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Mr. Hayes: The hon. Lady says that, broadly speaking, she regards the development of such crops favourably. Does she support the development of crops that contain genes from bacteria that make them resistant to a wide range of weedkiller? When that weedkiller is applied to a field, it destroys everything else and creates an entirely sterile environment with the dangers to biodiversity pointed out by my hon. Friend the Member for South Suffolk (Mr. Yeo) and my right hon. Friend the Leader of the Opposition.
Mrs. Campbell: That is an important point. I said that GM crops can bring many advantages. However, like most scientific inventions, the science can be used for good and for ill. We must discriminate between the two. I urge caution, but I think that we shall regret it for ever if we turn our backs on a major scientific advance at this stage.
It is easy to whip up public hysteria on these issues. The hon. Member for South Suffolk is aware of public anxiety, and I believe that the debate is deliberately designed to feed that anxiety. It is not surprising that there is much public concern about food safety following the crass way in which the previous Conservative Government handled the BSE crisis, as mentioned by my right hon. Friend. When the Conservatives were in government, they cut the research budget for scrapie and other animal diseases. If they had not, the research might have led us to an awareness of the dangers before they got out of hand.
The Conservatives refused to listen to scientists. The Agriculture and Food Research Council found itself trying to cope with swingeing cuts in its research budget which were imposed by the previous Government, so it could not carry out the necessary research. I remember that the then Prime Minister, the right hon. Member for Huntingdon (Mr. Major), first mentioned the best available scientific advice after the announcement in the House that BSE posed a potential risk to human health. At that stage, it was rather late for the Government to reassure the public that they knew what they were doing, as clearly they did not.
The BSE crisis was significant because it shook public confidence in food safety. It was perceived that BSE was caused by unnatural feeding practices, and the public remain suspicious of anything to do with food which seems unnatural. The biotech companies have not helped matters by transferring fish genes to give plants frost resistance and by using a penicillin resistant marker gene to find out whether their experiments have been successful. The biotech industry has been a victim of its own ineptitude and should have recognised at an earlier stage that the public would mistrust those uses and, indeed, find them unnecessary. The industry has paid dearly for its mistakes, and we are paying too.
Some biotech companies are pulling out of the UK. Dupont, for example, has decided that it will no longer expand its Cambridge operation. We have lost for ever the opportunity to take commercial advantage of genetic modification. Having been vibrant and innovative just a few years ago, the industry has suffered a loss of public confidence, which has led to a retrenchment and firms relocating to the US. That is a great pity.
The Labour Government listen to scientific advice, not after the event, but at all times. We have increased the basic science budget by more than 16 per cent, but I hope that that we will go further than that. However, that increase shows that the Government recognise the value of scientific knowledge. The Food Standards Agency, set up by the Government, gives advice on food safety, and the Advisory Committee on Releases to the Environment gives advice about releases into the environment. We also have the new independent Agricultural and Environment Biotechnology Commission to provide strategic advice on GM issues.
Unfortunately, it will take a long time to regain public confidence, but that is a result of the previous Government's mishandling of the issues. It is crucial to that confidence building that an accident similar to the Advanta accident does not happen in future. I know that the Government are doing everything in their power to minimise those risks.
6.23 pm
Mr. Tony Baldry (Banbury): We are not debating the virtues or otherwise of genetically modified crops. In recent years, Parliament has often debated those issues. A statutory framework is in place and I suspect that there is not much disagreement between the parties on the way in which field crops are going forward.
Our debate is about a specific incident. The House must focus on the Government's handling of the Advanta seed contamination and the action that the Ministry took once it had that information from Advanta on 17 April. I agree with much of what the hon. Member for Lewisham, Deptford (Joan Ruddock) said about Advanta's responsibility; I accept, of course, that it had a duty of care. However, why did the general manager of Advanta repeatedly say that, at the outset, senior civil servants from MAFF and the Department of the Environment, Transport and the Regions told him not to worry and that the matter was not of any concern? He said:
- They told me that they would to make some tests themselves and not to say anything about it until they had sorted that out. I took a lot of comfort from that and as a result did not take any further action to inform farmers or seed merchants.
