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Mr. Paul Flynn (Newport, West): Further to that point of order, Mr. Speaker--
Mr. Speaker: Order. Perhaps I can answer the point of order from the hon. Member for Mid-Sussex (Mr. Soames). I cannot guarantee that a statement will be made tomorrow, but I understand that a statement may be made on Wednesday which will reveal all. Does that help the hon. Member for Newport, West (Mr. Flynn)?
Mr. Flynn: Further to that point of order, Mr. Speaker. There are hon. Members who are members of the Western European Union and of the NATO Assembly and who have been discussing these matters on behalf of the parties in the House for many months now. The matter has been thoroughly discussed and is well understood. It is a shame that a practical way to increase the chances of peace and stability in Europe should be used as a political football by the anti-European fanatics among the Opposition.
Mr. David Maclean (Penrith and The Border): Further to that point of order, Mr. Speaker, and your nod and a wink that a statement may be made. Would you be willing to consider a request for an emergency debate if such a statement were not forthcoming from the Government?
Mr. Speaker: Order. These matters are hypothetical. I cannot say more than that there will probably be a statement on Wednesday.
Dr. Julian Lewis (New Forest, East): Further to the point of order, Mr. Speaker, and the comments of the hon. Member for Newport, West (Mr. Flynn). Is it in order for the prerogatives of the House to be usurped by the Western European Union, particularly when so many hon. Members have a great deal of knowledge and expertise in defence matters and know how dangerous the proposal is?
Mr. Speaker: The hon. Gentleman seems to be making a good debating point.
House of Commons Modernisation
Mr. Speaker: Before I call the Leader of the House to move the first motion, I should inform the House that I have selected amendments (b) to (e) and (h) to (k), in the names of the right hon. Members for Bromley and Chislehurst (Mr. Forth) and for Penrith and The Border (Mr. Maclean), to the motion on sittings in Westminster Hall.
In line with recent practice, I propose that, for the convenience of the House, the debates on the three motions be taken together, as they are so clearly interrelated.
Mr. Eric Forth (Bromley and Chislehurst): On a point of order, Mr. Speaker. I am grateful for your guidance. Can you confirm that there will, however, be an opportunity for my right hon. Friend and me to divide the House--if, having listened carefully to the debate, that was necessary in our view--on the amendments that you have kindly selected, as well as on the main motions?
Mr. Speaker: That is certainly possible if the debate is concluded in good time.
Mr. Forth: I do not know about that.
3.35 pm
The President of the Council and Leader of the House of Commons (Mrs. Margaret Beckett): I beg to move,
- That this House approves the Third Report on Thursday Sittings (HC 954) and the Fourth Report on Sittings in Westminster Hall (HC 906) of the Select Committee on Modernisation of the House of Commons.
- That, from the next Session of Parliament until the end of the first Session of the next Parliament, the Standing Orders and practice of the House shall have effect subject to the modifications set out below:
A. (1) The House shall meet on Thursdays at half-past Eleven o'clock, and will first proceed with private business, motions for unopposed returns and questions;
(2) proceedings on business on Thursdays shall be interrupted at Seven o'clock; and
(3) in their application to Thursday sittings of the House, reference to a specified time in the Standing Orders shall be interpreted as reference to a time three hours before the time so specified, save that reference to half-past Ten o'clock shall be substituted for reference to Twelve o'clock in Standing Order No. 24 (Adjournment on a specific and important matter that should have urgent consideration).
