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Mr. St. Aubyn: Will the Minister give way?
Mrs. Liddell: No. I would like to make some progress.
Privatisation was based on the assumption of a largely static railway where shareholders mattered more than the travelling public. That is very much the message that we have received from Opposition Members this evening.
Mr. St. Aubyn:
On a point of order, Madam Speaker. Is it in order for the Minister to give way to a Member who was not present during the debate and to deny any time to someone who was present for the debate?
Madam Speaker:
The hon. Gentleman knows that it is for whoever has the floor to decide whether to give way.
Mrs. Liddell:
As I was saying, privatisation was based on the assumption of a static railway. Our priorities are exactly the opposite. The Bill provides for a growing railway at the heart of an integrated transport system. It provides for proper accountability and it puts passengers' interests where they belong, which is at the top of the agenda. The rail industry needs this stable framework to deliver long-term investment and better services.
Several hon. Members--
Mr. Pickles:
Will the Minister give way?
Mrs. Liddell:
No. I would like to make some progress. Many hon. Members, including the hon. Gentleman, have made many points to which I wish to respond.
There is a sense of frustration among my hon. Friends about the service that some of their constituents are experiencing. We have always made it clear that we will not accept poor performance from train operators or from Railtrack. Passengers have a right to expect something better. Poor performance will not be tolerated and train operators that fail to meet the required standard will have no future in the railway industry.
At the national railway summit, which my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State held on 25 February, it was clear that we were moving to substantial co-operation between various parts of the industry to improve performance. A second summit will be held next year to review progress in respect of the rail industry's commitments. We are also willing to renegotiate franchises in return for guarantees of better services for passengers. All requests for renegotiation will have two basic tests to fulfil: they must provide a real dividend for the passenger in terms of greater investment and better performance and they must deliver better value for the taxpayer.
My hon. Friend the Member for Crewe and Nantwich made her usual wise and authoritative speech. She has regularly pressed for such a Bill and I share her pleasure at the fact that we are now seeking statutory backing for the Strategic Rail Authority. My right hon. Friend the Secretary of State has outlined the role that she and her Select Committee will undertake in consideration of the Bill. I believe that tonight's debate has gone a long way to informing the Committee of the concerns of Members from across the House and the issues that they want to be addressed. That process concerns the modernisation of the procedures of the House, as well as the modernisation of the railway system, and ensuring that there is proper pre-legislative scrutiny. We want to ensure that the needs of those who use the rail network are taken into account.
I pay tribute to the Committee's work on transport policy and look forward to reading its report on the Bill. I note that my hon. Friend again referred to Railtrack's poor performance and its much publicised £27 billion figure for investment. She urged that Railtrack should be obliged to meet its commitment and I believe that that is a fair response to Railtrack. It is only fair that it should meet its commitments and the new Rail Regulator has made it clear that he will not hesitate to use his powers to enforce licence obligations and to protect the public interest. His powers are considerable and they include the power to enforce licences and amend them by consent. The Bill will strengthen the powers of the regulator and the Strategic Rail Authority to enforce licences and franchises.
The right hon. Member for Wokingham and a number of his hon. Friends described the Bill as a route to renationalisation. That is arrant nonsense. We want to establish a power that will make sure that there is a route to ensuring that a service can be provided if a service fails or if there are no acceptable bids for a franchise service. That is what clause 9 will provide: it will allow the public sector to stand in if the private sector fails to deliver train services. That is basic common sense, but the lack of common sense from Conservative Members has been quite overwhelming. There are real safeguards against the abuse of the powers in the Bill: the authority has to satisfy itself that there is a more economic way of providing a service, then the Secretary of State must agree to that and a bidder can apply to the courts for a review of a decision to dispense with franchising. I repeat--that is plain common sense.
The right hon. Member for Wokingham also asked about the Secretary of State's power to give guidance to the Rail Regulator. The provision is for general guidance only; it does not cover the details of the independent economic judgments, which the Rail Regulator will have to make, and it will help to ensure that we have a single policy and direction for the railways, not a directionless mishmash, which is what the previous Government created.
My hon. Friend the Member for Crewe and Nantwich raised some important points about British Rail land. The British Railways Board has suspended land sales and we are considering its report. Some very limited land sales had to take place because contracts had previously been signed, but the shadow SRA will give advice on the report and we shall consider the process that must be undertaken.
My hon. Friend also made an important point about safety, which was picked up by the hon. Member for Truro and St. Austell (Mr. Taylor). The Government are determined to ensure that, as part of improving the railways in the interests of passengers, safety is not compromised. Rail continues to be the safest form of surface transport, but there is always room for improvement. The Health and Safety Executive will remain the sole safety regulator for the railways and, in exercising its functions, the SRA will have a duty to protect people from danger.
The hon. Member for Truro and St. Austell also asked about integrating rail services with bus services. Under clause 5(c), the SRA must contribute to the development of an integrated transport system, so it can and should promote rail and bus initiatives. The hon. Gentleman also asked why this is a railways Bill and not an integrated transport Bill. The Queen's Speech was clear: we announced that we would publish a railways Bill, not a transport Bill, in draft this Session. We have gone a stage further by publishing the Bill that we are debating this evening.
I want to deal with the issue described as "bustitution". A number of Opposition Members suggested that the Government have been changing their position in relation to that. We have no plans to replace loss-making rural services with buses. Key services are contractually safeguarded through the passenger service requirements. Where rural services depend heavily on subsidy, they will be based closely on the timetable in operation prior to franchising.
The hon. Member for Rochford and Southend, East referred to the success, as he saw it, of privatisation. Privatisation smashed the rail industry into hundreds of different pieces, and put private shareholders before the travelling public. The aim of this Bill is to put the network back together, so that it operates as an entity in the interests of the travelling public. It will make railway managers properly accountable again to their passengers.
My hon. Friend the Member for Hornchurch (Mr. Cryer) asked about the threat to rural lines. The point that he made about rural railways was responded to by my hon. Friend the Member for Denton and Reddish (Mr. Bennett), who said that not all rural lines make common sense or are viable. He referred to a line in his constituency, where one train a week runs mostly so that railway aficionados can say that they have travelled on every railway in the country, but on which there are often no other passengers. It makes much more sense to ensure that rural railway lines are in use.
Mr. Jenkin:
Will the Minister give way?
Mrs. Liddell:
No, I should like to respond to the points that have been raised.
The hon. Member for Brentwood and Ongar (Mr. Pickles) referred to clause 17, which is designed to ensure the proper provision of network facilities. That is in the interests of those who need to use the facilities. It will not inhibit the commercial decision making of the companies. He also referred to the powers of the Rail Regulator in Wales and Scotland. Ninety-nine per cent. of railway issues are reserved matters, so the SRA will cover the matters that he wished to see considered.
The hon. Member for Guildford (Mr. St. Aubyn) referred to clause 7(2)(c). He did well to state that he was no expert on railway matters, because that duty is identical to the current duty on the Secretary of State and the Rail Regulator under the Railways Act 1993.
Many hon. Friends raised a considerable number of points about the relevance of this Bill. It is an important Bill, which is revealed by the fact that it has widespread support in the House. Even Opposition Members could not find a proper argument against the SRA. The Bill will put right the serious weaknesses in the rail network. I commend it to the House.
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