Examination of Witnesses (Questions 200
- 206)
WEDNESDAY 4 JUNE 1998MRS
M HUMPHREYS, OAM, MR
I THWAITES, MR
DSPICER, THE HON MRS
J TAYLOR, MR
M DALTON, MR J
HENNESSEY, MR
N JOHNSTON and MRS P
IRELAND.
Chairman
200. I began the session by asking a fairly basic
question about why this whole area has been a kind of secret,
a political secret. Before we conclude, may I put to you a question
which I put to the Department of Health last week when we had
them here as witnesses? I gain the impression, rightly or wrongly,
that there has been some attempt at a fairly high level to keep
this matter quiet in Britain. I do not want to be specific about
who may have been involved in that. I wonder whether you, before
we conclude, would like to be specific as to what your thoughts
are on that particular issue. I am putting this primarily to Mrs
Humphreys and her colleagues from the Trust.
(Mrs Humphreys) I can
only answer it with a question. The question is: why are we here
10 years down the track when so many child migrants 10 years ago
had such hope, such possibilities of knowing who they were, of
being given their identity, meeting their families. I am answering
it in this way. The question is: why have we not been funded?
That has to tell us something on this issue where 10 years have
passed and we are sitting here. 201. Are we making assumptions?
Do we have any concrete evidence that efforts have been made,
possibly by churches, by agencies, in respect of the Government,
successive Governments, to avoid this matter being looked at and
avoid the acceptance of responsibility for what has gone on here?
Do we have any concrete evidence? (Mr Spicer) It would be
rather naive, would it not, to approach this without having an
assumption that networks are operating within the areas which
would normally address these things. I do not think we have evidence
of specifics and I really have to repeat Mrs Humphreys' question.
Why has the issue, when it has touched the hearts of the population—and
we know that because whenever there is an issue of publicity concerning
this matter, we get deluged with enquiries and information, not
just from families of former child migrants but from the general
public who cannot believe that these things were happening ...
Those of us from a generation where we may well have been sent,
could recognise circumstances in which our families might well
be persuaded by people they considered to be in positions of authority
that this was a better option. So we all feel it could have been
us to some degree and to some extent. You are quite right, you
have to ask why it has not been seized upon as an issue. I referred
to it as an issue of injustice previously because at the heart
of it there are so many issues of justice in relation to this
special group of people which have to be dealt with. Why has it
not been seized upon, taken up and dealt with within a fairly
short period of time, which it could have been with appropriate
funding once the issue was drawn to the attention of governments,
principally by Mrs Humphreys, but of course the other people associated
with the Trust. 202. Before we conclude, I am conscious that some
of the witnesses may wish to add points on areas we have not touched
upon which perhaps you thought we might touch upon and you feel
are important. I know Mrs Taylor has not been brought in so far
and she may wish to make a short statement. Could I appeal for
them to be short statements because obviously we should like to
conclude fairly soon?
(Mrs Taylor) I was really here in case anyone wanted me
to say why Nottinghamshire County Council was involved in this.
Dr Brand203.
We are just grateful; we do not question it. (Mrs Taylor) You
have heard the stories today. If someone came to you and said
these are the problems, what should they do about it, you cannot
walk away and Nottinghamshire County Council has not walked away.
I have to say you know as well as I do the pressures on local
government at the moment. At the moment there are nearly £50,000
in Nottinghamshire County Council's budget to assist the Child
Migrants' Trust. Last year, because of lack of funding from anywhere
except the pittance from the Department of Health, they found
£95,000. A local authority, even Nottinghamshire County Council,
cannot keep on finding those resources. To ensure the extra work—and
you must be aware of the extra work that this inquiry has involved
the Trust in—we had to go cap in hand to Nottinghamshire
County Council to give us the money to assist your inquiry. They
were very generous and have done so but there is a limit. The
work of the Trust has to continue. It has to continue. As you
have heard, it is the only independent group dealing with this
work. We cannot continue being the conscience of the United Kingdom.
The Government has to take on adequate funding. Let me tell you
that our funding is totally inadequate for the work which needs
to be done but at least it keeps the Trust ticking over. The funding
we give is totally inadequate. I just make that plea on behalf
of Nottinghamshire.Dr Brand: May I put my appreciation for the
efforts of Nottinghamshire County Council on the record? It really
contrasts tremendously with either the conspiracy or the complacency
which is demonstrated by the Department of Health, which we touched
on last week.
Chairman204.
Do any of the witnesses wish to add anything at all before we
conclude? (Mr Hennessey) Just another photograph which I
forgot to give you. That is a photo of the first migrants. You
will be able to pick me out in happier days. 205. We shall be happy
to look at it. (Mr Hennessey) The sad part of it is that
two of them have committed suicide, two of them have passed away
never having had a chance to come back home. (Mrs Humphreys)
I should like to finish our evidence on this note and to say
that my plea to this Committee is perfectly simple. It is time
to start treating former child migrants as first class citizens
who deserve a first class service. Here I have a letter which
has been written by MatthewDalton's daughter. I do not intend
to read it out at the moment but I should very much like you and
your Committee to read the message which Matthew's daughter has
sent to all of you. 206. We can possibly have that published as
evidence if she would be prepared to allow that. (Mrs Humphreys)
Yes, she would.[1]
(Mr Spicer) May I say
something and this is credit to the people who have worked for
the Trust during the period of time since its inception? It has
obviously often been at enormous personal cost. Members of staff
have worked unpaid when the funding of the Trust was low. These
comments apply to former people who have worked for the Trust
and current ones as well. It has been a struggle and it has been
at cost to individuals and families.
(Mr Dalton) A clarification on Mr Gunnell's
question to the Trust on why the child migrants go to the Trust
after they have been to the other bodies. The simple reason is
that they have had 51 years to do what they were supposed to do
in the first place and we as child migrants feel the Trust in
its confidentiality is the body we can go to with complete trust
and no information is given to anyone but the person who has approached
the Trust. No-one is forced to go to the Trust, I might add. The
reason why there are dribs and drabs coming into the Trust is
the word from fellows like ourselves who go out and tell them
how confidential the Trust is. We could not do that with the migrating
bodies. As soon as you go to them with a request, it is around
the place and everyone knows you have been there. I cannot say
that about the Trust. Complete confidentiality is the thing.Chairman:
May I on behalf of the Committee sincerely thank you all for your
evidence this morning, for your written evidence and particularly
for your oral evidence. I think my colleagues would wish me in
particular to thank Mrs Ireland and the three former migrants.
We do appreciate that it has taken great courage personally to
express yourselves to the Committee in the way you have done today.
We genuinely appreciate the way you have been able to put across
your feelings and background and experiences to us today. I am
sure that will be very relevant to the outcome of this inquiry.
Thank you very much.
1 See p.114.
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