B. Standing committees shall have leave to sit at any hour and notwithstanding any adjournment of the House, subject to the following provisions:
(a) on Mondays, Tuesdays and Wednesdays when the House is sitting, no standing committee sitting at Westminster shall sit between the hours of One o'clock and half-past Three o'clock, except as provided in paragraph (2) of Standing Order No. 88 (Meetings of standing committees); and
(b) on Thursdays when the House is sitting, no standing committees sitting at Westminster shall sit between the hours of twenty-five minutes past Eleven o'clock and half-past Twelve o'clock, except as provided in paragraph (2) of Standing Order No. 88 (Meetings of
Motion relating to Westminster Hall--
- That, from the next session of Parliament until the end of the first Session of the next Parliament, the Standing Orders and practice of the House shall have effect subject to the modifications set out below:
(1) On days on which the House shall sit after an address has been agreed to in answer to Her Majesty's Speech there shall be a sitting in Westminster Hall--
(a) on Tuesdays and Wednesdays between half-past Nine o'clock and Two o'clock; and
(b) on Thursdays beginning at half-past Two o'clock and continuing for up to three hours (and in calculating that period no account shall be taken of any period during which the sitting may be suspended owing to a division being called in the House or a committee of the whole House).
(2) Any Member of the House may take part in a sitting in Westminster Hall.
(3) Subject to paragraph (13) below, the business taken at any sitting in Westminster Hall shall be such as the Chairman of Ways and Means shall appoint.
(4) The Chairman of Ways and Means or a Deputy Chairman shall take the chair in Westminster Hall as Deputy Speaker; and the House may appoint not more than four other members of the Chairmen's Panel to sit in Westminster Hall as Deputy Speaker.
(5) Any member of the Chairmen's Panel may also take the chair at a sitting in Westminster Hall when so requested by the Chairman of Ways and Means, with the duties and powers conferred on additional Deputy Speakers; and Members so appointed shall be addressed by name.
(6) Any order made or resolution come to at a sitting in Westminster Hall (other than a resolution to adjourn) shall be reported to the House by the Deputy Speaker and shall be deemed to be an order or resolution of the House.
(7) If a motion be made by a Minister of the Crown that an order of the day be proceeded with at a sitting in Westminster Hall, the question thereon shall be put forthwith, but such motion may be made only with the leave of the House and may not be made on a Friday.
(8) The quorum at a sitting in Westminster Hall shall be three.
(9) If at a sitting in Westminster Hall the opinion of the Deputy Speaker as to the decision of a question (other than a question for adjournment) is challenged, that question shall not be decided, and the Deputy Speaker shall report to the House accordingly; and any such question shall be put forthwith upon a motion being made in the House.
(10) If any business other than a motion for adjournment is under consideration at a sitting in Westminster Hall, and not fewer than six Members rise in their places and signify their objection to further proceedings, that business shall not be further proceeded with in Westminster Hall, and the Deputy Speaker shall report to the House accordingly, and any order under paragraph (7) above relating thereto shall be discharged.
(11) At the end of each sitting in Westminster Hall, unless a question for adjournment has previously been agreed to, the Deputy Speaker shall adjourn the sitting without putting any question; and proceedings on any business which has been entered upon but not disposed of shall lapse.
(12) The provisions of Standing Orders No. 29 (Powers of chair to propose question), No. 36 (Closure of debate), No. 37 (Majority for closure or proposal of question), No. 38 (Procedure on divisions), No. 39 (Voting), No. 40 (Division unnecessarily claimed), No. 41 (Quorum), No. 43 (Disorderly conduct), No. 44 (Order in debate), No. 45 (Members suspended, &c. to withdraw from precincts), No. 45A (Suspension of salary of Members suspended) and No. 163 (Motions to sit in private) shall not apply to sittings in Westminster Hall.
(13) In each Session, the Speaker shall appoint not more than six Thursdays on which the business to be taken in Westminster Hall should be debates on select committee reports chosen by the Liaison Committee.
(14) The House shall meet on Wednesdays at half-past Two o'clock, and paragraphs (1) and (2) of Standing Order No. 9 (Sittings of the House) shall have effect on Wednesdays; and Standing Order No. 10 shall not have effect.
Amendments (b) to (e) and (h) to (k) to the above motion, which would substitute "Chairman" for "Deputy Speaker" throughout.
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