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Mr. Redwood: The right hon. Lady obviously did not listen to my remarks. I said that the Opposition accept basic standards at work in legislation. We left many of those standards in place when we were removed from office. I would be delighted if rights such as she describes could be negotiated. My worry is that, if we legislate too far, too fast, we will create more stresses for people in the workplace and give a real right only to those with money,
who have the freedom that money can buy, rather than to those who genuinely need the salary and the job, which are at risk in the negotiation.
Mr. Brady: Labour Members have suggested several worthy cases in which employees might seek time off for domestic incidents. One of the main concerns is the gold-plating of the directive in the Bill. As it is presently drafted, it is not clear whether an employee could seek time off because his cat was poorly or because the washing machine was leaking. That is not in the Bill. How are businesses to know what costs they will face?
Mr. Redwood: Echoing my hon. Friend, the CBI is extremely worried about the phrase "domestic incidents". What does that mean? It is rather different from a family emergency, and it is in the Bill. That is exactly the sort of issue that will have to be probed in Committee before we can say whether it is a good idea or a reasonable idea. The vagueness of the provisions is alerting industry to the potential damage that they can do. That naturally makes us reluctant to give a clear answer on the detail, as the Government themselves are so befuddled about the detail.
Mr. John Townend (East Yorkshire): We hear a lot from the Government about the rights of employees. Small and medium-sized businesses will have the greatest difficulty. How is a firm expected to operate if its one representative wants to go off on a three-month trek with his six-year-old child? Is the firm expected to make no sales for three months?
Mr. Redwood: A lot of businesses have written to or e-mailed me on that very point, and I am grateful to my hon. Friend for introducing it at this juncture.
What is there in the Bill to reassure the cashmere workers of Scotland, who face the sack thanks to the Government's mishandling of trade relations with the United States through their friends in Brussels?
Mr. Byers:
I am grateful to the right hon. Gentleman for giving way yet again. He made some comments about the position at Longbridge and Rover which need to be clarified. I am very concerned that BMW, on reading his comments, will look critically at the position at Longbridge, and I am sure that that was not his intention. The Government are doing all they can to secure employment at Longbridge. We are making the strongest possible representations to BMW to secure that.
There is nothing in the Bill that weakens the Longbridge case and I hope that, on reflection, the right hon. Gentleman will withdraw those comments, which will be misinterpreted, which will put 14,000 jobs at Longbridge at risk and which run the risk of creating the meltdown in manufacturing in the west midlands about which he pleads such concern.
Mr. Redwood:
I will accept that as an offer from the Secretary of State that he will ensure that the Bill is amended so that nothing in it causes extra costs to BMW and Longbridge. On that basis, I happily consent to say that the Bill must not cause any damage, and I accept his word that he will make sure that it will not. If he checks
I urge the Secretary of State to look again at those issues. If he could offer more hope on them to BMW-Rover, that would greatly strengthen the case that he and I both want to put to the management because we want that car production in this country--we want that commitment--and we respect what the management and the work force have been doing in Britain. However, I hope that he will not ignore the plight of the cashmere workers, which I shall go on to discuss.
It takes a special kind of talent to end up with jobs in the cashmere industry at risk because of a dispute about bananas. Why have the Government not made Brussels see sense on that? How have they got themselves into such a damaging row with friends and trading partners across the Atlantic, who are so important to many jobs here at home? How much fairness at work will there be for workers in that industry if they lose their jobs as a result of that trade dispute?
Perhaps the new Secretary of State believes, along with the right hon. Member for Hartlepool, that basic industry is doomed. They clearly believe that old industry has no place in new Labour's Britain. They want us all toiling by the internet and pager, rather than in the foundry and on the assembly line. They seem to think that the media business is the highest calling and politics the second highest. They advise the aspiring to become apprentice spin doctors, and they counsel against the mills and foundries. They cannot even create fairness at work in the new industries.
Mr. O'Neill:
There are about 500 cashmere workers in my constituency, who spin the yarn at Todd and Duncan in Kinross. The work force are predominantly female. The workers have trade union rights and a number of the measures enshrined in the Bill apply, and they certainly do not want the choice of abuse of Brussels or decent working conditions. They want a decent settlement and good working conditions, and they do not want the Opposition dividing the Government on their intention to achieve both.
Mr. Redwood:
I trust that the hon. Gentleman agrees that the Secretary of State should get on and solve that trade dispute before it spirals out of control. The Secretary of State must know that a lot of jobs are at risk in that industry because of the retaliatory action taken by the United States of America in response to the attitude of the Government and the Brussels government towards these trading matters.
I am not expressing a view on that dispute; I am saying that it should not have got out of control in this way. It reflects badly on the Government's influence in Brussels, and on the diplomacy of the Government and the European government, that those jobs in Scotland, which should not be at risk and are totally unrelated to the issue of bananas, are at risk.
We are threatened in the case--[Interruption.] Labour Members should not laugh about that matter. The possible job losses are serious and, for those in the banana trade, the issue of bananas is serious as well.
The Government are now threatening to damage electronic commerce. Having decided to highlight the industry's success, they cannot resist the urge to meddle.
They are consulting businesses to see what they should put in their legislation. It is another Labour example of a Bill in search of a policy. The Secretary of State is a trumpet player in search of some sheet music to play. It never occurs to him that electronic commerce may be growing so quickly because Governments have not yet logged on hundreds of new regulations for that industry.
Have the Government appointed either the digital envoy or the e-envoy that we were promised by the Secretary of State's predecessor? What mischief do they have in mind, or will the Secretary of State cancel two jobs that I should like to see cancelled? I would congratulate him if he were to announce that the digital envoy and the e-envoy are no more.
At least the new Secretary of State has been forced to remove the words "fairness at work" from his legislation. He would have broken trade description law if he had been allowed to retain that phrase. How much fairness is there in the proposal that a father should be allowed unpaid paternity leave? I dare say that a Labour millionaire with an offshore trust would welcome that measure, but if a father is struggling to pay a mortgage on £300 or £400 a week and faces the many bills that a new baby undoubtedly brings, the last thing he can afford is a period of unpaid leave. How can he buy the pushchair and the other items that are needed when the baby arrives?
Mr. Bill Etherington (Sunderland, North):
Is the right hon. Gentleman suggesting that it should be paid leave? Would that not be a burden on industry?
Mr. Redwood:
That is a conundrum for the Government. I am sure that providing paid leave would be a popular measure among Labour Members. The Opposition have no such proposals, but if the hon. Gentleman thinks that it can be afforded, I am sure many fathers would be eternally grateful. Have the Government thought about the extra pressure that this measure will place on better-paid managers, as I described in answer to an earlier intervention?
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