I say to the Minister of State, as I would say to the Agriculture Minister if he were here, that the Government are largely responsible for the concern because they dealt with the matter using a planted question in another place, and nothing is more guaranteed to raise concern that the Government are trying to sneak out unfavourable news. The impression was given that they only did that as a consequence of knowing that the French and other Governments were about to release the information and that they would look misplaced if they did not do so.
The Minister's explanation that the only reason why he did not give a statement in the House was that the date in question was an Opposition supply day is one of the feeblest that the House has ever heard. It would have been perfectly possible for him to come to the House with a statement, as he eventually had to do--and then there was, understandably, a public outcry.
The Minister's explanation for the time lapse between April and May was that the Government had been seeking to establish the facts. I am still trying to work out what facts took from 17 April to 18 May--when the statement was made--to be established. Advanta had clearly come to the Government and told them that the seed was contaminated and that the contamination was de minimis--about 1 per cent. That fact was therefore established right at the outset, as was the fact that the genetic modification was RT73. Can the Minister of State tell the House what other facts were established between 17 April and 18 May which were not immediately known to the Agriculture Minister.
It would be interesting and helpful to know when the Minister was first seized of the issue. When did officials first tell him that there was a problem? As a former MAFF Minister, I imagine that the permanent secretary and officials would have gone to the Minister on 17 or 18 April and gone through all the various options and permutations with him. In his speech today, he gave the impression that he was wanting legal advice. I know that
there is a convention that Ministers do not share actual legal advice with the House, but it would be helpful if we were told when the Minister first asked lawyers in MAFF or outside for advice and what was the nature of that advice. If we do not receive that information today, we can table parliamentary questions.It is surprising that in the Minister's statement to the House on 18 May there was absolutely no mention of any legal advice. The suspicion must be that the legal advice that he has referred to was given after 18 May, when he realised that he was in an invidious position because he could not tell the farmers to destroy their crops, but had to do something to ensure that the crops did not get into general circulation. I suspect that when we question the Minister more closely through parliamentary questions, we will discover that legal advice was not sought until after 18 May.
In his statement on 18 May, the Minister said that he
- moved quickly to establish the facts.
- The advice that the Government collectively have received is that it is not necessary to trace and destroy the crops.
- I believe that the response that I have announced today, and which was announced yesterday
- is the right one.--[Official Report, 18 May 2000; Vol. 350, c. 473-74.]
The Minister came to the House and quoted from "A Man for All Seasons", looking rather injured and sad as though he could not believe that anyone would want to criticise a nice guy like him, but the truth is that there has been a serious dereliction of duty by MAFF Ministers. I attach no blame to officials in MAFF. Having worked with them, I would say that they are an extremely good team--but the Ministers clearly did not get a grip on the issue. It would be interesting to discover what submissions and minutes went from the private office to various parts of the Ministry. I suspect that the truth of the matter is that the Minister did not get a grip on the issue until quite late in the day. The consequence is that farmers have been put in an invidious position.
The hon. Member for Cambridge (Mrs. Campbell), who represents a university constituency, is understandably concerned that science generally should not be imputed, but good science has been imputed as a consequence of the way in which the matter has been handled.
The Minister has much explaining still to do, and the House would be greatly helped if the questions that my hon. Friend the Member for South Suffolk (Mr. Yeo) posed in his opening speech were answered in detail, and if that information in its entirety, including when legal advice was sought and its nature, were placed in the Library. Until we get to the bottom of those issues--nice guy or no nice guy--the Opposition will continue to ask questions because the farming community feels that the Government have treated it pretty badly and shabbily and it jolly well thinks that it deserves answers, and answers it will get.
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