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Jackie Ballard: Fortunately, the hon. Lady and I have discussed these matters many times, so I can imagine what she was about to say. I agree that the register would be very large, given the many people working in residential and non-residential child care. The people who would be bad and harmful to children would, under the proposals in the Criminal Justice and Court Services Bill and in the Protection of Children Act 1999, be included in the register of non-approved people. However, that would not tell a parent employing a nanny, for example, whether the pleasant and plausible person coming for interview was who she said she was and had the qualifications that she claimed.
A parent might be able to find out that such an applicant was not on a register of unapproved people, but I believe that a positive register would help give more information to people making the difficult decisions involved in employing a nanny. I and my campaign group would be happy to discuss the matter further with the hon. Lady, as we would be very pleased to have her support.
The Government intend to regulate nanny agencies, but only a small percentage of parents find nannies through agencies: 70 per cent. still use ads in magazines, or word of mouth. Only a national register will give parents better peace of mind.
A national register would also help to raise the status of child care workers. One thing is certain: if we are to safeguard children, we must value unpaid, parental caring as well as paid carers. As I said, looking after a child can be the most difficult, frustrating and demanding job in the world. It should be valued much more by society.
Mr. Chris Ruane (Vale of Clwyd):
I am glad to have the opportunity to speak in this important debate, and I shall concentrate on Waterhouse's "Lost in Care" report. First, however, I should like to pay tribute to the work of Councillors Malcolm King and Dennis Parry from the Wrexham area, and of Alison Taylor, a social care worker in Gwynedd. For 10 years, they kept up the pressure to ensure that the Waterhouse report, and the Jillings report, came to fruition.
I know that "Lost in Care" will be different from all the other reports in the past--there have been 67, as my hon. Friend the Member for Bridgend (Mr. Griffiths) said. This report's recommendations will be implemented. There are 72 recommendations--60 pertain to the Department of Health, which is acting urgently upon 43 of them and reviewing another 27. That shows how serious the Government are in implementing those recommendations.
I am particularly pleased with the recommendation that those working with children should receive proper training and be required to gain proper qualifications to work in this difficult and demanding area. I hope that those who work in child care will receive adequate financial reward so that we attract people of the highest calibre.
I am pleased that the consultancy list of people who are unsuitable to work with children will be put on a statutory basis. Some of those named in the report have already gone on to jobs working with children in other areas of the country. That is unacceptable.
Another key recommendation--that children should have proper independent representation--will improve the lot of children in care. That, coupled with the local authorities' children complaints officer, will ensure that complaints are taken seriously. I was astounded to read of one ex-resident, who escaped from Bryn Estyn through his dormitory window. When he was caught by the police and told them that he was being abused, they did not believe him and took him back to the home the same night, where he was further abused. That is unacceptable.
There are a number of aspects of the report with which I am not satisfied. I share the concerns expressed by my hon. Friend the Member for Clwyd, South (Mr. Jones). I am not happy that some of the abusers were named in the report and others were not. In appendix 4, page 877, the tribunal sets out its reasons for anonymity. The tribunal
Mr. Martyn Jones:
Is it not the case that people who accept a caution from the police, whether or not they are policemen, agree to accept the guilt of that offence? In other words, they are guilty.
Mr. Ruane:
That is right. The officer in question admitted his guilt. There was no wild accusation; it was
My hon. Friend the Member for Clwyd, South said that there is a feeling in north Wales that the investigation was not sufficiently transparent or public. He put it mildly. Because of the lack of names being made public, people in north Wales feel that there was a cover-up. Naming perpetrators would bring them great anxiety. They are probably sitting at home, terrified of being named. There have been press reports that my hon. Friend would name them today, and I am glad that he has not used parliamentary privilege to do so. If they are to be named, they should be named through the proper channels.
Mr. Hanson:
My hon. Friend will be aware that chapter 6 of the Waterhouse report sets out the tribunal's policy on naming. For the record, the report states that the tribunal
Mr. Ruane:
I thank the Minister for that, but in the example that I have given, guilt was admitted. There are no two ways about it; the man was guilty, according to his own tongue. He should have been named. He got off leniently in 1993, and he has got off lightly again in the report.
People guilty of child abuse who were not named in the report are worried--probably terrified--about being named. But I ask them to remember the terror that they engendered in the young people in their care. I have spoken with people who were in care at Bryn Estyn and other schools, including some lads from the council estate where I was brought up in the 1960s and 1970s. They were placed in the dormitories of those homes, and they have told me of their terror at hearing footsteps on the stairs in the middle of the night. They have told me of their panic when they heard the door opening and closing. They have told me of their revulsion when people in positions of trust abused that trust and tried to force themselves on the young people.
