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28 Mar 2003 : Column 574—continued
10.11 am
Sir Sydney Chapman (Chipping Barnet): I am grateful to speak in the debate, not least because I am privileged to be one of the sponsors of the Bill promoted by the hon. Member for Milton Keynes, North-East (Brian White). I congratulate him on his good fortune in drawing sixth place in the ballot. I have to say that in all
the years that I have been a Member of the House, I have been successful in the ballot only once, when I drew 10th place back in 1970 AD. I wish the Bill Godspeed and greatly hope that the House will support it. The hon. Gentleman tells us that all the political parties support the Bill, so once again we may be in danger of having a political love-in during the debate.The Bill admirably seeks to enhance the Government's commitment to achieve energy efficiency, including targets for renewables, combined heat and power and so forth. Let us remember that when the Government introduced their White Paper on 24 February this year, one of its four objectives was
- "to ensure that every home is adequately and affordably heated"—
I particularly welcome clause 1, which places a duty not only on the Secretary of State but on the appropriate authorities to report progress in achieving specific targets. I shall return to them in a moment. I also welcome clause 2, which requires the Secretary of State to achieve improvements in domestic energy efficiency—by at least 20 per cent. by 2010 on the baseline of 2002. Clause 4, which amends the Utilities Act 2000, requires the regulator Ofgem to have regard to sustainable energy policy. Also welcome is clause 6, which is designed to help eradicate fuel poverty by ensuring, among other things, better co-ordination between national and local action.
I support targets, though they can be overdone. Apart from supporting this Bill, the hon. Gentleman and I share several things in common, one of which is membership of the Public Administration Committee, which has recently completed an inquiry into targets. He will correct me if I am wrong, but I believe that we discovered that the Benefits Agency had either set itself, or had imposed on it, 152 targets. There is a danger of over-targeting. Nevertheless, I am a keen supporter of targets because they help to focus not only the Government's intentions but public support. It helps if everyone knows what the Government are trying to achieve on a specific issue by a particular time.
Several aspects of the Government White Paper disappoint me. Strangely, it does not provide an energy efficiency target—that is why I am particularly pleased that the hon. Gentleman's Bill does and specifies the mechanisms for delivery. As already mentioned, the White Paper says:
- "The cheapest, cleanest and safest way of addressing our energy policy objectives is to use less energy".
With the indulgence of the House, let me examine the targets more carefully. The performance and innovation unit stated in its energy review that the Government
should aim to have 20 per cent. of electricity production to be provided by renewable sources by 2020. The hon. Gentleman will know that the Sustainable Development Commission increased the target to 25 per cent. The Environmental Audit Committee backed the performance and innovation unit's target, and I am delighted to see that the 25 per cent. target appears in the hon. Gentleman's Bill.It will certainly be difficult to reach 10 per cent. by 2010—the first mile post for renewable production. The Minister may be able to confirm that currently only about 3 per cent. of electricity production is through renewables. The hon. Member for Preseli Pembrokeshire (Mrs. Lawrence) referred to the different forms of renewables. I shall not list them all, but we have been talking about onshore or offshore wind power, solar power, tidal power, wind and wave power, geothermal, biomass and so forth. It seems to me that the Government have simply said, "You out there must reach 10 per cent. by 2010," but I believe that specific targets should be set. I realise that they have to be flexible: there may be good developments in one form of renewable energy, but difficulties encountered in others. Nevertheless, the Government should provide much more specific advice and establish targets for the different forms of renewable energy.
On combined heat and power, the target is to achieve an increase in installed capacity of at least 10 GW by 2010, and of a further 10 GW by 2020. I did not gain A-level mathematics at school but I understand that a gigawatt is 1,000 million watts.
