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Roger Casale (Wimbledon): My constituents in south-west London want to see much more money being spent on the rail service. Does my right hon. Friend accept, however, that if we are to do this not only through increased public investment but through limited fare increases, we need a service that is not only reliable and efficient but much more responsive to customer needs? If, having waited in a queue for 15 minutes because stations are understaffed and the automatic ticket machines are not working, customers are unable to get the through ticket that they need, we
are unlikely to see the benefit of those increased fares, because many people will choose not to travel by rail at all.
Mr. Darling: I agree: the whole experience of going by train needs to be attractive. People do not want to be held up, and they do not want the trains to be late. At least some of my hon. Friend's constituents will be pleased to know that South West Trains is about to introduce a new fleet of trains, which will be a vast improvement on the old slam-door trains that should have been replaced years ago. I suspect that those trains were running when he and I were children, if not before. That is a welcome investment, but I return to the same point: people will welcome all this new investment, and reliability will improve, but in their heart of hearts, people know that we have to put money into the system, and that it has to be paid for in some way—either through fares or through taxation. However, I strongly agree with everything that has been said today about the industry having to understand that if it does not get a grip on reliability and costs, it will face an uphill struggle. Based on what I have seen, however, I am optimistic. I know that this will take time, and there are no quick fixes, but I believe that it can be done. Indeed, for the good of the transport system in this country, it needs to be done.
BILL PRESENTED
Corporate Responsibility
Linda Perham presented a Bill to make provision for certain companies to produce and publish reports on environmental, social and economic and financial matters; to consult on proposed operations of the company; to specify certain duties and responsibilities of directors; to establish a right of access to information held by companies; to specify the powers and duties of the Secretary of State; to provide for remedies for aggrieved persons; and for related purposes: And the same was read the First time; and ordered to be read a Second time on Friday 11 July, and to be printed. [Bill 129].
Point of Order
2.13 pm
Mr. Andrew Robathan (Blaby): On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. Very unusually, we are about to debate the conduct of investigations into past cases of abuse in children's homes. In the recent reshuffle, a Minister for Children was appointed for the first time. Surely this subject should fall within her remit, but the Minister for Children, the hon. Member for Barking (Margaret Hodge) is not here. Furthermore, there was an amazing attack on the hon. Lady in the Evening Standard on Monday—I do not know whether it was justified or not—which particularly pertained to the conduct of investigations into child abuse in children's homes—
Mr. Deputy Speaker (Sir Michael Lord): Order. I think that I can deal with the hon. Gentleman's point of order straight away. It is entirely a matter for the Government whom they seek to put on the Treasury Bench to represent them in debates such as these.
ESTIMATES DAY[3rd Alloted Day]
ESTIMATES, 2003–04
Children's Homes (Investigations)
HOME OFFICE
[Relevant documents: The Fourth Report from the Home Affairs Committee, Session 2001–02, on The Conduct of Investigations into Past Cases of Abuse in Children's Home, HC836, and the Government's reply thereto (Cm. 5799); and the Home Office Annual Report for 2003 (Cm. 5908).]
Motion made, and Question proposed,
- That further resources, not exceeding £17,181,299,000, be authorised for use for the year ending on 31st March 2004, and that a further sum, not exceeding £7,391,463,000, be granted to Her Majesty out of the Consolidated Fund for the year ending on 31st March 2004 for expenditure by the Home Office.—[Ms Bridget Prentice.]
2.14 pm
David Winnick (Walsall, North): This debate was due to be opened by the Under-Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs, my hon. Friend the Member for Sunderland, South (Mr. Mullin) who, as the House knows, was Chairman of the Home Affairs Committee up to his Government appointment last week. He has gone on to higher things—or lower, as the case may be. I have agreed to carry out the Chairman's duties on a temporary basis until a permanent replacement is duly appointed by the Committee.
Let me say at the outset that this report in no way minimises child abuse. Acts of abuse, physical and sexual, are indeed dreadful crimes, often leading to lasting damage and trauma to individuals. The police are certainly right to treat it with the utmost seriousness, and we would all be disappointed if that were not the case. However, it is also important that justice should be done and that the innocent should not be convicted. The Committee received a large number of representations from people accused of child abuse who maintain their innocence, from their relatives, and from journalists, lawyers and colleagues. My hon. Friend the Member for Crosby (Mrs. Curtis-Thomas), who I see is here today, also made vigorous representations to us on this issue. I understand that she is chair of the all-party group on abuse investigations.
Members of the judiciary have also expressed concern. In our report we quote Judge Jonathan Crabtree, who, in 1999, having dismissed all charges against a defendant, expressed serious concerns over the difficulties of defending such allegations. This quote from the judge appears in our report:
- "Anyone who is in charge of children is vulnerable to allegations of assault from some dissatisfied or angry child, and if no complaint is made for months or years, how can any teacher, social worker, nurse defend themselves? . . . How is he or she going to be able to . . . prove his or her innocence when so much time has passed?"
The allegation of child abuse is easily made, but it is very difficult to recover from, even if the person concerned is vindicated as a result of police inquiries or before a court. In some instances, accused teachers or care workers—however vindicated—may never work again.
Mr. A. J. Beith (Berwick-upon-Tweed): I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman and his colleagues for the work that they have done. To highlight what he is saying, the Committee has pointed out that in the Northumbria police area, where Operation Rose was carried out, 60 people were arrested but only five have been successfully prosecuted, with three cases outstanding. That adds up to a very large number of people whose lives have been ruined and whose career prospects have been destroyed.
David Winnick: The right hon. Gentleman makes a valid point.
In the last five years, 34 of the 43 police forces in England and Wales have been involved in investigations into allegations of abuse in children's homes and other institutions. I want to emphasise, on behalf of the Committee, that we do not criticise the police for doing this. Indeed, all hon. Members would agree that they would be criticised if they did not carry out their duties when allegations were made. In Merseyside alone, the police investigated 510 former care workers suspected of child abuse. Of those, 67 individuals were charged, leading to 36 convictions and nine acquittals. The remaining 22 cases were discontinued or dismissed in court. These investigations have had a very high failure rate. The Crown Prosecution Service rejects no less than 79 per cent. of cases referred by the police, against an average of 13 per cent. for all types of charge. I would have thought that those statistics should set alarm bells ringing.
Child abuse cases differ from other criminal investigations in several ways, and we learned a lot as a result of our inquiry. First, they relate to events that may or may not have occurred 10, 20 or, indeed, 30 years ago. That gives rise to obvious questions of identification. For instance, there have been cases in which it has been shown that the accused was not working in a care home when his accuser was there. Often, such a conclusive defence is possible only because the relevant records have been preserved. What would have happened if they had not?
Mr. Dominic Grieve (Beaconsfield): It is indeed a feature, which appears in the report, that in many cases the documents have been destroyed, notwithstanding the rule that documents and records need to be preserved in the case of child care for the rest of the child's life.
David Winnick: Yes. I am sure that the Minister will deal with that point, because it is indeed relevant and people's reputations, as well as whether they end up in prison, could depend on records being preserved.
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