PROCEEDINGS OF THE COMMITTEE RELATING
TO THE REPORT
TUESDAY 23 JUNE 1998
Members present:
Mr Donald Anderson, in the Chair
| Mrs Virginia Bottomley |
Mr Andrew Mackinlay |
| Mr Norman A Godman |
Mr Ernie Ross |
| Mr David Heath | Mr Ted Rowlands
|
| Mr Eric Illsley | Sir John Stanley
|
The Committee deliberated.
Draft Report (Sierra Leone: Further Exchanges of
Correspondence with the Foreign Secretary) brought up and read
the first time.
Ordered,
That the draft Report be read a second time, paragraph by paragraph.
Paragraph 1 read, amended, and agreed to.
Paragraphs 2 to 4 read and agreed to.
Paragraph 5 read, as follows:
The Committee welcomes the Secretary of State's willingness
to make available summaries of the telegrams and to allow nominated
members of the Committee to verify that summary by reference to
the documents themselves, following the precedent of the Pergau
inquiry. It also welcomes the Secretary of State's willingness,
as set out in his letter to the Chairman of 15 June, to consider
specific requests to extend the offer in his letter of 1 June
to other categories of documents in addition to telegrams on the
matters covered by Sir Thomas Legg's report. However, the Secretary
of State remains unwilling to release this or any other information
which falls within the remit of Sir Thomas Legg's investigation
while it is in progress.
Amendment proposed, in line 9, at the end, to add
the words "While the Committee is firmly of the opinion that
there is a presumption that Ministers should, promptly and fully,
comply with reasonable requests for information properly sought
by a Select Committee in pursuit of the responsibilities given
to it by the House, and that the present request clearly falls
into that category, it believes that, for the reasons set out
below, it should - at least, for the moment - acquiesce in the
Secretary of State's position.".—(Mr Norman A Godman.)
Question put, That the Amendment
be made.
The Committee divided.
| Ayes, 3
| Noes, 5
|
| |
| Mr Norman A Godman |
Mrs Virginia Bottomley |
| Mr Eric Illsley | Mr David Heath
|
| Mr Ernie Ross | Mr Andrew Mackinlay
|
| Mr Ted Rowlands
|
| Sir John Stanley
|
Question put, That the paragraph
stand part of the Report.
The Committee divided.
| Ayes, 5
| Noes, 3
|
| |
| Mrs Virginia Bottomley
| Mr Norman A Godman |
| Mr David Heath | Mr Eric Illsley
|
| Mr Andrew Mackinlay |
Mr Ernie Ross |
| Mr Ted Rowlands |
|
| Sir John Stanley |
|
Ordered, That further
consideration of the Chairman's draft Report be now adjourned.
Report to be further considered this day when the
Chairman has resumed the Chair.
In the absence of the Chairman, Sir John Stanley
was called to the Chair.
Motion made, That during the evidence session with
Sir John Kerr, no questions be asked about matters currently before
the Legg inquiry relating to Sierra Leone.—(Mr Ernie
Ross.)
Sir John Stanley left the Chair, whereupon Mr Ted
Rowlands was called to the Chair.
Question proposed, That during the evidence session
with Sir John Kerr, no questions be asked about matters currently
before the Legg inquiry relating to Sierra Leone:- Debate arising;
Motion, by leave, withdrawn.
Mr Donald Anderson resumed the Chair.
Consideration of the Chairman's draft Report resumed.
Paragraph 6 read, as follows:
The Committee considers that it is wrong in principle
for the Executive to seek unilaterally to impose prior conditions
on the release of information properly sought by a Select Committee
in pursuit of the responsibilities given to it by the House. As
the material sought from the Secretary of State by the Foreign
Affairs Committee unequivocally falls into this category, the
Committee now asks the House to endorse its request to the Secretary
of State, as set out in the Chairman's letter of 11 June.
Amendment proposed, in line 3, to leave out from
the word "House" to the end of line 6 and insert the
words "The views of the House are sought.".—(Sir
John Stanley.)
Question put, That the Amendment be made.
The Committee divided.
| Ayes, 5
| Noes, 2
|
| |
| Mrs Virginia Bottomley
| Mr Norman A Godman |
| Mr David Heath | Mr Ernie Ross
|
| Mr Andrew Mackinlay |
|
| Mr Ted Rowlands |
|
| Sir John Stanley |
|
Another Amendment proposed, in line 6, at the end
to add the words "at an early date".—(Mr David
Heath.)
Question put, That the Amendment be made.
The Committee divided.
| Ayes, 4
| Noes, 2
|
| |
| Mrs Virginia Bottomley
| Mr Norman A Godman |
| Mr David Heath | Mr Ernie Ross
|
| Mr Andrew Mackinlay |
|
| Sir John Stanley |
|
Question put, That the paragraph, as amended, stand
part of the Report.
The Committee divided.
| Ayes, 5
| Noes, 2
|
| |
| Mrs Virginia Bottomley
| Mr Norman A Godman |
| Mr David Heath | Mr Ernie Ross
|
| Mr Andrew Mackinlay |
|
| Mr Ted Rowlands |
|
| Sir John Stanley |
|
Motion made, and Question put, That the Report, as
amended, be the Second Special Report of the Committee to the
House.
The Committee divided.
| Ayes, 5
| Noes, 2
|
| |
| Mrs Virginia Bottomley
| Mr Norman A Godman |
| Mr David Heath | Mr Ernie Ross
|
| Mr Andrew Mackinlay |
|
| Mr Ted Rowlands |
|
| Sir John Stanley |
|
Ordered, That the Chairman
do make the Report to the House.
The Committee further deliberated.
Sir John Kerr KCMG, Permanent Under-Secretary of
State, Mr Francis Richards CMG, CVO, Deputy Under-Secretary of
State and Mr Roland Smith CMG, Director for International Security,
Foreign and Commonwealth Office, were further examined. Mr Rob
Young CMG, Chief Clerk and Mr Michael Arthur CMG, Director, Resources,
Foreign and Commonwealth Office, were examined.
Mrs Virginia Bottomley declared a non-pecuniary interest
as a Vice-Chairman of the British Council.
On the following Question being asked by Sir John
Stanley:—
"Sir John, I must put it to you that I have
the terms of reference of the Legg Inquiry in front of me and
the Legg Inquiry terms of reference relate to "allegations
about government involvement with the supply of arms to Sierra
Leone by UK citizens or firms". I am not asking you, Permanent
Under-Secretary, about the supply of arms, quite clearly; I am
asking you about the issue of military advice, which is quite
different. I am asking you, Sir John, to respond on the question
of whether military advice was given to the Government of Sierra
Leone in exile."
Mr Ernie Ross objected to the Question.
The witnesses withdrew.
The Committee further deliberated.
Motion made and Question proposed, That the Question
be put to the witnesses.—(Sir John Stanley):- Debate
arising;
Motion made and Question put, That the Committee
do now adjourn until Tuesday 30 June at half past Nine o'clock.—(Mr
Ernie Ross.)
The Committee divided.
| Ayes, 4
| Noes, 3
|
| |
| Mr Norman A Godman |
Mrs Virginia Bottomley |
| Mr Eric Illsley | Mr David Heath
|
| Mr Andrew Mackinlay |
Sir John Stanley |
| Mr Ernie Ross |
|
[Adjourned till Tuesday 30 June at half past
Nine o'clock.
| 
