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Mr. Öpik: One of the greatest things about living in Montgomeryshire is that it is such a beautiful place: unspoilt, with such a good quality of life that--[Interruption.] I shall deal in a moment with wind farms, although I am not terribly convinced that the hon. Member for Ceredigion (Mr. Dafis) was entirely feasible on the subject. [Interruption.] With the potential exception of wind farms, the view is quite nice, if one looks on misty days or in certain directions--
Mr. Elfyn Llwyd (Meirionnydd Nant Conwy): Yes--towards Meirionnydd.
Mr. Öpik: I shall take the hon. Gentleman's advice and look toward Meirionnydd, and be grateful that I do not have even more wind farms than I currently have.
6.45 pm
The quality of life in Montgomeryshire is good. In the rural areas of Wales, that quality of life is determined largely by the cleanliness and rejuvenating nature of those areas. I agree with the suggestion of the hon. Member for Ceredigion that we could use an environmental theme as a branding point for Wales. In the company that I formerly worked for, Procter and Gamble--I stress that I have no vested interest in saying this--
Mr. Öpik:
Yes, it has a very white image, even at today's lower temperatures. It woke up to the fact--[Interruption.] It awoke--
Mr. Öpik:
I shall take the Secretary of State's advice and ignore the comments on Procter and Gamble, which realised that there was a marketing opportunity in being serious about the environment. The same is true for the Welsh assembly and for all of Wales.
We should remember that Wales, particularly rural Wales, is experiencing difficult times economically--it is perhaps even in a deep recession. In the past two months, we have lost almost 100 jobs in Montgomeryshire. Therefore, there is a most urgent employment and economic aspect to including environmental considerations in decision making. Perhaps we could tie in our work on the environment with job creation. However, I shall not dwell on that matter, as it diverts from the main point dealt with in this group of amendments and new clauses.
We should remember also that we are not debating sustainability simply as a nice-to-have policy: it will crucially determine our descendants' quality of life. If we do not wake up to the fact that, as a society, we must include sustainability in our strategic outlook, we shall--at the very least--bequeath serious problems to future generations, and they will have to pay dearly to clean them up.
Wales has great opportunities in many spheres such as energy, which has already been mentioned in the debate. I whole-heartedly support any suggestions that hydro- electric and solar energy should be pursued emphatically as alternative energy sources.
I must now refer to wind power, which--although it has a place--has been non-strategically implemented. In Montgomeryshire, we have had the most terrible divisions in local communities, for the simple reason that wind turbines are a form of pollution. It is incorrect to suggest that there is no social or environmental cost to covering hillsides with wind turbines. I recognise that there is benefit in having a sensitive approach to wind farm power generation, and there might be some creative solutions that offend no one--for example, coastal farms could make a substantial contribution. However, we should make it clear that a visual scar on a hillside should be regarded as every bit as damaging as some other forms of environmental pollution.
The hon. Member for Ribble Valley (Mr. Evans) made some good points about noise and other concerns. It may not always be possible to quantify them in financial terms,
but if we are serious about sustainable energy production, we must also be serious about taking into account the more unusual consequences of investing in, for example, wind turbines. There are also some concerns about safety. I am currently holding discussions with at least one of the wind farm companies, because there was recently a fire at a wind turbine. I dwell on that point only because I do not want the Committee to be misled into thinking that there are no social or environmental consequences of wind farm generation. Having said that, I believe that it is appropriate for the Welsh assembly to consider how best to mix its energy generation solutions in the context of a green Welsh agenda.
We sometimes forget that if we could reduce the need for energy, we could adopt an even more sustainable approach. We could have greatly reduced our energy needs in the United Kingdom, as could western society as a whole, if, in the early stages of planning buildings and an integrated transport system, we had thought of the environmental consequences of what we were doing. In that sense, we should encourage the Welsh assembly in its deliberations on sustainability to adopt a formal strategy for reducing energy requirements across Wales, thereby obviating the need for quite so much energy production.
