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7 Apr 2003 : Column 50—continued
Lembit Öpik : The amendment was tabled by the Liberal Democrats and supported—grudgingly, I now realise—by the Conservatives. It would introduce an order preventing the powers on ex-prisoners becoming members of district policing partnerships and the Belfast sub-groups from coming into force until the Assembly had been restored.
We all agree that we would not want such powers to be introduced until acts of completion had taken place. Everybody understands that, and it has been debated recently, but the argument is based on whether it is possible specifically to define "acts of completion" to the extent that that could be included in the Bill. Unfortunately, the hon. Member for Grantham and Stamford (Mr. Davies) does not have a full recollection of what I said, although obviously he can re-read my speech in Hansard. The crucial element was my challenge to Ministers to accept either that they had to include acts of completion in the Bill, or that they had to concede the apparently obvious point that every Secretary of State has chosen to maintain some political flexibility in defining acts of completion.
That was a stark option and, in fairness, the Secretary of State went a long way towards implicitly accepting something that we already knew: that Secretaries of State would maintain that flexibility, which is no greater than that displayed by John Major when he was Prime Minister and by many of his Ministers when they were in charge of Northern Ireland policy.
In the intervening time, I have been persuaded that it is difficult, legally, to define what can be construed as an act of completion. For me, it would need to consist of decommissioning, an end to paramilitary beatings, shootings and intimidation and a statement from paramilitary groups lifting the threats against those exiled from their homes and allowing them to return.
For me to say that I am persuaded that it is hard to define acts of completion is not to suggest that I have changed my view. I never thought that it was easy to define. Had the Secretary of State asked my advice, it would have been for the Government to say that acts of completion were as much symbolic statements as they were measurable in any practical sense. To that extent, following consideration and discussion, it seemed appropriate for us to move forward in line with amendment No. 48A towards something that seemed to be significant progress on how the Bill was laid out.
In my judgment, amendment No. 48A effectively adds considerable responsibility to the Northern Ireland parties in terms of the decision-making process and of
how far the paramilitaries have come. The fact that the restoration of the Assembly is an essential element provides us with a creative solution to at least part of the problem.Disappointingly, the hon. Member for Grantham and Stamford sought to gain party political capital from the fact that the Liberal Democrats have approached this issue pragmatically. I counsel him to be cautious. It was, after all, the Conservatives who signed the amendment. Clearly, Conservative Members who thought that we might gain a significant victory signed the amendment grudgingly. The hon. Gentleman himself said that the Conservatives were going to vote against some Northern Ireland measures on principle, although we established from his words—it is all there in Hansard—that they disagreed with only two of the 298 clauses of the Bill in question. However, the retreat was sounded and the Conservatives abstained. The Conservatives criticised the suspension of the Northern Ireland Assembly, but were unable, during cross-questioning by me and others, to say what they would have done as an alternative, apart from some bluster about the fact that the Government were punishing the wrong people.
On another occasion, the Conservatives, led by the hon. Member for Grantham and Stamford, voted against the extension of an amnesty that they had introduced. That is cynicism; it is an inconsistent approach to Northern Ireland politics. By comparison, the Liberal Democrats try to take an honest, transparent and constructive approach.
5.15 pm
Mr. Quentin Davies: Everything that the hon. Gentleman has said—every allegation that he has made—has been misinformed or fanciful. In parliamentary terms, I cannot put it more strongly than that. The suggestion that we criticised the Government for suspending the institutions without proposing an alternative is absurd. Last July, before the crisis—we expected there to be a further crisis, given the Government's tactics—I set out our alternative, which was to provide the Secretary of State with powers to suspend. All the hon. Gentleman's comments are completely nonsensical. My noble colleagues in another place accepted the amendment, albeit reluctantly—as I rightly and advisedly pointed out—because the more desirable amendment, which, given the assertions of the hon. Gentleman and his colleagues last Thursday, we had every expectation would pass with Liberal support, was not accepted because the Liberal Democrats changed their mind. As always, they simply run away as soon as they hear sound of cannon fire. They only need a telephone call from No. 10 saying, "Please fall back into line" and they fall back into line.
Lembit Öpik: I always enjoy the hon. Gentleman's words, even when they are directed at me. I am smiling only because his retort was so well constructed, but in response may I ask him whether it is beyond his capacity to understand the point that I made? I am sure that it is not, and that he is being mischievous. I remind him of what I said only a few days ago to the same Members to whom I am speaking now, standing in this very spot—or within six inches of it: the Government should either
include provisions about acts of completion in the Bill, or accept that they want to maintain political flexibility in defining acts of completion. I should have liked the Secretary of State to admit what every Secretary of State for Northern Ireland has known for the last 20 or 30 years: in such matters, Ministers always want latitude so that they can change their position based on expediency. I stated that if the Government were willing to admit that we would drop the proposal. In effect, that is what the record shows.The hon. Member for Grantham and Stamford is entitled to say that he does not accept my binary alternative—of including provisions about acts of completion in the Bill, or accepting that political flexibility is required and doing something else. However, the Liberal Democrats are comfortable that the Government have implicitly accepted that point and that Ministers have accepted an amendment, proposed by Lord Smith of Clifton, that would reduce the latitude a little more and, crucially, would introduce an element of responsibility for the Northern Ireland parties themselves in the decision about when acts of completion had been fulfilled.
Lady Hermon: When an order lifting suspension is made, only the 10 Ministers who are currently suspended will return to office. The two Democratic Unionist Ministers resigned before suspension, so they will not automatically resume office. The Policing Board is made up of 19 members, 10 of whom are Assembly Members. It would thus be difficult for DUP Members to continue their membership of the Policing Board. That is an important change from our previous policy and I am not at all happy with the amendment. Before the hon. Gentleman welcomes it so enthusiastically, will he address the issue that I raised?
Lembit Öpik: If the hon. Lady will allow me to do so, I would be more inclined to intervene on her speech to respond to that issue in specific terms, because it has more than one element. In strategic terms, she is right. The amendment would introduce other issues, but those are less profoundly worrying, certainly to me, than not having the condition on the restoration of the Assembly in the first place. Any Government can play with legislation to get what they want if they are willing to move away from the spirit of that legislation. Perhaps partly because of the pressures that the hon. Lady describes, there is a genuine cost to Northern Ireland parties if they do not constructively participate in making the decision.
The hon. Member for Grantham and Stamford annoyed me a little by suggesting that there is a degree of cynicism among Liberal Democrat Members. He may question my list of criticisms of the Conservatives, but I wonder whether he would really deny that on one occasion he suggested that the IRA had initiated acts of decommissioning because the Conservative party had called an Opposition day debate on Northern Ireland policy. He may say now that that was a joke or that it was fanciful, but he cannot deny that that is what it says in Hansard.
Moving on to the present day, the hon. Gentleman, in criticising the amendment and speaking more generally, said—I paraphrase—that were he Secretary of State for Northern Ireland, he would demand complete
disbandment and complete decommissioning. What does he mean by complete disbandment and complete decommissioning? If he can outline a clear process whereby we can understand that those two things have happened, he is not only in the wrong job—he should be the decommissioning commissioner—but he will have gone far further than anyone has so far been able to go in the course of this debate.
Lembit Öpik: The hon. Gentleman is about to give us another pearl of wisdom.
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