House of Commons
Wednesday 16 February 2000
The House met at half-past Two o'clock
PRAYERS
[Madam Speaker in the Chair]
PRIVATE BUSINESS
City of London(Ward Elections) Bill (By Order)
Order for further consideration, as amended, read.
To be further considered on Wednesday 1 March.
WALES
The Secretary of State was asked--
Climate Change Levy
1. Mr. Christopher Gill (Ludlow): What recent discussions he has had with the First Secretary with regard to the climate change levy. [108908]
The Secretary of State for Wales (Mr. Paul Murphy): I meet the First Secretary weekly and we discuss a range of issues. However, lead responsibility on the climate change levy as a tax measure lies with the Chancellor of the Exchequer and the responsibility for negotiated agreements lies with the Department of the Environment, Transport and the Regions.
Mr. Gill: Will the right hon. Gentleman assure the House that he will make the strongest representations to the Chancellor of the Exchequer to persuade him that, if he goes on imposing stealth taxes on our industries, he will make them uncompetitive? Is it the right hon. Gentleman's intention to do that to important industries ranging from aluminium to horticulture, and to treat them as he has treated the pig industry and see them go into terminal decline?
Mr. Murphy: The hon. Gentleman will be aware that the National Assembly for Wales has a responsibility in those matters. It contacted 20 major energy users and businesses in Wales, and they expressed general support for the aims of the levy.
Mr. Barry Jones (Alyn and Deeside): I thank my right hon. Friend for agreeing to visit Shotton steelworks in the near future. When he meets my steelworker constituents, they will tell him of their great interest in the levy. Does he agree that our steel industry faces considerable competition overseas and that the scale and nature of the levy, and the way in which it is pitched, organised and
assessed, are of great importance for employment in the industry throughout Britain? Does he agree also that this great steelworks is the scene of much productivity and success? There will be a warm welcome for him when he visits my constituency soon.
Mr. Murphy: I very much look forward to visiting my right hon. Friend's constituency a week on Friday, I think, and particularly to visiting Shotton. I assure him that his points about the steel industry are very well made.
Mr. Nick Hawkins (Surrey Heath): Was not the Minister's reply to my hon. Friend the Member for Ludlow (Mr. Gill) disingenuous in the extreme? The Government have committed themselves to the levy and, after the embarrassment that they have suffered in the past week on Welsh Assembly matters, I should have thought that the last thing that the Minister would want to say is that this is all down to the Welsh Assembly. Why does not he accept that the responsibility lies with him and his colleagues to make sure that no more stealth taxes hit British industry?
Mr. Murphy: Welsh questions is not the place to raise those general matters when I was dealing with a specific question asked of me in my capacity as Secretary of State for Wales. The hon. Gentleman must understand that devolution means devolution.
National Assembly (Budget)
2. Mr. Jon Owen Jones (Cardiff, Central): What discussions he has had with the First Secretary about the budget for the National Assembly for Wales for 2000-01. [108909]
The Secretary of State for Wales (Mr. Paul Murphy): I meet the Assembly First Secretary weekly to discuss a range of issues.
Mr. Jones: When my right hon. Friend next meets the First Secretary, will he convey my heartfelt congratulations on his appointment, and those of my constituents? Will he tell the First Secretary that the overwhelming majority of my constituents share Labour's priorities and that they will be delighted to hear of the increases in the Assembly budget for next year, in particular the 7.5 per cent. increase in the money that can be spent on health and social services and the more than 10 per cent. increase in money for education? My constituents will be delighted with that expenditure increase, and I hope that he will convey those thoughts to the new First Secretary.
Mr. Murphy: I will indeed convey those thoughts to the new First Secretary in Cardiff. Everybody in Wales will be grateful for the emphasis that the National Assembly budget has put on education and health. It is important for Members of this House to understand that the National Assembly is a new institution; that the people of Wales voted for devolution, and that we wish the new First Secretary well, as indeed did all parties, including the Conservatives, when they met yesterday to ensure that my hon. Friend the Member for Cardiff, West (Mr. Morgan) was made First Secretary. We ought also
to put on record our thanks to my right hon. Friend the Member for Cardiff, South and Penarth (Mr. Michael) for the way that he worked in establishing the Assembly.