In the context of sustainability, I shall deal briefly with transport, brown-field development and agriculture. We all agree that we must create an integrated public transport system, and I applaud Ministers' comments in that regard. I must point out, as I always do when I mention transport, that there are potentially substantial environmental benefits to be gained from having an integrated air network across Wales. A well-used twin-engine commercial aircraft can use less energy getting people from north to south Wales than a car, which is probably the alternative.
It goes without saying, of course, that any such network would be guaranteed success if it used what I hope will one day be Welshpool international, or at least regional, airport. I have nothing but praise for Ministers' enlightened attitude to that proposal, which I have made many times.
We have discussed various aspects of creating a sustainable economy in the countryside. As I said at the beginning of my remarks, it is vital to recognise that the crisis in agriculture also presents Wales with an opportunity to invest in agri-environmental schemes, which might create not only jobs but a sustainable agri-environmental strategy. I hope that the Welsh assembly will be absolutely wedded to the idea of creating a more sustainable agricultural environment.
We might even recognise that having a sustainable environment in the countryside might not mean having the most efficient system in terms of the number of people employed on the land. We might want to increase the number involved in producing food, on the basis that that might be the most sustainable way to run the countryside.
I deal now with brown-field sites. I agree with hon. Members who have suggested developing the perhaps slightly more expensive brown-field sites rather than running to the countryside when we need new buildings and areas for industry. I must sound a word of caution, however. Our policies for sustainability have to recognise
that some development on green-field sites is necessary. We have to strike a careful balance between the need for rural housing and the necessity of not giving in to the temptation to build on green-field sites when brown-field sites are available.
Finally, I shall cite a rather persuasive document provided by the Royal Society for the Protection of Birds. It states that sustainable development
New clause 38 will greatly improve the Bill. Proposed subsection (6) states:
The future will be our judge, but we have a great deal to be responsible for at this point. We must ensure that the Welsh assembly cannot run away from some of the difficult decisions that it must make with regard to the environment. If we carry out the actions that go with our fine words, we have a good chance of achieving the dream of the hon. Member for Ceredigion, which is to create an attractive brand image of Wales as a green and pleasant place.
Mr. Martin Caton (Gower):
Like all hon. Members who have spoken, I warmly welcome new clause 38. The requirement on the assembly to carry out its functions with
Sustainable development has become one of the buzz phrases of the past decade. Like much terminology that becomes fashionable, it is in danger of losing its real meaning in knee-jerk repetition. The thought discipline and philosophy that gave birth to the concept risk being lost behind the jargon. People legitimately ask, "Are there theories at the bottom of your jargon?" To be honest, one of the problems with sustainable development might be that there is a whole family of theories at the bottom of our jargon.
Definitions range from "an intention to maintain and even accelerate economic growth, while seeking to protect the environment as far as possible" through to "a commitment to leave future generations with the same capacity as now for improving human well-being by living within this planet's environmental limits". Like the hon. Member for Ceredigion (Mr. Dafis), I think that we should be aiming to move towards the latter. However, despite the breadth of interpretation, I would not want to narrow the term "sustainable development" any further in the Bill.
I believe that it will be up to the assembly clearly to identify its objectives for environmental protection and improvement when it establishes the scheme that the new clause requires. It will then be up to Members of the Assembly to make sure that, in every aspect of their work, their environmental objectives, as set out in the scheme, are adhered to.
"means pursuing those options for development which maximise the benefits for present and future generations."
It goes on to mention the quality of life, an integrated approach and landscape improvement. All those things underline the importance of taking account of the big picture. We must think of the environment not as a separate issue, but as one which should affect all the work of the assembly.
"After each financial year of the Assembly, the Assembly shall publish a report of how its proposals as set out in the scheme were implemented in that financial year."
They are perhaps the most important words that we are debating. I should like to think that they are our insurance policy, to ensure that the Bill's provisions do not simply end up as more rhetoric about the environment, but are implemented.
"due regard to the principle that sustainable development should be promoted"
is an historic measure in the constitutional history of this country.
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