House of Commons Hansard Debates for 14 Oct 1996 (pt 13)

Mr. Portillo: Absolutely. Nothing that I have said about European collaboration should be held to be exclusive. British companies also have important joint ventures with American companies. It is extremely important for British companies to maintain the flexibility to operate with partners in both continents--and, indeed, even more broadly than that.

On European competition, we face the problem that the United States has production lines for its armed forces which are 10 times as long as the production lines of any one European country. We should think about how to restructure and produce collaboratively so as to have longer production runs. We must do better than we have done on Eurofighter, because the delays are making the product uncompetitive.

I was about to say that the House debated thoroughly the sale of the married quarters estate. Over the summer, we achieved an excellent sale. We exchanged contracts with Annington Homes on 24 September for a sale price of £1,662 million, which significantly exceeded general expectations.

Annington does not wish to exercise the site exchange option during the first 25 years. As that has been a cause of some anxiety, I hope that that decision will increase further the House's confidence in the sale. Sir Thomas Macpherson, a distinguished ex-soldier and chairman of Annington, has expressed clearly his understanding of the importance of family security to the serving soldier, sailor or airman. His support for the integrity of the patch matches my own. Such issues are important if we are to

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recruit and retain the right number and quality of personnel. The Select Committee on Defence has expressed its concern on that issue too.

Sir Michael Bett's independent review of the services' manpower, career and remuneration structure focused on some of the issues. In July, I informed the House that much work was still required on the detailed options contained in it. There are complex issues to be considered, and we are taking the necessary time to get them right.

It is no part of Government policy to recruit below establishment. We want to see the Army's shortfall of 4,000 made good. We recognise the impact of excess cadreisation on effectiveness, and the consequences of a shortfall in numbers for tour intervals--and hence for family life. Pushing up the numbers is a top priority for the Government and for the Army board. One of our enemies in that effort is a false impression that numbers in the armed forces are in decline and opportunities with them. It is not so. The forces are recruiting and they offer to young people the prospect of great experiences and a fine career.

Today no employer offers a job for life. The services can give more assurance about job security than most. Few other jobs offer the range of experience provided by the armed forces; nor the opportunities for teamwork, personal development, leadership, responsibility and excitement. It is a wonderful career for a young person. Anyone who enlists will be joining an elite of fine people who work to defend us and our values, and who are seen by the world to be doing so with enormous skill and professionalism.

I end by reverting to the subject of NATO, with a word of caution. NATO was formed to provide collective defence and, as it evolves, hard defence must remain its core. There is a danger of learning the wrong lessons from Bosnia. The situation was risky and NATO has had a great success there, but, in the event, we have faced no major attacks on our forces and therefore no test of NATO's fighting capability.

Not all future operations will be like that. As recently as l991, against Iraq, we were involved in high-intensity conflict, against a huge army with enormous quantities of armour, a stock of chemical weapons and some capability in ballistic missiles. It is not difficult to imagine another such conflict, but as time goes by the missiles and the weapons of mass destruction will be vastly more effective. Therefore, we should not assume that all future conflicts will be like the Gulf, with a small number of allied casualties. We could in time face a highly capable adversary.

NATO must not go soft on defence, nor must it be lured into seeing itself as primarily a peacekeeping organisation. The non-alliance countries which have made a valuable contribution to IFOR have had a valuable experience of operating with NATO forces, but they have not yet experienced what NATO is. NATO must remain ready for high-intensity conflict, with all its members committed to collective defence and to sustaining the military capabilities needed for it. The alliance must be capable of rapid and effective response to serious threats to its security.

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Britain under this Government will be a dependable ally. We will live up to our responsibilities and provide to national defence and to the alliance highly capable forces trained and equipped to meet any threat that might be presented in modern warfare.

