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Kevin Brennan (Cardiff, West): May we have a debate on innovative practices in prescription in the NHS, in particular the Cardiff book prescription scheme, which allows general practitioners to prescribe highly effective
self-help books for people with mild to moderate mental health problems? It was pioneered in Cardiff by Dr. Neil Frude and Dr. Jackie Gantley. It is a world first and worthy of being rolled out across the rest of the UK.In welcoming my right hon. Friend to his new post as Leader of the House, may I offer him some advice? Should he require any reading himself to deal with the shadow Leader of the House and the Liberal Democrat Front-Bench spokesman, I suggest "Arsenic and Old Lace".
Peter Hain: I am grateful for my hon. Friend's suggestion and will bear it in mind.
I applaud my hon. Friend for bringing that innovative scheme to the attention of the House. It deserves a lot of scrutiny and I am sure that my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Health will want to consider it. My hon. Friend has the opportunity on Wednesday to raise the matter again during Welsh questions. No doubt other opportunities will also arise.
Mr. Andrew Mackay (Bracknell): As the Leader of the House has a distinguished record, unlike some of his colleagues, on standing up to tyranny in Zimbabwe, and as he has spoken out on a number of occasions, will he give us a guarantee that there will at least be a ministerial statement, and preferably a debate, on Zimbabwe before the House rises? Those of us who were present in Portcullis House yesterday to hear Andrew Meldrum, the distinguished correspondent for The Guardian and The Observer who was thrown out of Zimbabwe, came away with a clear conclusion that it is urgent that the House takes further action.
Peter Hain: I agree with the right hon. Gentleman's general sentiments. I share his horror at the atrocities committed over the years by Robert Mugabe's regime. Tyranny is running riot in Zimbabwe. It has to be stopped and checked. I think that Zimbabwe's neighbours share a responsibility for seeking to end that situation, which is disfiguring the whole of the southern African sub-continent, especially in terms of investor confidence. I also applaud what the right hon. Gentleman said about Andrew Meldrum. He is a fine and brave journalist who was kicked out by Mugabe and his thugs. He bears testimony to the dreadful damage that the regime is doing to that once beautiful, proud and effective country.
On whether there is time for a statement, I shall certainly draw the right hon. Gentleman's request to the attention of the Foreign Secretary. We will have to see what transpires.
Mr. Gerald Kaufman (Manchester, Gorton): With regard to the Hunting Bill on Monday, will my right hon. Friend give me two assurances on procedure? First, it has been put to me that there is an intention on the part of the Government that the Bill will be recommitted to a Standing Committee at the end of the Report stage. If that were to happen, it would be an underhanded device, which would arouse intense anger in this House and elsewhere. That being so, I ask my right hon. Friend to give me an absolutely categorical assurance that there is no such intention.
Secondly, my right hon. Friend will recall that on 21 March 2002, the Minister for Rural Affairs, speaking from the Dispatch Box, gave me an assurance that, in whatever form the Bill is completed, it will proceed to the House of Lords in that form. My right hon. Friend the Minister for Rural Affairs said:
- "I am absolutely clear that if the Government introduce a Bill that is amended in the House of Commons, our promise in relation to allowing the Parliament Act to obtain will apply."—[Official Report, 21 March 2002; Vol. 382, c. 462.]
- "I certainly stand by . . . my reply to your question".
Peter Hain: First, I associate myself with my right hon. Friend's long and honourable record of voting in the House and arguing persistently for an end to cruelty. That has been exactly my position and I have often joined him in the Lobby in echoing that. The Government have a manifesto commitment on the matter and it is one that we intend to fulfil.
On my right hon. Friend's second question on the Parliament Acts and the procedure around the Hunting Bill, I confirm that the statement by my right hon. Friend the Minister for Rural Affairs on 21 March 2002, which is recorded in Hansard, stands. That is the position that we will follow and the Government stand by it.
On my right hon. Friend's first question, we share the same objectives. It is the overwhelming view of the House to end cruelty, but it would be remiss of me not to explain the procedures that are likely to occur to fulfil the will of the House, whatever that might be on Monday. We are not sure which amendments will be carried and we are not sure whether all the amendments that have currently been tabled will be the end of the story. Further amendments may also be tabled. We will have to see.
I have been advised by parliamentary counsel—I am sure that my right hon. Friend will want me to be absolutely open and transparent about this, as I always hope to be with the House—that the Bill may need to be recommitted—[Hon. Members: "Ah!"] Well, wait for it; it is actually helpful to my right hon. Friend. I have been advised by parliamentary counsel that the Bill may need to be recommitted for the purpose of making technical and consequential amendments, without which the Bill, as amended, may not be effective law. That amended Bill would obviously have to be debated on Report and Third Reading and, as a result, it is doubtful whether it is possible to get it into the Lords before the recess. This is not a question of seeking to frustrate the intentions—
Mr. Kaufman: Absolutely disgraceful.
Peter Hain: I am sorry that my right hon. Friend said that, as it is surely in his interest and the interest of the whole House to have a good Bill. It may be that recommittal is not necessary. Technically and in other
respects, the Bill may be in good enough shape to go to the House of Lords—[Interruption.] Actually, this is quite an important point and my right hon. Friend deserves a full answer. He will understand that if a defective Bill leaves this House, it will not be covered by the Parliament Act. It is therefore in his interests, as it is in the interests of the Minister for Rural Affairs, the Government as a whole and Labour Members who want to join together in banning cruelty, to ensure that the Bill that leaves this House for the other place is not defective, not least because it would not be covered by the Parliament Act.
Mr. John Bercow (Buckingham): Will the tax-raising and part-time Leader of the House arrange for an early debate on the subject of the Hattersley thesis on taxation? As long ago as 13 March 1995, Lord Hattersley said in The Guardian:
- "Labour now has a clear choice. It can either be the party of higher taxation and proud of it; or the party of higher taxes which it is ashamed to describe, afraid to admit and incapable of calculating with any accuracy."
Peter Hain: The answer is no. The real choice facing the nation is between a Tory economic programme of boom and bust, unfair taxation and 20 per cent. public spending cuts and a Labour policy of economic stability, fair taxation and public investment to generate high-quality public services. That is the choice before the nation, and I am confident that it will decide in favour of Labour and reject the Tories yet again at the next general election.
David Winnick (Walsall, North): As regards Monday's business, will my right hon. Friend confirm that there will be a genuine free vote among Labour Members, including Ministers? Arising from what he said a moment ago, does he accept both that there is an overwhelming desire among a large majority of Labour MPs for a total ban on fox hunting, and that the matter should be resolved in this Parliament, although it should have been resolved in the last Parliament? Will the Leader of the House bear that in mind? There should be no shilly-shallying to avoid making a decision which, as I have said, is wanted by the majority of us and, I believe, a majority of people in the country.
Peter Hain: I share my hon. Friend's objectives, and we all share them as a Government—[Interruption.] Well, the Conservatives do not because they do not want to end cruelty. We are united in wanting to do so. The issue is about taking the Bill forward in a coherent form—that is the only issue to arise from the question of my right hon. Friend the Member for Manchester, Gorton (Mr. Kaufman). I can confirm that there will be a free vote and that the will of the House will be respected. May I congratulate my hon. Friend the
Member for Walsall, North (David Winnick) on his birthday? I understand that he is 70 today, and I wish him a happy birthday.
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