Examination of witnesses (Questions 110
- 119)
TUESDAY 14 MARCH 2000
THE RT
HON GEOFFREY
HOON, AIR
COMMODORE PAUL
LUKER and MR
ROGER PAXTON
Chairman
110. Can I thank you, Secretary of State, for
coming so quickly to our Committee to respond to our concerns
about the deployment of defence equipment to Mozambique in view
of the emergency there. We are grateful to you for coming and
for, probably, rearranging your diary as a result of coming here.
I wonder whether you would like to introduce this particular group
with you.
(Mr Hoon) Yes. On my left is Air Commodore Paul Luker—L-U-K-E-R—notwithstanding
the enthusiasm to give him a Balkan-style name. He is also a helicopter
pilot and therefore can deal with some of the more technical matters
that I will not be able to deal with. On my right is Roger Paxton
who is from the Ministry of Defence's Finance and Policy Division.
111. Thank you very much. I understand that
you do not have an opening statement, so perhaps we can go straight
into questions. We want to talk to you about the deployment of
helicopters to Mozambique and the first question, perhaps, is
when was the Ministry of Defence contacted by the Department for
International Development about (a) assets available in the region
and (b) assets available for deployment from the United Kingdom?
At what level were these contacts made?
(Mr Hoon) On Saturday 26 February at around 2 o'clock
the Department for International Development contacted the Ministry
of Defence and spoke to the resident clerk. As I am sure you are
aware, we have a 24-hour system and, essentially, the request
then was whether the Ministry of Defence had any appropriate assets
in the region—that is, in or around Mozambique. The answer
given was that the nearest were in the order of 3,000 miles away,
as perhaps will become clear as we discuss this further. We had
a task group in the Gulf. That was the nearest military—
112. That was what was being referred to, was
it?
(Mr Hoon) Yes.
113. A task group in the Gulf, 3,000 miles away.
How many days steaming—if that is the right—
(Mr Hoon) When I was looking at the availability of
the Royal Fleet Auxiliary, we judged it in the order of nine days'
sailing time—which is perhaps a better phrase. That is obviously
affected by weather conditions and the need, in particular, in
terms of actual deployment, to load certain equipment.
114. And assets available in the UK?
(Mr Hoon) There were a number of assets that could
have been made available in the United Kingdom. That was not a
question that was asked on the Saturday, simply because, quite
rightly and understandably, the Department for International Development
were concerned with getting equipment there as speedily as possible
and, inevitably, assets in the United Kingdom were going to take
a good deal longer to deploy than assets more locally available.
115. Subsequently, of course, you did consider
the deployment from the UK as the crisis worsened in the next
week. We wanted to inquire, first of all, when that inquiry came
to you? We understand that the Ministry of Defence quoted a figure
of 2.2 million as the estimated charges to the Department for
International Development for deploying helicopters to Mozambique.
(Mr Hoon) At the risk of interrupting you, if I could
just set out the context, because I think this is quite important.
In parallel, on Monday morning—
116. That is now the 28th.
(Mr Hoon) On the 28th, the Minister for the Armed
Forces, John Spellar, indicated to his officials the need to prepare
contingency plans in the light of both the request on the Saturday
evening and, obviously, in the light of the rapidly worsening
situation. So by the Monday morning, the Ministry of Defence was
preparing options that could be offered to respond to the situation.
That work was conducted during the day and, essentially, three
different options were identified. Firstly, helicopters, which
would clearly have to be flown down from the United Kingdom; secondly,
a team of Royal Marines with inflatable boats and hovercraft,
and, thirdly, the Royal Fleet Auxiliary Fort George which was
with the task group in the Gulf. At that stage this was simply
contingency planning, these were options that could be made available,
clearly, if the department with a policy lead judged it was appropriate.
117. When did you get a request for the deployment
of helicopters?
(Mr Hoon) Let me make it clear: there is not a stage
at which there is a formal request; the two departments work,
and have been used to working, closely together. There is an exchange
of information and we would have indicated to DFID (I understand
this took place at 9 o'clock on Tuesday morning)—
118. So we are on the 29th.
(Mr Hoon) Yes.—that these various options were
available and were possibilities if the department judged that
it was appropriate. They asked for further information including,
in particular, the question of the costs, and that was information
that then we sought to make available.
119. So DFID knew the options and knew the costs
on the 29th. Is that right?
(Mr Hoon) Yes, by Tuesday afternoon we were able to
provide a very general estimate of the cost. We had not had accountants
working out the precise cost of making these options available;
we were able to give a very general estimate as to the likely
cost, as, indeed, we are required to do under government accounting
rules.
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