4.52 pm

Dr. David Clark (South Shields): I beg to move, to leave out from "House" to the end of the Question, and to add instead thereof:

'declines to support the policy of the Government as set out in the Statement on the Defence Estimates 1996; condemns the instability caused to Britain's armed forces by Government mismanagement; recognises that the UK defence industry is a strategic national asset in both defence and economic terms; notes that the shortfall in the strength of the British Army numbers 4000 personnel; is concerned that the resulting overstretch is undermining the morale and operational effectiveness of the armed forces; condemns the manner in which the defence forces and defence industry are being run down in an ad-hoc and piecemeal way; recognises that the armed forces and defence industry require a long-term strategic overview which can only be achieved through the establishment of a strategic defence review; condemns the continued financial waste and mismanagement by Ministers; urges the Government to take action to address the world landmine crisis and to ban the export, import and transfer of all forms of anti-personnel landmine; urges a positive approach to the comprehensive nuclear test ban treaty negotiations; and congratulates the work carried out by British forces in the defence of Britain and her interests in helping to maintain international stability in peacekeeping operations throughout the world.'.

Over the past few years, I have had the honour of meeting many members of our armed forces both here and abroad and those who support them in the Ministry of Defence and, indeed, the defence industry. The commitment and the skill demonstrated by those people in the service of their country is vital to our overall defence capability.

The expertise and resourcefulness of the men and women who serve in our Army, Navy and Air Force is recognised world wide. Whenever the United Nations requires help, its first port of call is invariably Britain. It is a matter of pride--I know that the Secretary of State agrees with me--that at one time last year more British troops were serving in United Nations forces than troops from any other nation. Currently, our troops are serving, and contributing their knowledge and prowess, in no fewer than 33 countries. That is a matter of pride. I pay tribute to their dedication and commitment, which often truly goes beyond the call of duty. That was tragically brought home to all of us last week when we heard of Warrant Officer James Bradwell. I know that the whole House will join me and the Defence Secretary in condemning the cowardly attack on the Lisburn Army base. Our thoughts are with James Bradwell's family and his loved ones.

I also pay tribute to the people who often do not get any recognition: members of the reserves--more than 1,200 of whom are in Bosnia--and the Royal Fleet Auxiliary, who ply the seas, ensuring that our Royal Navy is able to sail. We really are most fortunate to have them, as I am sure that hon. Members on both sides of the House will agree.

Since taking on the shadow defence portfolio, I have striven to establish consensus, wherever possible, on issues that affect Britain's defence and our security. The Opposition have done that because we believe that it

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should be possible, in many spheres, to strike a bipartisan approach on many of the fundamental issues. Furthermore, many of the decisions that we are taking today will have far-reaching implications, running into many decades to come. Many of the questions to which the Secretary of State alluded--the expansion of NATO, perhaps planning the next attack aircraft for the second quarter of the next century--are matters that different Governments may have to handle. We in the Labour party are willing to offer a consensual approach on the critical matters that affect the security of our country.

In that spirit, I shall make a few comments in support of certain issues in the Defence White Paper. In paragraph 106, emphasis is placed on the need for "collective defence", a point with which the Secretary of State concluded his speech, and a point with which the Labour party concurs whole-heartedly, as I shall try to demonstrate. Labour is completely in agreement with that strategy. The days are gone when we could do everything alone. We are proud that it was a Labour Foreign Secretary, Ernest Bevin, who was the key player in the establishment of NATO, an alliance which, as the Secretary of State agreed, has stood the test of time for more than 50 years. I look forward to the expansion of NATO, as my party says in its documents.

In a sense, the whole thrust of Labour's policy, as outlined in our policy document, is that a secure Britain can be best guaranteed in a secure world, and with the end of the cold war it is imperative that we seek to establish international stability, not only through NATO but through other avenues, such as the United Nations or the Organisation for Security and Co-operation in Europe.

I also support the White Paper's arguments in paragraphs 127-28 against the European Union having responsibility for Britain's defence policy. Again in our policy document we state quite clearly--I shall quote it to the House so that there can be no misconceptions--

"Labour does not support the establishment of a European army or proposals to give the European Union a military competence . . . We believe that efforts to develop a common defence policy should concentrate on strengthening the Western European Union as the European contribution to NATO."

I believe that, with that statement, we are not very distant from the Government.

For that to be realised, however, our European allies must begin to take defence, especially the necessity of spending adequate resources, more seriously. To put it bluntly, NATO can do very little without the involvement of the United States. The UK and France may have considerable resources, but even our actions are limited without American intelligence and airlift and sealift capabilities.