House of Commons
Monday 6 March 2000
The House met at half-past Two o'clock
PRAYERS
[Madam Speaker in the Chair]
Oral Answers to Questions
SOCIAL SECURITY
The Secretary of State was asked--
Child Poverty
1. Fiona Mactaggart (Slough): What action he is taking in co-operation with other Departments to meet the Government's objective of eliminating child poverty. [111829]
9. Mr. Derek Twigg (Halton):
What progress the Government are making in tackling child poverty. [111839]
The Secretary of State for Social Security (Mr. Alistair Darling):
We have pledged to eradicate child poverty over the next 20 years and to halve it within 10 years. Nearly 1 million children will be lifted out of poverty by the end of this Parliament as a result of measures already announced.
Fiona Mactaggart:
I congratulate the Government on their ambitious target for tackling child poverty. Does the Secretary of State agree that ending child poverty is not just a question of making more money available to families with children, but also a question of tackling poverty of opportunity and of aspiration so that children have access to learning and to a rich cultural life? What is my right hon. Friend doing with other Departments to deliver that for children in Britain today?
Mr. Darling:
My hon. Friend is right. What holds children back is not just the lack of income but the lack of educational opportunities and, in some cases, poor housing and other disadvantages. We are working across Government to ensure that people's opportunities are improved. My hon. Friend will be aware that, last September, the Government published a paper entitled "Opportunity for All" which set out how we are working with other Departments--particularly the Department for Education and Employment--on initiatives such as sure start, which are designed to ensure that children who are born into disadvantaged backgrounds get the help that they need, through their parents, to raise their expectations and increase the opportunities available to them.
Mr. Twigg:
I, too, welcome the Government's statement that they intend to eliminate child poverty.
Mr. Darling:
My hon. Friend is right to say that it is important for the Government and local authorities to work together. I am glad that he mentioned sure start. As constituency Members of Parliament, we see every day the problems that arise where young children are born into homes where not only is there not enough money, but very often nobody is in work. Those children have low expectations and they will not do as well as other children. The sure start programme is designed to ensure that children in that position get the extra help that they need from the time that they are born until they go into nursery school and primary school. The Government are committed to eradicating child poverty, and that is essential. It is not just a moral issue--it makes economic sense; something the Conservatives never realised in nearly 20 years in government.
Mr. Julian Brazier (Canterbury):
I am sure that everyone welcomes those targets in principle, but will the Secretary of State tell us how the steady growth in means-tested benefits will help to eliminate child poverty when factors such as the working families tax credit, in combination with other taxes and benefits, leave an ever-increasing proportion of households facing marginal rates of tax and benefit withdrawal of more than 80 per cent? What sort of message is he sending to the next rising generation about helping themselves?
Mr. Darling:
The clear message that the working families tax credit sends is that work pays. The problem that we faced--the problem that the Conservative party left us--was that there were far too many households where nobody worked and where nobody had worked for a long time. It was beyond doubt that some people were in the absurd situation of finding themselves worse off as a result of going into work than they would have been on benefits. Since 1997, the Government have ensured that the barriers that people face when going into work are reduced and that work is made to pay. The working families tax credit will benefit 1.5 million families, who will be better off as a result of going into work. That makes sense in terms of getting them off the dole and into work, and it is good for the families concerned who come to accept that work is a central part of life--again, something that the previous Government did nothing about in almost 20 years.
Mr. David Willetts (Havant):
Will the Secretary of State explain briefly the distinct roles in tackling child poverty of child benefit, the working families tax credit, the child care credit, the children's tax credit, the
Mr. Darling:
The one thing that all those benefits and help have in common is that the Tories opposed every one of them. As I said to the hon. Member for Canterbury (Mr. Brazier), we are determined to ensure that work pays and we want to use every lever at our disposal to achieve that end. The number of children living in poverty trebled under the previous Government, and that was because of a lack of income in the house and far too many people without work--something that we are not prepared to tolerate.
