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The Prime Minister: No. The nomination is for eight years. At the press conference after the summit, I was
directly asked what would happen if Mr. Duisenberg decided to stay for eight years. The answer is that he would stay for eight years. As I keep trying patiently to point out, he said well before Mr. Trichet's candidature was even suggested that he did not want to stay beyond the launch of the euro, so we have a situation that is perfectly consistent with the treaty. He has said, "I will at least stay until the euro is properly launched, but I won't stay after that, because I do not wish to." He also made it clear in his statement that there is no obligation; he will choose the time of his leaving, but he thought it right to say to the Council, "If you nominate me for eight years, I will not serve the full eight years." That is perfectly reasonable.
The answer to the right hon. and learned Gentleman's question on the French nomination is no. The nomination process has to be gone through, and the French nomination has to be agreed formally by the Council. Mr. Duisenberg and Mr. Trichet are both highly credible, which is why the deal is a good deal. To have ended up blocking Mr. Duisenberg's candidature would have been a disaster for Europe and for Britain. The right hon. and learned Gentleman should imagine the situation had the markets opened on Monday with no agreement on the central bank. At one point on Saturday, it seemed as if that would be the case.
Mr. Giles Radice (North Durham):
Does my right hon. Friend agree that the weekend summit was an enormously important event--an historic event--marking, as it did, the real start of the single currency, with 11 participating countries, with the agreement on conversion rates and with, yes, a compromise on the presidency of the central bank, brokered by my right hon. Friend, which will ensure that for 12 years the ECB will be led by two highly respected--as I know--central bankers? Do not the critics have to say what the alternative is to the deal brokered by my right hon. Friend at the weekend? Many of us would like the United Kingdom to join EMU as soon as possible.
The Prime Minister:
I shall not repeat our position on EMU, because we have already made it clear. My hon. Friend is right to say that the launch of the euro is an historic occasion, and he was right to say what he did about the presidency of the central bank. As I say, the problem is that there is the inconvenient fact that Mr. Duisenberg had made it clear throughout that he did not want to serve his full eight-year term, which all the comment has missed. That is the central fact and that is why the argument would always be not whether he left early, because he was making it clear that he would, but whether he was obliged to do so and would be given a specific date on which to leave, which was the position of some countries, or one country at least, or whether, which was our position and that of many others, and Mr. Duisenberg himself, although he would leave early, he could not be obligated to do so because that would be a breach of the treaty.
Mr. William Cash (Stone):
Will the Prime Minister explain why he thinks that there is no constitutional barrier in the United Kingdom to going ahead with economic and monetary union, and does he seriously believe that Mr. Duisenberg is telling the truth when he says that he would be perfectly happy to stand down? Is not that just an example of a total sham, which
The Prime Minister:
The problem is that those who adopt the hon. Gentleman's position, which he holds entirely honourably, simply will not accept any facts that get in the way of their arguments.
Let me read again what Mr. Duisenberg said in November 1996. [Interruption.] I shall deal with the hon. Gentleman's other point as well, but he effectively alleged that Mr. Duisenberg was not telling the truth when he said that he wanted to go earlier. In November 1996, before any other candidate was ever raised, Mr. Duisenberg said:
The Prime Minister:
The reason is that he is president of the European Monetary Institute--[Interruption.] That is a fact. He is charged with the preparations of the euro. It therefore makes perfect sense, albeit for a shorter time, to have him then oversee the actual mechanics of launching the euro. Although everyone always knew that his candidature would be shorter than the eight-year period because of his own desire to leave earlier, he was, none the less, the right candidate.
When it is then asked why it took 10 hours to reach that position, the answer is that it did not take 10 hours to persuade Mr. Duisenberg to go early. In the very first conversation that I had with him on Saturday, he said again that he would leave before his full term. The reason for the discussion was the insistence of one country that he should be obliged to go early, and that was what was unacceptable.
In relation to monetary union and the constitutional barrier, I say that there is no insuperable constitutional barrier because, although there are constitutional questions of sovereignty, the issue in the end is whether that is an absolute barrier. If it is an absolute barrier, the position of the hon. Gentleman's party--saying, "We might join after 10 years"--is absurd. I know that that is not his position; he is the leader of the other Conservative party. However, it is an absurd position. We must decide first of all whether or not the constitutional question is an insuperable barrier. He says yes; I say no. I say that, in the end, if it is in the interests of British jobs, investment and industry, we do it; if it is not, we do not.
Dr. George Turner (North-West Norfolk):
Does my right hon. Friend agree that the successful launch of a common currency is in the interests of all the industrialists who have been concerned about the high exchange rate? Does he agree that the actions of the Conservative party seem to be designed to discourage a successful launch of the currency, and are, therefore, against the interests of British industry and the British people? Does he further agree that this country needs to ask whether, although the City of London may be prepared for a common currency, our business and industry are properly prepared? Are we prepared not only for the challenges, but for the opportunities that it will present?
The Prime Minister:
My hon. Friend is absolutely right. The problem with Opposition Members is that
Yes, the City is largely prepared, but business and industry have far more preparation to undertake; that is why we are organising that now. They will deal with many companies and trading partners that will be dealing in the euro. Some people in this country will decide to deal in the euro. I have no doubt that people and businesses here will end up taking the euro. It is important that we make proper preparations, and that is precisely what the Chancellor is doing.
Sir Teddy Taylor (Rochford and Southend, East):
Is not the real disaster for Europe the emergency of an army of 18 million unemployed, and the upsurge in the racial filth parties in France and Germany that always seems to go with mass unemployment? Will the Prime Minister remind his colleagues in Europe that when Britain endeavoured to get involved in this kind of thing with the exchange rate mechanism, we had to create an extra half a million unemployed? Will he make a point of reminding his colleagues in Europe that every attempt in the world to form a common currency among a number of countries--as in Scandinavia, Europe, Africa and Asia--has collapsed in massive unemployment and misery? Will he appeal to his colleagues in Europe to think about facts, about people and about the unemployed, instead of going ahead with what, quite honestly, appears to be utter nonsense?
The Prime Minister:
Obviously, we shall not agree on the single currency, but I understand that unemployment in Europe is the big challenge. That is why we are putting forward a series of proposals, and making unemployment the main subject of the Cardiff Council. Of course there are countries, some of which propose to be part of the euro, which have low unemployment rates. One should not think that every country that wants to join the euro has high unemployment. It is important for us to have the right investment and education skills, and the necessary flexibility and encouragement of small businesses. We must be at the forefront in all those things.
"I will not stop after 3 months nor after 2 years, but my guarantee does not go beyond that. One has to be realistic and not forget about one's age."
Mr. Cash:
Why have him as a candidate?
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