Mr. Richard Livsey (Brecon and Radnorshire): Does not the new First Secretary have a keen interest in private business and a clear understanding of its operation? We hope that matters relating to objective 1 match funding will be included in the budget, as well as projects that will be pursued to obtain objective 1 moneys for the poorest parts of Wales. Will the right hon. Gentleman ensure that the private sector is fully engaged in that process so that new initiatives can be taken for job creation in Wales for the benefit of the people in those poor areas?
Mr. Murphy: The hon. Gentleman has a good point. He will be aware that the First Secretary was--indeed, as far as I am aware, still is--the Assembly Secretary on economic and European matters. As such, he has spent a great deal of time in the past month dealing with the issue. I very much appreciate the hon. Gentleman's points, particularly on the schemes for objective 1 funding, and especially those concerning small and medium-sized businesses.
Sir Raymond Powell (Ogmore): When my right hon. Friend next talks to the First Secretary, will he remind him that this House decides the expenditure given to Wales? Given that, as I understand it, we are proposing an increase of £474 million in the Welsh Assembly's budget, we do not want in 12 months' time to witness again the scene in the Assembly last week. Opposition Assembly Members, particularly Plaid Cymru and perhaps the Liberals, should be reminded that we in this House decide on the money and that, therefore, we shall still have some control over what we grant to them.
Mr. Murphy: My hon. Friend is right when he says that the people of Wales and, indeed, Members of this House, would not want a regular repeat performance of what occurred in Cardiff last week. I think that everybody would agree that, first, Wales needs stability in the three years remaining of the Assembly's term, and, secondly, the Assembly should deliver the services affecting people's lives, such as eduction and the health service, with which the devolution settlement charged it. He is also right in saying that this House of Commons determines the block grant, although I am sure he would agree that distribution of that grant in Wales is a matter for colleagues in the National Assembly.
Mr. Nigel Evans (Ribble Valley): This is the first Welsh questions since the "fun and games" in the Welsh Assembly last week, as the Prime Minister called it. We wish the hon. Member for Cardiff, West (Mr. Morgan) well in his new position. At least he is unlike his predecessor, the right hon. Member for Cardiff, South and Penarth (Mr. Michael), who was like a puppet on a string. We hope that those strings have been cut well and firmly.
In his discussions with the new First Secretary, what representations has the Secretary of State received about objective 1 status funding?
Mr. Murphy:
Yesterday, the hon. Gentleman's party in Cardiff warmly welcomed my hon. Friend the Member for Cardiff, West (Mr. Morgan) as the new First Secretary.
The hon. Gentleman will be aware that we have entered the spending review on objective 1 status. It will take place between now and July, and concern matters of high importance to Wales. We shall continue to work here in government on that spending review.
Mr. Evans:
The Secretary of State will be aware that it is not only politicians who are interested in what is going on with objective 1 status. For instance, CyberCall in Cardigan stated this week that it was appalled at the antics of politicians and that all that it is interested in is ensuring that sufficient funds are made available so that Wales wins objective 1 status. We are talking about 400 jobs going to one of the most disadvantages areas of Wales. Given that the Prime Minister said that he would not let Wales down, will the Secretary of State assure companies such as CyberCall, and the people of Wales, that they will receive match funding, so that jobs can go to the most disadvantaged areas of Wales?
Mr. Murphy:
The hon. Gentleman will know that, in all the years that his Government dealt with structural funding, they had to go through the process. He will also be aware that, in this very House of Commons a week or so ago, the right hon. Member for Horsham (Mr. Maude), the shadow Chief Secretary to the Treasury, poured scorn on structural funding and said that we should not have it at all in this country. The hon. Gentleman must make up his mind whether he wants objective 1 funding.
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