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Mr. Loughton: I think that the phrase "self-regulation" was one that the Minister herself used in Committee. Given that time is running out, I should be grateful for her response on the European convention; she promised to come back on that point. Has her confusion been resolved?
Ms Hughes: I was not confused in Committee, and I am certainly not confused now. We are convinced that the provisions for appeal against the findings of a case tribunal, which are contained in clauses 75(10) and 76(15), are robust. It is our view and in line with the advice that we have received that the provisions in part III are compatible with the European convention on human rights. We are proceeding on that basis.
The hon. Gentleman tabled an amendment on the standards board. He is confused about the difference between a quorum and a constitution. The Bill sets in place the minimum for the board to function constitutionally. That is different from a quorum, which is the number needed to take a particular decision. That will be for the board itself to decide, in terms of its operational procedures. We have already told the hon. Gentleman that we envisage a standards board of five or six members.
In the few moments that I have left--
Mr. Bercow: Will the Minister give way?
In relation to amendment No. 45, we have produced Government amendment 203--
It being five and one-quarter hours after the commencement of proceedings on the programme motion, Mr. Deputy Speaker, pursuant to Order [this day], put forthwith the Question already proposed from the Chair.
Mr. Deputy Speaker (Mr. Michael J. Martin): The hon. Member for Buckingham (Mr. Bercow) should not have been talking while I was putting the question. It is not the done thing.
Mr. Deputy Speaker then proceeded to put forthwith the Questions necessary for the disposal of the business to be concluded at that hour.
Clause 46
Amendments made: No. 125, in page 29, line 42, at end insert--
'and police authorities in Wales'.
No. 126, in page 29, line 45, at end insert "(other than police authorities)".
No. 127, in page 30, line 7, at end insert--
'( ) Before making an order under this section so far as it relates to police authorities in Wales, the Secretary of State must consult--
(a) such representatives of police authorities in Wales as he considers appropriate,
(b) the Commission for Local Administration in Wales, and
(c) the National Assembly for Wales.'.
No. 128, in page 30, line 30, leave out--
'established under section 3 of the Police Act 1996'.--[Mr. Touhig.]
Clause 47
Amendments made: No. 129, in page 30, line 46, after "England" insert--
'and police authorities in Wales'.
No. 130, in page 31, line 3, after "Wales" insert "other than police authorities".
No. 131, in page 31, line 15, leave out from "section" to end of line 16 and insert--
' 46, before an order is made under that section'.--[Mr. Touhig.]
Clause 48
Amendments made: No. 132, in page 32, line 19, leave out "their principal office" and insert--
'an office of the authority'.
No. 133, in page 32, line 30, after "England" insert--
'or a police authority in Wales'.
No. 134, in page 32, line 31, leave out "or".--[Mr. Touhig.]
Clause 50
Amendments made: No. 135, in page 33, line 34, after "England" insert--
'or a police authority in Wales'.
No. 136, in page 33, line 36, after "England" insert--
'or a police authority in Wales'.
No. 137, in page 33, line 47, at end insert--
'and police authorities in Wales'.
No. 138, in page 34, line 16, after "England" insert--
'and police authorities in Wales'.
No. 139, in page 34, line 18, after "England" insert--
'or a police authority in Wales'.
No. 140, in page 34, line 21, after "England" insert--
'and a police authority in Wales'.
No. 141, in page 34, line 24, after "England" insert--
'or a police authority in Wales'.
No. 142, in page 34, line 30, after "Wales" insert "other than police authorities".
No. 143, in page 35, line 6, after "Wales" insert "(other than police authorities)".--[Mr. Touhig.]
Clause 51
Amendments made: No. 144, in page 35, line 32, at end insert--
'and police authorities in Wales'.
No. 145, in page 35, line 35, at end insert "(other than police authorities)".
No. 146, in page 35, line 38, at end insert--
'and police authorities in Wales'.
No. 147, in page 35, line 41, at end insert "(other than police authorities)".--[Mr. Touhig.]
Clause 54
Amendments made: No. 148, in page 38, line 35, after "England" insert--
'and police authorities in Wales'.
No. 149, in page 38, line 38, after "England" insert--
'and police authorities in Wales'.--[Mr. Touhig.]
Clause 61
Amendment made: No. 150, in page 43, line 25, at beginning insert "subject to subsection (4)(b)".--[Mr. Touhig.]
Clause 65
Amendments made: No. 151, in page 46, line 38, after "Wales" insert "(other than police authorities)".
No. 152, in page 46, line 41, after "Wales" insert "(other than police authorities)".--[Mr. Touhig.]
Clause 66
Amendment made: No. 153, in page 47, line 31, leave out "inform" and insert "give written notification to".--[Mr. Touhig.]
Clause 68
Amendment made: No. 154, in page 48, line 44, at beginning insert "subject to subsection (4)(b)".--[Mr. Touhig.]
Clause 69
Amendment made: No. 155, in page 49, line 45, after "suspend" insert "or partially suspend".--[Mr. Touhig.]
Clause 70
Amendment made: No. 156, in page 51, line 21, at end insert--
'( ) In its application to police authorities in Wales, subsection (1) has effect as if for the reference to the National Assembly for Wales there were substituted a reference to the Secretary of State.'.--[Mr. Touhig.]
