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27 Jan 2003 : Column 664—continued
Mr. Blunt: The Minister acknowledged that I referred to the interests of the work force during my remarks, but he cannot maintain that the interests of everyone else must come second to the interests of the work force. Clearly, the work force are in a wretched position, but their interests are not paramount over those of the rest of the country or of the taxpayer.
Mr. Wilson: Nobody made that suggestion. I am pointing out that the hon. Gentleman was inconsistent. He advocated administration in 95 per cent. of his speech—an odd position in any case—and then, only at the end, expressed concern about the work force, who do not see administration as their preferred option.
Many of the Opposition speeches were remarkably sanguine about the environment. The whole performance of the Liberal Democrat spokesman, the hon. Member for Twickenham (Dr. Cable), was supposed to be about carbon saving, yet he wants to close down the nuclear industry without the remotest regard for the economic consequences. He is prepared to forgo the revenues from nuclear power stations for the rest of their natural life in order to pursue the objective of turning the key on them at the earliest possible moment.
How does the hon. Gentleman reconcile that approach with his supposed commitment to the imperative of carbon reduction? When it comes to the
point, he and the organisations which he prayed in aid are much more anti-nuclear than pro-low-carbon. They refuse to face up to that dichotomy, but the public can see through it. They cannot have it both ways; they cannot preach a low-carbon message while walking away from a source of electricity that gives the United Kingdom 22 per cent. of our non-carbon generation at present.Opposition spokesmen were remarkably sanguine about safety, which is the other reason that we believe that what we are doing is essential for the future of British Energy and the only way for a responsible Government to act. The principal Opposition spokesman, the hon. Member for Reigate, put forward his plan for administration, but there was no clue as to who, apart from the Government, would take the company out administration. Rather belatedly, the hon. Gentleman sprang up to say that he was against the Government taking the company out of administration.
The hon. Gentleman blithely said that if someone turned up to take the company out of administration or if it continued in administration there should be no bureaucratic impediments to the transfer of licence. Does he understand for a moment what is involved in transferring the licence to operate a nuclear site? Has he spoken to the nuclear installations inspectorate or to the Health and Safety Executive? I am delighted to say that they have made plain to me that there would be no automatic transfer of licence. Anybody who wants to operate a nuclear site, whether an administrator, a company or the state in some form, has to demonstrate that they are capable of doing so. We cannot simply brush aside concerns about security of supply, the impact on the work force, the environmental effects and the safety implications of licence transfer.
Opposition parties vaguely think that they should be against the Government's proposals, but they do not have a clue as to what they would put in their place. At the end of the debate, I am reinforced in my view that what we are doing is the only plausible, practical and pragmatic way to approach the problems of British Energy.
Mr. Drew: Does my hon. Friend accept that there is another important factor—the international aspect of the nuclear industry—and that one of the problems with losing one of the major firms in this country is that it would have a dramatic impact on our ability to work internationally in dealing with all manner of nuclear issues?
Mr. Wilson: Of course I agree with my hon. Friend, but that is not one of the specific purposes motivating us to take action. Some people casually denigrate the nuclear industry, but thank heavens we have that degree of expertise in the United Kingdom, and we can send it out to other parts of the world, particularly parts of the former Soviet Union, where it is valued and where, as a result of the skills that have been developed in the United Kingdom, we can make plants less vulnerable to incidents. We can contribute to the international effort to make those plants safer.
Of course we wish that we did not have the problems that we are addressing tonight. I have personally known about the circumstances at British Energy for a long
time and those at Scottish Nuclear even longer, but those problems are not of our making and the choice that we face is how to respond to them in the most responsible way possible. The actions that we have taken since September have passed those tests. The official Opposition have changed their attitude since then because they recognise that we took the only responsible course of action in the immediate aftermath of those events. We could not walk away from the industry.
Mr. O'Neill: My hon. Friend has rightly identified the expertise—we disagree about the pronunciation of that word—of the British nuclear industry and its personnel, but does he agree that one way in which we could sustain the industry and make it an attractive occupation and a lifetime career would be to give some more positive indications that it will be sustained beyond the next five to 10 years, which is the furthest horizon that most of us can see at the moment, without any positive statements and other positive documents that might be produced in the near future?
Mr. Wilson: In the current circumstances, no one expects any document to say, "Go out and build nuclear power stations", even if it were in the power of a document to say such a thing. That is not to give away anything at all. However, there is a recognition that the industry will be with us for some time to come and that the worst of all worlds would be to lose the skills base on which it will continue to depend, so the future lies in that territory.
I want to return to the point that the Bill is relatively narrow; it is an enabling Bill. It will provide parliamentary authority for the Government to incur expenditure on British Energy, which is necessary in case the company goes into administration. It will amend the Electricity Act 1989 to remove the ceiling on the financial system in relation to nuclear energy, and it will ensure that the Government can acquire British Energy's operating companies if it goes into administration. Those are the narrow purposes of the Bill.
Dr. Ladyman: An issue that has not been touched upon at all in the debate is how we move forward to a hydrogen economy, so that we can really start to make an impact on carbon emissions. How would we achieve a hydrogen economy without a continuing and successful British Energy and a continuing and successful nuclear power industry?
Mr. Wilson: I do not want to second-guess what you might say, Mr. Speaker, but I suspect that one of the reasons why that issue has not been touched on is that it is not the subject of the debate, but, as always, my hon. Friend makes a valuable and constructive point.
I want to try to answer some of the specific points that have been made. The hon. Member for Reigate seemed to blame BNFL for British Energy's difficulties. We had a little bit of an exchange about that, and I utterly refute what he says. I stress that the agreement that BNFL and British Energy eventually reach will be similar to that which the companies discussed last year. It ultimately became clear last year that BNFL could have done
nothing on its own that would have been sufficient to help British Energy, given the company's position at the time.As I said, I find the Tories' support for administration strange, but that is their business. For our part, we responded to the company's plan for solvent restructuring. We assessed its implications with our financial advisers, and decided that we would play our part and support it. Administration has always remained an option for the company if its plan did not succeed. Whatever route we go down, British Energy's historic costs will be borne by the Government, and we know that there is not exactly a queue of buyers waiting to acquire the company. As the Opposition story unfolded, I waited for the final chapter, in which, with one leap, they would be free by telling us who are the mysterious people who are going to take the company out of administration—I am still waiting to hear. That reaffirms the point that it would have been irresponsible of this Government to push or to seek to push the company into administration.
We have already pointed out that stations generate more revenue than their operating costs, and I am surprised that anyone even questions that—it is a pretty straightforward calculation. Because of the high capital costs of nuclear power stations, the operating costs are relatively marginal, and the revenue generated by every station outweighs them. As I said at the outset, it would be economic madness to shut the stations down and lose the revenue. I extrapolated from that that because it is economic madness—although it has a certain populous ring to it—it defines the economic policy of the Liberal Democrats.
I also want to take issue with the hon. Member for Reigate about the Bruce station in Canada. He was the first to point out the risks involved in the leaseholder of the Bruce station repossessing the plant in the event of administration. I stress, however, that the decision to dispose of Bruce Power was not imposed as a condition of Government support and was taken by British Energy in October to preserve value against the risk that I have just highlighted.
While it seemed at one point that we would have rather long winding-up speeches, we are now having fairly short ones. I will undertake to write to other hon. Members who have raised substantive points tonight.
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