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Mr. Pickles: The hon. Gentleman clearly has not been listening to what I am saying; nor does he appear to understand the role of the regulator. A regulator does not become involved in deciding whether a pipe should lead from No. 12 Acacia avenue to No. 13; he deals with strategic service matters. Clause 17 has the potential to undermine commercial decisions. The practicalities of the Bill must be examined. It is no good talking in terms of general, broad principles; the clause poses a real threat to the hitherto undoubted success of privatisation. It offers the prospect of deteriorating services, dropping passenger numbers, decreasing numbers of trains and a general closing down of the service.

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Mr. Cryer: Currently, at least eight rural railways are under threat of closure. Many more rural and urban railways have had services cut since 1996. What does the hon. Gentleman make of that?

Mr. Pickles: Clause 17 simply makes it more likely that those services will be closed. If the clause were restricted to questions about the social provision of railway lines, the regulator would have a much better chance of ensuring that those rural services remained open.

I said that three speeches had illustrated the problem of drift from the strategic to the particular, and the hon. Member for Eltham (Mr. Efford) made a number of important points about freight. He was encouraged by his hon. Friends to say, "Isn't it rather wicked that all these lorries are travelling on the roads? Wouldn't it be nice if more freight were taken off the roads and put on the railways?" Everyone agrees with that proposition. However, we must understand that the impact on the general public would be the same whether the amount of freight transported by rail trebled, quadrupled or multiplied by seven.

I invited the hon. Member for Eltham to suggest what percentage of freight should be carried by rail and what percentage on the roads, but he did not want to be specific. However, he should have had an idea about that before he gave us a lecture about rail freight. At present, 6 per cent. of freight is transported by rail. That figure might be 6.5 per cent. this year because the situation is improving, but the amount of freight that is being transported is growing.

English, Welsh and Scottish Railway has done a tremendous job. For 20 years there was a decline in the amount of freight transported by rail. That decline has been halted and reversed, and in the past three years there has been a 35 per cent. increase. To increase the amount of rail freight, even to continental European proportions of 15 per cent. of all freight, will require a considerable effort.

I was interested to hear that the latest figures suggest that by 2010, if we pull out all the stops, it is likely that 20 per cent. of freight will be transported by rail. However, there will still be more tonnage on the roads then than there is now. There are certain constraints on transporting freight by rail.

Mr. Quinn: The hon. Gentleman makes an important point about freight, and I am sure that he is aware that EWS plans to triple its business over the next 10 years and to aim for the target of about 18 per cent. of freight being moved by rail, to bring us into line with Europe.

Does the hon. Gentleman agree that the previous Government's policies, which fragmented the Railfreight company into three distinct parts, caused the decline in rail freight to 6 per cent. of the total? Does he welcome the work of Ed Burkehart and EWS to glue back together those three parts so as to make one company and to bring in investment for that business from the capital sector? Does not that demonstrate faith in the future of the railway industry--

Mr. Deputy Speaker: Order. The hon. Gentleman's interventions are getting longer and longer, and I believe that he is seeking to catch my eye, so perhaps he should bear that in mind.

Mr. Pickles: Indeed; I was thinking of trying to intervene on the hon. Gentleman.

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Freight has been terrifically successful under privatisation. Let us consider the challenges that freight now faces in expanding. We should not forget that the target of 20 per cent. refers to a percentage share of a rising freight total.

There are a number of constraints on rail freight. The loading gauge on the west coast line, in particular, means that we are unable to take international carriages. If we could do so, we could increase our capacity by one third at a stroke. That would enable us also to engage in piggy-backing of freight, in which a road vehicle is moved straight on to a carriage. Currently, we do not have a loading gauge capable of doing that. If piggy-backing were possible, we could certainly increase the amount of freight being carried by rail.

A more important problem, which relates directly to the Strategic Rail Authority, is the conflict between rail and freight. It is ironic that every improvement in the passenger rail service works against the expansion of freight. The faster trains become and the more frequent the service becomes, the less able we are to expand freight transportation.

We have to remember that most freight is carried at night. That gives rise to certain environmental considerations, not least the noise. Complaints about the noise of rail freight have increased. No doubt those complaints are made by the people who are urging us to carry more freight by rail. As someone who lives by a railway line, I am acutely aware of the increased freight traffic at night.

If we are to increase the proportion of freight that is carried by rail to 20 per cent. or more, the Strategic Rail Authority will have to address the essential conflict between the two uses of the railways. We have to remember that most freight that is carried by rail is not time-critical, so it does not matter whether the load arrives on a particular day. That factor is largely historical and relates to the carrying of grain and coal.

To get above the 20 per cent. target, we shall have to start involving the railways in carrying loads that are time-critical. If, for example, a load left Aberdeen one day, we would then have to be reasonably certain that it would arrive in Brentwood the next day. That is an enormous task for the Strategic Rail Authority, and it is far more important than messing about on the various capital schemes that we have heard about.

Dr. Whitehead: Is not the hon. Gentleman arguing against himself, in that investment in a long-term freight strategy--which I agree we need--is not occurring precisely because Railtrack does not foresee the recovery of its investment in the short term?

Mr. Pickles: Again, the hon. Gentleman is viewing matters in black and white. I have made clear my position, as I did when I was a member of the Select Committee. I voted for the report. I believe that there is a case for a Strategic Rail Authority, but I am concerned because the remarks of the hon. Gentleman, the Secretary of State, and other hon. Members who have intervened suggest that we are about to set up not a Strategic Rail Authority but the British Railways Board mark II. We are a long way from what the Select Committee was suggesting, and we seem to have picked up all its bad recommendations instead of considering the positive aspects of getting more private enterprise involved.

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I asked a question about international freight. My hon. Friend the Member for Rochford and Southend, East takes a keen interest in the channel tunnel. However, it seems that the tunnel has not been the catalyst for road hauliers that we hoped it would be. The tonnage of freight going through the tunnel is roughly 40 per cent. below what was predicted. I cannot understand why it costs three times as much to send freight through the tunnel as it does on the Shuttle service, which essentially uses the same track and the same tunnel. Why should it be so expensive? The cost of taking freight through the channel tunnel--this applies also to freight going out from our major ports--is only worth it if the journey goes beyond the Alps.

The problem is that continental railways are far too nationally focused. We need some progress from the Government in terms of breaking down the international barriers to see a better and freer distribution of freight throughout the continent. We will not see major benefits, and we will not see an increase on the 20 per cent. figure, unless hauliers are in a position to decide that using rail is a good option.

I am concerned by the Bill's proposals concerning the Welsh Assembly and the Scottish Parliament. The Bill talks about services wholly inside their respective countries being the reserve of the Assembly or of the Parliament. Are we about to make the same mistakes as in continental Europe by trying to have a national focus in Scotland and Wales, and not being able to make the correct decisions to ensure that there is a strategic overview across the country?

In conclusion, the Bill has the potential to do a great deal of good in terms of co-ordinating the railways. However, it has the potential also to do enormous damage to the rail network. Whether it is a saint or a sinner will depend largely on the determination of the Government to keep the authority strategic. Every indication from the speeches from Labour Members--and from the Liberal Democrats--is that we have strategic drift, and that, increasingly, the authority will want to get involved in the day-to-day operations of the railways. If it does, that is bad news for the railways and bad news for passengers.


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