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1.43 pm
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Wales (Mr. Win Griffiths): I congratulate the hon. Member for Ynys Mon (Mr. Jones) on successfully securing this Adjournment debate. I am pleased to have the chance to respond on the important issues that he has raised. They are near to the heart, mouth and stomachs of consumers, who want safe food, and of producers, who provide it. The issue is one of confidence. I am convinced that confidence is justified.
Let me set out our approach to dealing with the impact that BSE has had on the beef industry--especially confidence in British beef. Throughout the crisis, the Spongiform Encephalopathy Advisory Committee has been a source of independent advice. It has advised on a range of precautionary measures to minimise the risk to human health. Scientists can never guarantee that there is no risk, but SEAC's chairman, Professor John Pattison, is on public record as saying:
Mr. Barry Jones (Alyn and Deeside):
The leaders of the NFU in Flintshire were very grateful to my hon. Friend for receiving their recent deputation. The worries continue. The leaders of the National Farmers' Union of Flintshire--Mr. Idris Roberts of Pwll farm in Treuddyn and the farmer who leads the NFU of Flintshire in Carreg y Llech, Mr. Terrig Morgan, also in Treuddyn village, say that they still have considerable worries and urge the Minister and the Government to continue to do everything possible to help their industry.
Mr. Griffiths:
I thank my hon. Friend for that intervention. I hope that what I have to say will be helpful and that other continuing negotiations will prove to be helpful.
The hon. Member for Ynys Mon mentioned the announcement made last week by McDonald's Restaurants that it was resuming use of British beef products in its United Kingdom outlets. I am very encouraged that that decision was taken as a direct response to the views of customers, and I believe that, last night, Burger King made a similar announcement.
In March 1996, directly after the announcement of a possible link between BSE and the new form of CJD, 70 per cent. of people surveyed by McDonald's Restaurants said that they would not buy British beef products. Now, however, there has been a complete reversal. A recent survey showed that 74 per cent. of people wanted McDonald's to sell British beef and it has followed customer preference. I am glad that Burger King has now done the same.
That is clear evidence that consumers' confidence in British beef is returning. Beef consumption as a whole is now only 3 per cent. below pre-crisis levels. In June, sales of beef in Wales were 42 per cent. greater than in the same period in 1996--the highest percentage increase in the United Kingdom.
I turn now to the issue of NHS trusts using British beef. Although NHS trusts are accountable to the Government, it is not our role to dictate what they should or should not do across a wide range of their responsibilities. Into that category falls the source of the beef provided to patients. Decisions about hospital meals are made by local management, in the light of central guidance.
Trusts in Wales as elsewhere, receive guidance on issues such as hygiene and dietary standards and are expected to provide patients with a choice of meals that respects their dietary needs. Information on CJD and BSE has also been sent to trusts, but the use or non-use of British beef has not been stipulated, and is not monitored centrally. However, I can tell the hon. Gentleman that I am receiving anecdotal evidence from trusts that they are reviewing that policy, and I hope that what is said in the Chamber today will give them confidence to make other moves.
The inclusion of beef on the menus of local authority schools is a matter for individual local authorities. They have been advised that there is no reason to withdraw beef from school menus, but they should continue to provide a choice of menu to accommodate different dietary and cultural preferences. I believe that beef can form a part of any well-balanced nutritional diet for our children, and I hope that local education authorities will take that view on board.
Before 20 March 1996, public bodies were under no obligation to restrict their beef supplies to those from Wales--or even from the United Kingdom generally. Indeed, the treaty of Rome prohibits public bodies from discriminating in favour of national interests. Consequently, Governments could not force public bodies to source their beef in Britain, even if they wished to do so. In any event, that should remain a matter for local discretion. Patients in hospitals, and school children and their parents are also consumers. Like McDonald's, trusts and schools that have stopped using British beef will use it again if that is what patients or parents and their children want.
Last summer, under the previous Administration, representations were made to the Ministry of Defence in a bid to reduce the armed forces' dependency on imported beef. The MOD was supportive, but maintained that procurement of any goods should be on the basis of best value for money. The MOD purchases a limited amount of beef, but its decision to buy more imported beef is based on market conditions and suitable distribution services, rather than reaction to BSE. Perhaps the British beef industry should therefore speak to the MOD about how it might play a bigger part in supplying it.
The Government cannot force consumers, whether they be at home, in schools, in hospitals or in the armed forces, to buy and eat British beef.
Our role is to safeguard the public interest and to make sure that the public are aware of the facts so that they can make decisions for themselves. To that end, measures were, and continue to be put, in place to ensure the safety of public health. Cattle suspected of BSE are compulsorily slaughtered and their carcases destroyed. Healthy cattle more than 30 months old may not enter the human food chain--they are slaughtered separately and their remains destroyed.
Milk produced from cows suspected of having BSE may not be used for human consumption, despite the fact that infectivity has not been found in milk. Specified risk materials--the head, brain, spinal cord, tonsils and spleen from cattle over six months, and the thymus and intestines from cattle of any age--may not go into the human food chain.
Those measures are enforced by the Meat Hygiene Service, a Government agency. In addition, the State Veterinary Service makes unannounced audit visits to abattoirs to ensure that the controls are fully enforced.
Mr. Nigel Evans (Ribble Valley):
The Minister says that he will not dictate to public bodies that beef should be on the menu, but will he positively encourage them to put beef back on the menu?
Mr. Griffiths:
I hope that my speech will be a signal of encouragement to public bodies in Wales and the rest of the United Kingdom.
The hon. Member for Ynys Mon will also be aware that the Commission last week announced that it would take action against member states, other than the UK, that fail to enforce adequately the ban of meat and bone materials in feed for ruminants. I welcome the recognition that UK controls are now the strictest in Europe.
I also welcome the Commission's publication of rules for removing risk materials from meat produced throughout the European Union. I very much hope that the Agriculture Council adopts that measure in the near future.
Mr. Richard Livsey (Brecon and Radnorshire):
Will the Minister assure us that if that is not accepted by the Agriculture Council, he will instruct authorities in Wales not to accept beef products from countries that refuse to follow those guidelines?
Mr. Griffiths:
The hon. Member stopped me in my tracks; I was about to consider that very point. I am sure that he knows that the Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food, my right hon. Friend the Member for Copeland (Dr. Cunningham), announced recently that we will apply the same controls to imported meat as we do to our own. This is not a ban on imports--the controls will apply in the United Kingdom--but it will reassure consumers that any beef that they eat here is produced with the same rigorous attention to safety.
We hope that those steps to restore confidence in British beef will be taken on board by the public at large. We know that the final step in restoring full confidence in British beef will be having the export ban lifted.
We have fulfilled the Florence pre-conditions and we now need recognition of the measures taken and sacrifices made. Lifting the ban will not be easy, particularly in the light of the negotiating failures of the last Administration, but we hope that this Government's constructive and positive approach to the Commission's ruling will pay dividends. We are, at this very moment, exploring with the Commission how we can best move forward.
We shall give a detailed technical response to the points made by the EU's scientific veterinary committee on our certified herd proposals very quickly. We recognise that consumers in all member states will be anxious to have full assurances in line with scientific assessment of the risk. At the same time, we will press for the ban's removal where those assurances can be given.
In addition, in order not only to restore the pre-crisis level of beef sales but to increase them, we need to make consumers more aware of the quality and versatility of the product. That can most effectively be done through efficient marketing and promotion activities. The Government are taking steps to promote beef and beef products.
"in any common usage of the word, beef is safe to eat".
That is the starting point for the restoration of consumer confidence in beef.
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