House of Commons - Environment, Food and Rural Affairs

Select Committee on Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Fourth Report

PROCEEDINGS OF THE

DISPOSAL OF REFRIGERATORS SUB-COMMITTEE

RELATING TO THE REPORT

MONDAY 13 MAY 2002

Members present:

Mr Michael Jack, in the Chair

Mr David Borrow Mr Austin Mitchell

Mr David Curry Mr David Lepper

Mr Eric Martlew Mr Paddy Tipping

The Sub-committee deliberated.

[Adjourned till Monday 20 May at half past Three o'clock.

MONDAY 20 MAY 2002

Members present:

Mr Michael Jack, in the Chair

Mr David Borrow Mr Austin Mitchell

Mr David Lepper Mr Eric Martlew

Diana Organ Mr Paddy Tipping

The Sub-committee deliberated.

Draft Report [Disposal of Refrigerators], proposed by the Chairman, brought up and read.

Ordered, That the Report be read a second time, paragraph by paragraph.

Paragraphs 1 to 25 read and agreed to.

Paragraph 26 read, as follows:

"Witnesses took different views of the way in which United Kingdom officials acted. Dr Tom Batchelor, of the Climate Change Unit at the European Commission, expressed his surprise at the attitude of the UK officials, saying that previously "the negotiation team in DEFRA has always been very concerned with minimising any releases to the atmosphere. The track that was taken in these arguments here [over Article 16], I would have to admit, was not consistent with the effort that has been put in in the past." Mr Peter Jones, of Biffa Waste Services Limited, told us that in his view the Government had lost sight of its own broad environmental strategy to reduce emissions, and rather than embracing the spirit of the Regulation it had instead focussed too closely on avoiding the burden of implementing its details. He said that "my perception is that we suffered from the wood for the trees syndrome...[UK officials] were in the undergrowth, focussed on the fact that they were trying to work out how they were going to escape from what they saw as an onerous condition that they had agreed to from Europe." In the event, Biffa Waste Services Limited elected not to invest in the specialist equipment necessary for recycling fridges."

Amendment proposed in line 6, after the word "past" to insert the words "However, Dr Batchelor's is a retrospective view which he did not make clear at the time to the Government, to Departments, or to the UK representatives. DEFRA and the Government having long taken this lead in minimising such releases were not attempting to maintain them but to clarify whether the Commission considered that they should also be removed from foam.".-(Mr Mitchell.)

Question put, That the Amendment be made.

The Committee divided.

Ayes, 2 Noes, 4

Mr Austin Mitchell Mr David Borrow

Diana Organ Mr David Lepper

Mr Eric Martlew

Mr Paddy Tipping

Paragraph 26 agreed to.

Paragraphs 27 to 30 read and agreed to.

Paragraph 31 read, as follows:

"In any event, it eventually became clear that the continuing debate about whether foam recovery was 'practicable' under the terms of Article 16(3) was likely to prove redundant: in fact it increasingly seemed that insulating foam fell under Article 16(2), which makes no reference to the practicality of its recovery. Mr Meacher conceded that even in early 2000 officials had been given legal advice that "recovery might come at 16(2)". He said that officials "informed the industry that it was likely that the outcome would be that recovery facilities would be required.....their response to us was to continue to press us strongly for certainty". Certainty came in June 2001, when it was made clear that Article 16(2) applies to the insulating foam. All of the debate about the phrase 'if practicable' was proved to be a waste of time. What is more, there was no mechanism by which the implementation of the Regulation could be delayed."

Amendment proposed, in line 8, before the word "made" to insert the word "belatedly".-(Mr Mitchell.)

Question put, That the Amendment be made.

The Committee divided.

Ayes, 4 Noes, 2

Mr David Borrow Mr Eric Martlew Mr David Lepper Mr Paddy Tipping

Mr Austin Mitchell Diana Organ

Another Amendment proposed, in line 7, after the word "certainty" to insert the words "The kind of certainty on which major investment decisions can be firmly based could come only from the Commission. The crucial problem has been that this was so long delayed and finally came only."-(Mr Mitchell.)

Question put, That the Amendment be made.

The Committee divided.

Ayes, 1 Noes, 5

Mr Austin Mitchell Mr David Borrow Mr David Lepper

Mr Eric Martlew

Diana Organ

Mr Paddy Tipping

Another Amendment proposed, in line 8, leave out the word "All" to the word "time" in line 9.-(Mr Mitchell.)

Question put, That the Amendment be made.

The Committee divided.

Ayes, 3 Noes, 3

Mr David Lepper Mr David Borrow