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6.25 pm
Sir Raymond Whitney (Wycombe): My right hon. Friend the Member for South-West Surrey (Mrs. Bottomley) speaks with great knowledge and understanding of the health service and makes an extremely valid case. By nature, I am an optimist and I came here today thinking that, perhaps, for the first time in 53 years, we could have a sensible political debate on how to provide health services in Britain. I thought that because, after 26 months of the realities of office, I hoped that the Labour party might, as my right hon. Friend suggests, face up to the problems that we all share in providing a proper health service for Britain, but that was not to be.
The reason that we have not had a sensible debate for 53 years is the myths that surround what happened in 1946. Sure enough, the hon. Member for Wakefield (Mr. Hinchliffe) tried to resurrect those myths this afternoon. The fact is that all three major parties in Britain were, for many years before the health service was created, totally in favour of a health service which was comprehensive, universal and free at the point of delivery. There was great unanimity on that throughout the war, culminating in the 1944 White Paper introduced by a Conservative Minister. That White Paper was strongly endorsed by the Labour party at its Blackpool conference in October 1944.
The only difference--it was a significant difference--was that the majority of the Labour party, led in particular by the then Lord President of the Council, Mr. Herbert Morrison, the grandfather of the right hon. Member for Hartlepool (Mr. Mandelson)--and who, in the light of the problems that we have had since, would say that he was wrong?--said that we needed not the centralised and over-bureaucratic structure which Aneurin Bevan eventually put through the House, but a much more devolved structure with local autonomy and a great deal
more freedom from bureaucracy. Let us therefore be clear that we should not be fobbed off with the myths that we have heard this afternoon, and have had--
Sir Raymond Whitney:
No, sorry; no chance at all.
We have had those myths for 53 years. For 53 years, Health Ministers have had the same challenges. I was a junior Health Minister for a short time and, like every other Minister, junior or senior, I accepted the basic framework of the health service with the two overriding essentials of universal care free at the point of delivery and the need to get as much money as possible out of the Treasury and spend it as wisely as one can. Governments of both complexions have tried that. The previous Conservative Government had a great record. We had a 74 per cent. increase in expenditure in real terms, an 86 per cent. increase in hospital treatments, and we doubled the number of hip replacements. We can all swap such statistics.
We should concentrate on the hospital sector. The hon. Member for Dartford (Dr. Stoate) spoke about general practitioners. I accept that the level of GP provision in Britain is something of which we should be proud, but we should not be proud of the hospital problem, particularly the waiting times and all the ancillary services.
The Conservative Government tried hard with their massive increase in spending over 18 years. We produced a long list of improvements. We have now had two and a bit years of the Labour Government. In many ways, they have gone backwards. The previous Labour Government's record was appalling. Nurses' pay fell in real terms by 3 per cent. in one year, the hospital building programme was cut by a third, and doctors said that the health service was on the point of collapse. They are saying that again. I utter these words with care, but does not that suggest that the NHS is not the envy of the world? If it was, it would have been copied elsewhere.
The New Zealanders established a national health service for a short time and then walked away from it. The Swedes had something similar for a while, but they do not have such a service any more. There must be lessons that we can learn from other countries and it is about time that we, as responsible politicians, faced up to our responsibilities and accepted that reality. Instead, we always hear flannel from Labour spokesmen, and the Secretary of State gave us a prime example of that this afternoon.
Let us look to other countries. Of course they have great problems, but I am sure that there are things to learn from them. I believe that we have to go back to where Herbert Morrison was when he lost his battle with Aneurin Bevan 53 years ago, and look for a much higher degree of local autonomy and less of the centralisation that the Labour party by instinct enjoys so much.
We also have to look at additional sources of funding. We all know that money is not everything in respect of health care, but it is crucial. The latest figures available for per capita health spending in Britain are given in American dollars, which is usually the case with statistics. We spend $1,300 compared with $4,000 spent in the United States. I would not dream of suggesting that as an
example, but we should look at our sister countries--the other advanced industrial countries such as Germany and France--where average per capita spending is $2,000. That is a difference of $700 per person.
Laura Moffatt (Crawley):
Will the hon. Gentleman give way?
Sir Raymond Whitney:
I am sorry, but I cannot.
Sir Geoffrey Johnson Smith (Wealden):
I fear that only a few minutes remain, and one of my hon. Friends--
Dr. Julian Lewis (New Forest, East):
Two.
