that it is that process. That is why I have it in mind to table amendments that will bring into the Bill the detail that is in the Command Paper. We can then have a full debate on the detail, and seek to amend it if we wish to do so.
Happily for hon. Members present today, there is only time for me to mention my four main concerns about the Command Paper. However, I do not want my right hon. and learned Friend and others on the Front Bench to think that I do not have more than four. Monday and Tuesday next week will be the time for that.
Paragraph 4 contains a significant change from the draft, because it now refers to the framework documents. My visits to Northern Ireland leave me in no doubt that the framework documents are totally unacceptable to the majority of those I meet in Northern Ireland. They are seen to this day as a green agenda and a sell-out to Dublin,
making a united Ireland unavoidable. The tragedy is that most people on the mainland have long since lost sight of them and believe that they have gone away. To bring them back in this fashion risks ruining any prospect of talks before they even start.
"The negotiations will operate on the basis of consensus . . . (The rules for establishing sufficient consensus will be agreed in advance of negotiations by the participants and such rules will ensure that any departure from the rule of unanimity is within minimal limits and will, in all cases, ensure that any decision taken will be supported by a clear majority in both the unionist and nationalist communities in Northern Ireland.)"
| Next Section
| Index | Home Page |