Mr. Willetts:
The Secretary of State talks about using every lever at his disposal, but a report from the Government said that problems of co-ordination are becoming more acute. The Prime Minister has set up the social exclusion unit, the Chancellor has taken over benefits policy for the Budget, and a poverty tsarina is running policy on poverty from the Cabinet Office, so the most radical idea in the Labour manifesto will be dismantling the Secretary of State's Department. What does that tell us about his record?
Mr. Darling:
The hon. Gentleman ignores the fact that, during the nearly 20 years that they were in power, the Tories did nothing about the eradication of child poverty. Indeed, one of my predecessors, now Lord Moore, famously tried to prove that poverty did not exist. This Government accept that many people are excluded when they should not be, and that is why we set up the social exclusion unit to deal with problems such as homelessness. We are determined, through the Department of Social Security, the Treasury and every Department, to eradicate poverty, and all Departments are working together towards that objective. It is interesting that all that the Tories can do is sneer at those efforts to give children and other people the opportunities that the Tory Government denied them.
2. Mr. John Bercow (Buckingham):
What recent assessment he has made of the impact of the level of welfare and other passported benefits on the incentive to work. [111830]
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Social Security (Angela Eagle):
Helping people move from welfare benefits into work is a key element of our welfare reform agenda. We are tackling the problems of the unemployment and poverty traps and ensuring that work pays. The introduction of the national minimum wage and the working families tax credit has, for the first time, guaranteed a minimum income of £200 per week for those moving off benefits. Tax and benefit reforms have also addressed the poverty trap and allowed low-income families to keep more of every pound that they earn.
Mr. Bercow:
I acknowledge the Minister's reply. What comfort can the Minister offer today to my constituent, Marguerite Day of 23 Chiltern avenue, Stone, Aylesbury, Buckinghamshire HP17 8QZ, who has been out of work
Angela Eagle:
If the hon. Gentleman will write to me with the details, I will look into the case. As the Government have recognised, the important thing to remember is that individual barriers to getting back into work are precisely that, and they need to be tackled individually. That is why we are setting up the personal advisers in the ONE service, and we are trialling that service in 12 areas, including that of the hon. Gentleman. It may well be that a visit to a personal adviser could help his constituent a great deal.
Mr. Paul Goggins (Wythenshawe and Sale, East):
Does my hon. Friend agree that the vast majority of people would rather work than claim benefits? Therefore, is she as encouraged as I am that, in Benchill, the area in my constituency that for years has had the highest proportion of families dependent on benefits, unemployment fell by 21 per cent. last year alone, youth unemployment by 30 per cent. and long-term unemployment by 43 per cent?
Angela Eagle:
My hon. Friend is right. People should remember that youth unemployment is down 60 per cent. since the Government came to power; long-term unemployment is down 50 per cent.; 41,000 lone parents are now in work, as are 34,000 of those who joined the new deal for the over-25s and 185,000 of the under-25s; 2,180 disabled people are on the new deal for disabled people; and more than 1,000 on the new deal for partners of the unemployed are now in jobs. What did the Conservatives do? They opposed the new deal.
Mr. Archy Kirkwood (Roxburgh and Berwickshire):
I acknowledge that much has been done to provide incentives to get people off welfare and into work, but will the Minister look carefully at the recent work that has been done at the centre for analysis of social exclusion at the London school of economics in analysing some of the American experience? The Americans are a bit further down the line than we are, and it is worrying that people who are at the bottom of the pile, especially lone mothers in the American context, are worse off now than they were. Will the Minister give a categoric assurance that the other half of the adage "Work for those who can, but support for those who cannot" is equally respected, and that there will be as much support for those who genuinely cannot work as there is effort made to incentivise those who can?
Angela Eagle:
The American system is very different from the UK system. We always keep an eye on what is going on in welfare-to-work issues around the world, not only in the United States. The important thing to bear in mind is that the Government have ensured that work pays: we have introduced the working families tax credit, new child care opportunities, sure start, and we have also done much to help lone parents. We have also spent a great deal of money on increasing the premium for children in the income-related benefits. We are thereby trying to balance both sides of the equation.
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