| Previous Section | Index | Home Page |
Mr. Robert Ainsworth (Coventry, North-East): Will the right hon. and learned Gentleman give way?
Mr. Hogg: I shall give way in a moment.
The plain truth is that Labour's record is a disgraceful one. In every debate on BSE--including statements and private notice questions we have had 25 such debates since March--Labour Members, beginning with the hon. Member for Peckham (Ms Harman), have echoed or often simply parroted the most alarmist headlines in the tabloid press. Labour Members have done serious damage to consumer confidence, and, because what they say is played back in Europe, they have made our task much more difficult. Indeed, because of this debate, I cannot today attend the Agriculture Council when beef is being discussed. United Kingdom farmers will not understand Labour undermining their interests in Europe.
Mr. Ainsworth:
I do not know whether the Minister is being deliberately gratuitously offensive to the House--he appears to have been doing so throughout his speech--but, instead of going on in that manner and making the case for our motion, will he get on to defending the Government's record on this catastrophe that has done so much damage to British beef?
Mr. Hogg:
Indeed, I shall get on to defending the Government's record, but before I do it is highly desirable to say something about the Labour party.
In putting down this motion, the Labour party has shown scant regard for the other parties in the House. I have read that there is a close relationship between the Labour leader and the right hon. Member for Yeovil(Mr. Ashdown), but when push came to shove there was no prior consultation about the motion, just the arrogant certainty that the Liberal Democrats--that refuge for the flotsam and jetsam of political life--will meekly follow Labour into the Lobby. No doubt that contemptuous assumption is well founded, but Liberal Democrats need to understand how much they are taken for granted and how little they are regarded by those by whom they sit.
Mr. Mark Robinson (Somerton and Frome):
Does my right hon. and learned Friend agree with the National
Mr. Hogg:
My hon. Friend is absolutely right, and that has happened in every one of the 25 debates or statements that we have had on this subject since March last year. My hon. Friend makes another point--despite the fact that Labour has trivialised the issue and damaged British interests, the subject matter of this debate is of great importance. What I propose to do is to describe in detail where we now stand, and then to respond to some of the criticisms that have been made, both of British policy and of myself personally.
British beef and beef products are the safest in Europe. They can be eaten with total confidence. Our safeguards are stringent and our precautions are comprehensive; we lead where others should follow. Subject to the tightly defined terms of the beef assurance scheme, British beef or beef products sold for human consumption must come from cattle under 30 months of age. We have the tightest feed regulations of any--no rations containing meat or bonemeal can be fed to any other farm animal. Moreover, our controls both in and on the slaughterhouses and the renderers are widely acknowledged to be the most effective in Europe.
Mr. Julian Brazier (Canterbury):
Will my right hon. and learned Friend reassure the people of Kent about the current proposal for a new disposal scheme involving effluent from an animal rendering plant that will feed into my constituency? Can he reassure those people that the new evidence presented by such people as Professor Almond, and currently being considered by an inquiry into the proposal, will be taken very seriously at the highest scientific and political levels in the Government?
Mr. Hogg:
I can indeed give my hon. Friend such a reassurance. Indeed, I can do more: I can tell him that I will ask Professor Pattison and SEAC to consider again--because they have already considered it--whether that kind of disposal mechanism is safe.
Mr. Peter Hardy (Wentworth):
We hope that British beef is safe, and is recognised as such. It has cost the country a great deal of money to establish that.
The Minister seemed to decry the debate, but does he not consider it worth while, given the historical factor? His right hon. Friend the Prime Minister spoke of a thousand years of history. Does the Minister not realise that, in more than a thousand years, the British people have developed an innate genius for producing and dealing in livestock and domestic animals, and that the Government's incompetence and inadequacy has brought that historic record into sheer derision? Does that not justify a debate today?
Mr. Hogg:
It would if that were true, but it is not. If he thinks back to the dark days of last March and contrasts what we thought then with what we see now, the hon. Gentleman will realise how much progress we have made. Consumer confidence here in the United Kingdom is much stronger than consumer confidence in most other
Mr. Barry Sheerman (Huddersfield)
rose--
Mrs. Anne Campbell (Cambridge)
rose--
Mr. Gordon Prentice (Pendle)
rose--
Mr. Hogg:
I want to make some progress, but I will give way again later.
In implementing the measures that I have described, introducing the selective cull and establishing an effective cattle movement and identification scheme, we have complied with all the conditions set out in the Florence agreement. We have done what we said that we would do, and we are now entitled to look to other member states to deliver their side of the bargain. Soon, they will have an opportunity to do so.
The House knows of our proposals for certified herds. They have been prepared, published and available for comment for some time, and we have been working closely with the European Commission on the detailed papers. I myself met Commissioner Fischler at the end of last month. The Government will formally submit those proposals to the Commission at the moment when we are, in my judgment, likely to receive the most favourable response. That will probably be within the next two weeks.
Our proposals for certified herds are general in character, but, because of the low incidence of BSE in Ulster and because of the unique and reliable data base that is available there, they are likely to be of particular benefit to the farmers of Northern Ireland. That is especially true now that the rate at which BSE is occurring in Northern Ireland is lower than the rate in the Republic. I think that that constitutes a response to the hon. Member for Upper Bann (Mr. Trimble). The applications will be general in character, but we will not stand in the way of progress in any part of the United Kingdom.
Mr. Eddie McGrady (South Down):
I thank the Minister most sincerely for giving way on this very important point, fundamental to the future of the beef industry in Northern Ireland, which is a base industry. Is he saying to the House that, in respect of Northern Ireland, which has already completed the four conditions of the Florence convention and within three weeks will be able to complete the fifth requirement, in those circumstances he will proactively ask the Commission and the European Community to allow Northern Irish beef access to Europe in advance of any region that has not fulfilled those requirements?
Mr. Hogg:
The concept of certified herds is general in its application, but in the drafting of the provisions, we had very much in mind the special circumstances that exist in Northern Ireland; because, by the nature of the identification systems, and because of the very low incidence of BSE and because the Republic of Ireland is now experiencing a higher rate of BSE than is the Province, the concept will be especially beneficial to Northern Ireland, and we had that in mind when we prepared those papers. I have no doubt that, in the course
Mr. Hogg:
Now I shall make some progress.
Mr. Hogg:
I want to say something about the state--
Mr. William Ross (East Londonderry)
rose--
Mr. Hogg:
I give way to the hon. Gentleman.
Mr. Ross:
I have listened with great interest to what the Minister has said, but will he tell the House and the farmers in Northern Ireland that he will actually ask that the ban on Northern Irish beef be lifted? That is the key.
| Next Section
| Index | Home Page |