I have some worries about carbon dioxide emissions. The target is a 20 per cent. reduction by 2010 on 1990 levels. The White Paper says that the Government want to move towards 20 per cent., which does not sound like a specific and firm commitment. Labour Members will know that I am an avid reader of their party manifestos. I simply remind them that both the 1997 and 2001 Labour party manifestos included a firm commitment to a 20 per cent. reduction in carbon dioxide levels by 2020. Let us remember that the royal commission on environmental pollution advocated the 20 per cent. target and I certainly welcome the far-sighted and specific target in the hon. Gentleman's Bill of aiming for a 60 per cent. reduction in such emissions by 2050. Worryingly, the Department's own estimates suggest that carbon dioxide emissions increased in 2000 and 2001. To pluck a figure from the air, since 1997, there has been an increase of 1.2 per cent. in carbon dioxide emissions. There is therefore a serious challenge ahead, and I hope that the Government are laying plans to try and reverse that trend—we hope that it is just of the moment—and achieve the target of a 20 per cent. reduction.
I applaud some of the things that the Government have done in this area. As the hon. Member for Milton Keynes, North-East said, the promotion of sustainable energy has all-party support, but I wish that the Government would try to be a little more open. I believe that there is great support among the public for making sustainable development a reality. The Government would do themselves, as well as the House, a good turn if they shared those targets, added them specifically to the Bill, and approved them. We could then work together to try to achieve them.
I have the great privilege of serving as chairman of the sustainable development committee in the 44-nation Council of Europe. The Bill is a small but important step towards bringing about sustainable development.
Mr. Gareth Thomas : I broadly congratulate the hon. Gentleman on the way in which he has supported the Bill promoted by my hon. Friend the Member for Milton Keynes, North-East (Brian White) and on his chairmanship of the committee to which he has just referred. Will he consider trying to find a place on that committee for Bernard Ingham to educate him about the benefits of sustainable development, particularly wind power. He seems to be one of the key figures on the hon. Gentleman's side still opposed to wind power.
Sir Sydney Chapman: I have learned something from the hon. Gentleman, but I am afraid that Sir Bernard Ingham is unlikely to be able to secure a place on my committee, simply because the Council of Europe consists of parliamentary representatives from 44 nations.
Mr. Chope: Given my hon. Friend's great knowledge of the situation in Europe, will he enlighten us as to why domestic electricity prices in Denmark are about 70 per cent. higher than they are here? Denmark is just about the only country in Europe to rely heavily on wind power generation, so are the two connected?
Sir Sydney Chapman: I do not think they are, but I would not claim to be the expert that my hon. Friend thinks that I am. To be serious, when we talk about biodiversity and sustainable development, do electors know exactly what we are talking about? Are we talking about vital things in a language that they can understand? I attended the world summit on sustainable development in Johannesburg last year as chairman of that Council of Europe committee. I addressed parliamentary representatives at the conference, and gave a prize to the person who could explain in the fewest words exactly what sustainable development is. I got it down to seven words—not that the shortest explanation won, but the one that was easiest for the public to understand. I defined sustainable development as "conserving earth's finite resources for future generations."
Ms Shipley: I know that the hon. Gentleman's CV includes an interest in architecture. In the context of his remarks on sustainable development, does he agree that the Government have a massive house, school and hospital building programme, and there is a major opportunity to introduce all the green measures that many of us want and make them an integral part of that programme? With the hon. Gentleman's architectural background, would he like to comment on that?
Sir Sydney Chapman: I would be delighted to respond to that request from the hon. Lady, who is chairman of the all-party group on architecture and planning. In passing, we have a saying in the Royal Institute of British Architects that some of the most successful architects are sent to the other place—the failures come to the House of Commons. There are very few failures in architecture, because I am the only architect in the House of Commons at the moment.
In conclusion, I feel strongly that the Bill is thoroughly commendable, and is a small but useful step towards promoting sustainable development, which is vital for the future of our eco-system. I qualified as an architect many years ago, and believe that design is an integral part of sustainable development—that is the point that I wish to get over. It is amazing, in a country which boasts the fourth-largest economy in the world, that not all our people live in warm homes. That is a blot on any nation which calls itself civilised.
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