Sir Geoffrey Johnson Smith:
Two of my hon. Friends wish to make further comment. I am relieved from discharging some of my duty, however, because the speech of my hon. Friend the Member for Wycombe (Sir R. Whitney) followed in thought, if not word by word, exactly what I have in mind.
Members of my family work in the national health service, and I have great admiration for such people and for the achievements of the NHS. I have no wish to scrap it but, like my hon. Friend, I have to recognise that no other country has copied us. The representatives of nation after nation have visited this country and rejected our solution, but they have suggested that there are ways of topping up public expenditure. They believe that that can be achieved through friendly societies and insurance, and we can do that in this country. A whole raft of measures has made it possible for a better service to be delivered in continental countries, with which we should compare this country.
In my judgment, it is disgraceful that, instead of recognising that, we indulge in the sort of political rhetoric that so often destroys the ability of the House to give some lead to the Government and the public and to help to explain to them why change is necessary. By doing that, we do a disservice to those who work in the health service. They suffer from some of the same frustrations as us and they do not want the health service to be destroyed, but we will not give them a pointer to ways in which the health service can be improved if we do not recognise that alternative sources of finance and training would enable them to discharge their duties more effectively.
Mr. David Amess (Southend, West):
I am increasingly angry about the style and lack of substance of Her Majesty's Government. Frankly, they should be
Mr. Eric Martlew (Carlisle):
Basildon!
Mr. Amess:
From a sedentary position, the hon. Gentleman shouts the name of my former constituency. Yesterday, I visited a friend who is seriously ill in hospital and that gentleman has everything to thank the hospital for in respect of the treatment that he has received. This might take the smile off the hon. Gentleman's face: he might be interested to know that the staff who work at that particular hospital--
Mr. Martlew:
Will the hon. Gentleman give way?
Mr. Amess:
We have only five minutes to go, and if I gave way I should be abusing the procedures of the House.
Every hon. Member should thank the women and men who work in the NHS for the wonderful work that they do on behalf of our constituents. Many of us have relatives and friends whose lives have been saved by them. For example, the gentleman who runs my office has had two heart bypass operations and he is thankful for the skill of the surgeon concerned.
For 18 years, the Labour party politicised the health service. Day in, day out, it tried to blame the Conservative party for everything that was reported by the newspapers, but it is interesting that it is now a little bit uncomfortable with the headlines. This week, a leader in The Times headed "Patients and Patience" said:
It has sickened me to listen to Labour party apologists during this debate on an Opposition motion, which I believe has already been abused by combining it with a statement. Labour Members say, "What has been reported since 1 May 1997 is all wrong." The hon. Member for Dartford (Dr. Stoate) and others were not Members of the House in previous Parliaments, but we all remember Jennifer's ear and all that. I believe that Labour Members should be absolutely ashamed of the way that they politicised the health service for 18 years.
Who thinks that the Labour party is doing a good job? Labour MPs do, but the professionals and the people who work in the health service know that the Labour party has let them down. Last week, I had the privilege to meet representatives of the Royal College of Nursing, which has said:
"In health reforms outcomes are what matter".
A headline in the Daily Mail, which the Labour party does not like, says:
"At 103, Amy King had a right to expect exemplary treatment when taken to hospital. Instead, she was left weeping on a trolley for 28 hours, just another victim of our crumbling health service".
Day in, day out and week in, week out, headlines that are clearly criticising the Government appear in the newspapers.
"The NHS is facing its worst nursing shortage in 25 years. The RCN revealed in January 1999 that there are now up to 13,000 full-time nursing vacancies".
20 Jul 1999 : Column 1022
Local medical committees in Essex have passed two motions. One said that the conference had
and
"no confidence in the present government's handling of the National Health Service"
deplores the fragmentation of the structure of primary care delivery in the UK".
Another motion was passed, also saying that
"conference has no confidence in this present government's handling of the National Health Service."
We have already heard what the British Medical Association has had to say. Labour MPs quoted what it had to say for 18 years--it was their greatest comforter--but it has turned against the Labour party. I am not sure whether the Liberal party still supports it; we shall find out when it elects its new leader in the middle of August. Now that it has turned against Labour Members, they do not want to know about it. As far as I am concerned, no one is satisfied with the NHS reforms except Labour Members. Those of us who sat through 77 hours of Standing Committee sittings on the Health Act 1999 know at first hand what those reforms amount to.
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