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Mr. Blunkett: As the hon. Gentleman knows, higher education has always been dealt with UK-wide--
Mr. Blunkett: Under the framework of grants and loans. I have said that special consideration will be given to Scotland, where students taking highers have often done only one year before entering university. That is different from the four-year courses that exist south of the border. That is why we have said that special consideration will have to be given.
Mr. Gerry Steinberg (City of Durham): I welcome most of the recommendations of the Dearing report and understand the Government's difficulty with the higher education funding mess that was left by the previous Government, but I am still a little sad that it has been deemed necessary to introduce tuition fees. Will my right hon. Friend convince me that the proposals will increase
access to higher education and that students from working-class backgrounds will have a better opportunity of getting into higher education? If he can convince me of that, I shall support him, but if he cannot, I shall not support him.
Mr. Blunkett: I understand what my hon. Friend is saying. We have a task together over the years ahead to ensure that we pick up the positive recommendations in the early part of the Dearing committee report, which indicate that we should examine--we shall do so over the summer and autumn, and report back to the House--how we can target resources for institutions that are paying specific attention to groups that have been excluded, including those in geographic areas that are massively under-represented. We must also look at the necessary action to be taken within schools and colleges to raise the expectations of those young people and their families.
I want to make it clear that this is not solely about what is now a minority of students who enter higher education at 18 or 19; it is also about encouraging mature students to come back into lifelong learning. We must pay attention to that, if we are not to write off generations that lost the opportunity which we were glad to accept.
Mr. Tim Boswell (Daventry):
Leaving aside the Secretary of State's carefully crafted efforts to conceal the fact that there are now record numbers of students with a better socio-economic participation than ever before, does he agree that the essential issue is the cash that is available for the higher education sector? Given that he has announced what amounts to a deferred student windfall tax, will he give an undertaking to the House that the resources will be fully recycled into the higher education sector?
Mr. Blunkett:
I have given a clear indication this afternoon of the investment in universities and colleges, and the whole purpose of the exercise upon which we are embarking has been to achieve that goal. I want to make it clear that we are not charging students at the time they are students. We are relating what they have to pay to their ability to pay at a point in the future when they have become better off because of the higher education that they have received. Until hon. Members and those outside the House are able to understand that essential point, they will continue to stand on picket lines, mouthing platitudes with the Socialist Workers party.
Mrs. Anne Campbell (Cambridge):
Despite the welcome proposals for alleviating poverty among students from low-income families, does my right hon. Friend accept that some students might be reluctant to take on such a high burden of debt so early in their lives? Has he given any consideration to how the proposals might alter the patterns of demand for higher education, with more students choosing to live at home, more choosing to take advantage of the more generous option for part-time courses than has been available previously and more choosing distance learning--studying from their own homes?
Mr. Blunkett:
My hon. Friend has raised a number of interesting issues, not least that of distance learning, which is a good, not a bad thing. It will be part of aiming learning at the individual rather than at institutions. I think
Mr. Eric Forth (Bromley and Chislehurst):
I welcome the general thrust of the Dearing report and much of what the Secretary of State said. Will he pause and reflect on two things of great importance? May I ask him not necessarily to accept the shibboleth that the more people who go into something called higher education, the better, but to consider whether a university degree is necessarily something that a third of the population or even more can get and that sub-degree qualifications may be more relevant to the idea of lifetime learning and the needs of business? May I ask the right hon. Gentleman also to pause and think further about liberating the institutions and enabling them to consider what fees, whether higher or lower, they wish to charge, in order to provide students with a range of options as to the financial commitment that they might wish to undertake? That would increase student and consumer choice and keep the institutions much more on their toes.
Mr. Blunkett:
I am grateful for the opening remarks of the right hon. Gentleman, as someone who served in the Department for Education and Employment. I cannot agree with his last remarks about universities doing their own thing, for the very reasons that I spelt out earlier. I make it clear that I am not in favour of an ivy league--I want universities to co-operate. I want access to be available for all students--whatever their background, income or geography--to all institutions without a top-up fee. I believe that we can achieve that. We can achieve it on the back of the decisions that we are taking, so that we can raise and invest the money necessary to make it possible.
Mr. Gordon Marsden (Blackpool, South):
As someone who taught for a number of years in the Open university, I am sure that students there and elsewhere will be reassured by my right hon. Friend's emphasis on that sector. We shall look for further details in due course. May I ask specifically what consideration he has given and what proposals he currently has to give extra help to those who are already facing hardship within the maintenance system?
Mr. Blunkett:
Sir Ron raises the issue of how we might extend the available hardship payments. I am very sympathetic to looking at the transition between the present system--the mish-mash that currently exists--and the new system as we introduce it. It would be fair to do that.
Mr. Roy Beggs (East Antrim):
While I believe that access to loan funds is no substitute for grants to students, I nevertheless welcome the Secretary of State's statement
Mr. Blunkett:
I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman. I am aware of the different circumstances in Northern Ireland, including the higher take-up rate of higher education in working-class communities and the need to be able to sustain that. The proposals that we lay out will apply to all European Union citizens, and one of the ironies may well be a cross-border flow into the Republic, rather than the other way round, on a temporary basis. However, I understand that the students unions in the Republic are not happy with the system that was introduced two or three years ago, on the ground that we are advocating this afternoon--that it is not raising the status, standing and quality of teaching in the Republic. We might, therefore, be able to resolve the issues raised by the hon. Gentleman in a positive fashion.
Mr. Barry Sheerman (Huddersfield):
I congratulate my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State and the whole of the Dearing team, including the Policy Studies Institute and others, who have produced the report, although I have not had the benefit of reading it. My right hon. Friend has said that we have grasped the nettle. That nettle was too difficult for the right hon. Member for Charnwood (Mr. Dorrell) to grasp. How do we fund higher education for a new swathe of young people in our country? Every piece of research that I have read shows that the money has to come from the beneficiary: the taxpayer cannot and will not pay it, but the beneficiary should pay it, because he or she gets an education that fits him or her for life. That is one of Dearing's central principles, and it is a good one.
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