Clause 78
Amendment made: No. 157, in page 59, line 11, leave out "Wales" and insert--
'standards committees of relevant authorities in Wales (other than police authorities)'.--[Mr. Touhig.]
Clause 79
Amendments made: No. 158, in page 59, line 17, at end insert--
'and police authorities in Wales'.
No. 159, in page 59, line 20, at end insert "(other than police authorities)".
No. 160, in page 59, line 31, at end insert--
'( ) Before making an order under this section so far as it relates to police authorities in Wales, the Secretary of State must consult--
(a) such representatives of police authorities in Wales, and of employees of such authorities, as he considers appropriate,
(b) the Commission for Local Administration in Wales, and
(c) the National Assembly for Wales.'.
No. 161, in page 59, line 34, leave out--
'local government, and of local government employees, in Wales'
and insert--
'relevant authorities in Wales, and of employees of such authorities,'.
No. 209, in page 59, line 44, leave out from "means" to end of line 4 on page 60 and insert--
'an employee of the authority other than an employee falling with any description of employee specified in regulations under this subsection.
( ) The power to make regulations under subsection (7) is to be exercised--
(a) in relation to England, by the Secretary of State, and
(b) in relation to Wales, by the National Assembly for Wales.'.--[Mr. Touhig.]
Clause 80
Amendments made: No. 162, in page 60, line 16, leave out--
'in relation to a relevant authority to which Part II of this Act applies'.
No. 163, in page 60, line 24, at end insert--
' "police authority" means a police authority established under section 3 of the Police Act 1996,'.
No. 164, in page 60, line 36, at end insert--
'( ) Any reference in this Part to a member of a relevant authority, in the case of the Greater London Authority, is a reference to the Mayor of London or a London Assembly member.'.
No. 165, in page 61, line 8, leave out paragraphs (b) and (c).
No. 166, in page 61, line 20, leave out paragraphs (b) and (c).
No. 167, in page 61, line 29, at end insert--
'(b) if the authority is one to which Part II of this Act applies, for being or becoming a member of an executive of the authority.'
No. 168, in page 61, line 43, at end insert--
'( ) Any functions which are conferred by virtue of this Part on a relevant authority to which Part II of this Act applies are not to be the responsibility of an executive of the authority under executive arrangements.
( ) Any functions which are conferred on the Greater London Authority by virtue of this Part are to be exercisable by the Mayor of London and the London Assembly acting jointly on behalf of the Authority.'.--[Mr. Touhig.]
'( ) The Secretary of State may by regulations introduce a form of proportional representation for elections to local authorities in England and Wales.
( ) No statutory instrument containing regulations under subsection (1) above shall be made unless it has been approved by affirmative resolution of both Houses of Parliament.'.--[Mr. Don Foster.]
Brought up, and read the First time.
Mr. Don Foster: I beg to move, That the clause be read a Second time.
Members present who served on the Committee that considered the Bill will be well aware that a considerable amount of our time was spent debating what measures could be taken to improve the public's interest and involvement in local government, and in particular what measures could be taken that would improve turnout at local government elections.
It became increasingly clear that it is the Government's view--erroneous, in my opinion--that turnout at local elections is likely to be increased as a result of their measures to change the decision-making structure of local government. The view that was expressed from the
Liberal Democrat Benches, to some extent supported by Conservative Members, was that such moves were unlikely to make any change in the turnout at local elections, but that two measures might go some way to achieve that much desired aim. The first, as I said earlier, would be to increase the power of local government to ensure that it could take steps to respond to the concerns of the people that it sought to serve; the second would be to change the electoral system.Mr. Michael Thrasher of Plymouth university, an expert in these matters, has estimated that where a form of proportional representation for local government elections is introduced it will be likely to increase turnout by about 7 per cent. That may not seem a particularly significant increase, but given that the starting point is in the order of about 30 per cent., that is a rather more significant increase than it might at first appear.
It was not merely to increase turnout at local elections that we tabled the new clause, however. We did so because we believe that in local government, as in all other spheres of government, the electors have a right to ensure that their voice is heard, and heard in the sense that the parties that they represent, and seek to represent by their votes, are appropriately represented in that particular governing body. The House is well aware that, at present, there are, up and down the land, a number of local councils that are, in effect, one-party states. There are a number of examples where that one-party state is a Labour one-party state, examples where it is Conservative, and even examples where it is Liberal Democrat.
I was speaking only the other day to the leader of Richmond upon Thames council, who pointed out that he has on his council something like 80 per cent. of the seats, having achieved for Liberal Democrats fewer than 50 per cent. of the votes.
Confronted with the problems of an unfair electoral system, it is interesting to note that the Government have already responded. They have seen to the introduction--perhaps not in the form that Liberal Democrats would like--of proportional representation for the European elections, for the Greater London Assembly elections, for the elections for the National Assembly for Wales and for the Scottish Parliament. Of course, for elections to the Assembly and for local government in Northern Ireland, there has been a form of PR for some time. Shortly, we shall see Labour party support in Scotland for the introduction of PR for local government.
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