Many of my friends from that tough council estate were tough lads, and they defended themselves. They have told me that if they did so, they were not bothered. The abusers were like water, flowing to the weakest point--abusing the most vulnerable young people. Those who abused young people in care in north Wales may be feeling anxious--even terrified--that they will be named, but I ask them to reflect on the terror that they caused.
Mr. Martyn Jones:
My hon. Friend mentioned reports that I would use parliamentary privilege to name people, and I can say only that they were greatly exaggerated. I had no intention of doing so, unless I felt certain that people had not been properly investigated by the police and that they were a danger to the public.
Can my hon. Friend confirm that no one's interest will be served if many people who were innocent are scared? They have no need to be scared. An awful lot of people do very good work, and I commend them. I hope that they do not fear that they will be named.
Mr. Ruane:
I thank my hon. Friend for that intervention; I share his view on that matter.
Another issue that relates to the report is the number of ex-residents who have taken their own life because of the abuse that they experienced in those homes in the 1970s, 1980s and 1990s. I put a battery of parliamentary questions to my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Wales, but, with respect, I was disappointed with the response. One of my questions was a request for a list of all the young people who had committed suicide as a result of their experiences as residents in those homes. I was told that the information was not held centrally. After the Jillings and "Lost in Care" inquiries, I should have thought that such information would have been kept centrally in the Welsh Office.
The Secretary of State did not supply the information. I had to rely on a newspaper--the Daily Mail. I shall read the toll of young people who committed suicide because of their experience in those homes: Peter Wynne, who hanged himself in 1994, aged 27; Mark Humphreys, who killed himself, aged 30, and who was raped at least 50 times in Bryn Estyn; Simon Burley, who hanged himself from a tree aged 27, after being abused by Peter Howarth; Robert Arthur Smith, who committed suicide in 1978, aged 16, by taking an overdose of painkillers; Barry Williams, found dead in his flat aged 21; Brendon Randalls, who died aged 27, after drinking himself to death; Richard Williams, who was found dead in a car, aged 18; Heath Kelvin Jones, aged 18, found dead in a car from solvent abuse; and Robert Chapman, who fell to his death from a railway bridge.
The last person I shall mention was one of my constituents, Craig Wilson. He committed suicide in 1994, aged 16. His case was examined in the Jillings report. Craig died six years ago, but the first that his parents knew about the abuse that he had suffered was when they read that report in the Daily Mail four weeks ago. That is unbelievable. We have had the Jillings report, the "Lost in Care" report and the coroner's report. Craig's suicide was trawled over by barristers, solicitors and other professionals, but his family were denied the right to know the circumstances of their child's death.
I spoke to Craig's mother at 11 pm yesterday and shall read from the letter that I received from the family:
received requests from virtually all the potential witnesses . . . that they should be granted anonymity in the proceedings.
I agree that that should have been the case during the proceedings. Although it is entirely acceptable that those who have been abused have anonymity, I do not think that it should be given to people who have abused children and have admitted to doing so. For example, page 768 of the report refers to police officer Z, who was accused of indecently assaulting a 15-year-old boy on three occasions. He admitted the offence, and was given a written caution. That is unbelievable. It happened in 1993. He was let off lightly then, and I believe that he was also let off lightly in 2000, when the report was published, by not being named. Others were named in the report for carrying out physical abuse. Physical abuse is bad, and it is right that those people were named in the report, but the police officer committed sexual abuse, which I put on an equal footing, at least, with physical abuse. People accused of physical abuse were named in the report, while that police officer, who admitted sexual abuse, was not. I question that.
do not consider that the evidence against particular individuals has been such as to warrant naming them, bearing in mind the climate in which they were working.
We have a duty to recognise what the tribunal has said.
Dear Chris
Will my hon. Friend the Minister give me an assurance that the Wilson family in Prestatyn in my constituency will be given all the relevant information from the Jillings and "Lost in Care" reports, so that they know all the true circumstances behind their son's death. It is not much to ask. Any Member of the House would demand exactly the same if that had happened to their child.
Once again I have to ask for your help. Our son Craig died on 21st November 1994 while being accommodated by Clywd social services.
For five years we tried in vain to find through police, coroner and legal professions what exactly happened. To no avail. My wife's legal aid was withdrawn.
I opened the Daily Mail on the 16th February . . . to see our son was one of the twelve victims related to the abuse in Clwyd. We did not know!!! The Daily Mail have told us the source of their information is the Jillings report. We can't access the report, can you?
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