Examination of Witnesses (Questions 116
- 139)
TUESDAY 7 MARCH 2000
MR DAVID
LEWIS, MR
RICHARD NOBLE
AND MR
BARRIE TINKER
Chairman
116. Can I welcome you and can I ask you all
to introduce yourselves for the record?
(Mr Tinker) I am Barrie Tinker and I am the Outdoor
Recreation Manager for Bradford Metropolitan District Council.
(Mr Lewis) David Lewis and I am the Principal Planning
Officer for Thurrock District Council.
(Mr Noble) Richard Noble, Markets and Fairs Officers
for Nottingham City Council.
117. Thank you very much. I do not know whether
you want to make any brief statements before we start or are you
happy to go straight into questions? Can I emphasise that with
questions if you all three agree then one answer will do nicely
but if you disagree please chip in.
(Mr Tinker) Happy to go straight to questions.
(Mr Noble) Yes.
Mr Cummings
118. My questions are directed towards Nottingham
and Bradford. Is there still a place for the entertainment provided
by local fairs?
(Mr Tinker) In Bradford, we believe there is. We have
a policy.
119. We have received evidence from Bradford
that perhaps things are not well. Fairs have been removed for
a total of 19 days.
(Mr Tinker) Fairs have been removed for 19 days previously
some 25 years ago as part of the compulsory purchase. Also we
have increased fairs and fairs are now part and parcel of different
events. The events are no longer, shall we say, the annual round
of public holidays, bank holidays, they now come in different
guises.
120. We have received evidence that perhaps
all is not well in Bradford and perhaps we can come to that later
on. Do you believe that local authorities across the country are
in tune with the public as to the popularity of the travelling
fairs?
(Mr Noble) I would say Nottingham certainly are. We
have increased the numbers of fairs over the last couple of years
if anything and the public seem to be coming back to fairs in
abundance, particularly Nottingham Goose Fair.
121. Does Thurrock have anything to add?
(Mr Lewis) No real issues in Thurrock. Generally on
local authority sites where there are additional controls and
management, no difficulties experienced there.
122. Would you agree with Newham Council who
in evidence have told the Committee that the "... enjoyment
fairs give far outweighs the inconvenience caused"?
(Mr Tinker) Overall, yes.
Chairman: Smiles are very helpful to us but
absolutely hopeless as far as the shorthand writer is concerned.
Mr Cummings
123. Again to Nottingham and Bradford, you are
bearing the brunt of my questions this morning, what problems
do local authorities have in allowing fairs to take place on local
authority land? For example, do they result in large numbers of
complaints from local residents?
(Mr Noble) From our point of view we get a few complaints
but they tend to be the general idea of the fair being there as
opposed to any specific complaints. As soon as the fair is under
way—they tend to be more during the setting up time—we
get very, very few complaints about fairs in Nottingham.
Chairman
124. The Goose Fair you have totally revamped,
have you not?
(Mr Noble) I would not say totally revamped.
125. Well some people would have said destroyed,
I thought I was being kind when I said revamped.
(Mr Noble) In the last few years we have tried to
move with the times a little bit. Certainly I would not say we
have destroyed or revamped it.
126. It is better now than it was?
(Mr Noble) I would say we are improving all the time.
Mr Cummings
127. What would be the reaction of your three
authorities to proposals for a formal appeals procedure against
adverse local authority decisions relating to fairs and fairgrounds?
(Mr Tinker) As part of our policy we have an appeals
procedure but that is a local appeals procedure. I have brought
copies of our policy along for Members if that would be useful.
Chairman
128. It would be very useful, yes.
(Mr Tinker) That is no problem.
129. We will have it at the end.
(Mr Tinker) Right.
(Mr Noble) We have no formal appeals procedure. I
think it is felt within Nottingham that local members are best
placed to discover what the needs of the community and the needs
of the residents and locals are.
(Mr Lewis) Something comparable in Thurrock as Nottingham.
Mr Cummings
130. You are not subscribing to the establishment
of a formal appeals procedure? You are quite happy with an internal
operation, perhaps the use of the ombudsman?
(Mr Noble) Yes.
(Mr Tinker) Yes.
131. As a matter of course would you consult
with the Showmen's Guild or show people themselves about town
centre redevelopment?
(Mr Tinker) I am not able to speak on that one because
my management remit does not cover town centre fairs, it covers
parks and recreation centres.
132. When you start to redevelop in Bradford
would you know whether the Showmen's Guild are consulted?
(Mr Tinker) I would not, no.
(Mr Noble) Me neither.
(Mr Lewis) In our local town centre they were not
consulted in these proposals, not specifically.
133. For any particular reason or just lack
of thought?
(Mr Lewis) Probably a desire to accelerate the process
rather than overdo consultation I think would be the case and
relying on the UDP process and local planning process as being
the better way for wider consultation to take place.
Chairman
134. Now in the local plan process you have
just referred to were the Showmen's Guild consulted about the
provision of fairground sites within the local plan and winter
quarters?
(Mr Lewis) We are just commencing a UDP process. The
last borough plans were several years ago, before we became unitary.
The previous borough plan proposals, I doubt that there was consultation
with the Showmen's Guild. With the current UDP proposal, which
we are embarking on, I think there is a concerted effort to consult
the Showmen's Guild but it has not happened yet.
Mr Cummings
135. Do you believe the show people are generally
receptive to alternative sites for fairs?
(Mr Lewis) I have no experience of that.
Chairman
136. They have not been very receptive to moving
the Goose Fair, have they?
(Mr Noble) It is part of the Goose Fair which is being
moved. I consulted with the members of the Guild myself that have
been affected. I do not think they are particularly overjoyed
with the fact they have to move on the whole but they have been
fairly receptive to ideas of how they can move and how they can
make the best of the situation.
137. Why are they having to move?
(Mr Noble) We are having to move part of the site
due to the new NEC enclosure, meeting offices and storage facilities
and that place has been chosen.
138. Sorry, NEC?
(Mr Noble) Sorry, the new tram system for Nottingham.
Mr Cummings
139. Perhaps we can now revert back to Bradford,
I introduced the subject earlier on. What was the purpose and
the result of the meeting in 1996 relating to fairground operations
on Centenary Square? Do you believe the Christmas fair is likely
to be allowed back on to the Square or to be offered an alternative
site?
(Mr Tinker) I do not manage Centenary Square but I
also brought a written response to the W Marshall's Amusements
allegations of loss of fairs. The Centenary Square Management
have put a paragraph in that they have been offered fairs around
Centenary Square. They may be offered the fair again within Centenary
Square but to their knowledge they have not applied to run the
fair in Centenary Square.
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