| Previous Section | Index | Home Page |
Mr. Simon Thomas: Amendment No. 23 is a probing amendment so that we can return in the House to an issue that I considered in Committee and on which I think it important to hear the views of the promoter and the Minister. We all accept that the Bill in the form in which we are now considering it is significantly changed from the Bill originally introduced by the hon. Member for Ipswich (Mr. Mole). It has been improved as a result of the process that it has undergone. However, one thing has been lost.
In the original Bill, clause 7(2)(a) stated that it would be right for a deposit library or a person acting on its behalf to copy relevant material for the purposes of
preservation. That clause was replaced by new clause 2, which has become clause 7 in the Bill before us. It has been further amended by the hon. Member for Ipswich today. The Bill makes it clear that it is okay for a library to copy material for the purpose of making information available to readers, but there is no specific cover for a librarian or archivist making a copy for archival purposes. There is something to be gained in that respect. We must recognise that not only the content of online or off-line non-print material can be of historic and cultural significance, but its format. Sometimes the way in which the information was made available to the public can also be of interest in the future. Therefore, it is sometimes not only the content that should be given to succeeding generations, but knowledge of how it was made available. The equivalent are the values of different editions of the same book. Later editions of an original publication may have different illustrations or have been put together in a different way to react to the way in which the audience has changed over succeeding generations. That can tell us a lot about how our culture has changed in that period, and the same is true of non-print materials.I am concerned that the Bill in its current format would make it easy to ensure that information is kept available to the reader, but would not allow a librarian or archivist to ensure that its format is preserved. In other words, preservation is not recognised, despite its inclusion in the long title of the Bill, as a reason for copying in itself.
When I raised that matter in Committee, the then Minister, now the Minister of State, Department for Transport, who has been replaced by the Minister of the year—I welcome her to these proceedings—said that my questions
- "went a little further than that",
- "we will certainly reconsider the matter to see whether things can be further clarified, as we are talking about an important and valuable function."—[Official Report, Standing Committee F, 4 June 2003; c. 2.]
Estelle Morris: I listened carefully to the speech of the hon. Member for Ceredigion (Mr. Thomas). I certainly support my hon. Friend the Member for Ipswich (Mr. Mole) in his belief that the matters that are being raised are covered in our amendments. In the spirit of helpfulness, however, I should like to say that I trust the hon. Gentleman's judgment on this issue. If he has ongoing fears or reservations in respect of his suggestion that it is not properly covered, will he accept from me an assurance that we will have the chance to discuss it outside the Chamber and reflect on it? If we are persuaded that we have not made appropriate safeguards to ensure that what he says needs to be done is done—I accept that we must preserve such things for
future generations—we will take the opportunity to table an amendment in another place. That is not a promise to table an amendment, but given the passion and clarity with which he spoke, I hesitate to say that he should have no fears and that the issue is fully dealt with. I am merely trying to be helpful, because I do not have the background knowledge to know whether there are genuine grounds for his fears. All I can say is that I am assured by our lawyers that his concerns should be covered. If we discuss the matter outside the Chamber, we will be left with an opportunity to table amendments should it be necessary to do so.That apart, I support the comments and recommendations made by my hon. Friend the Member for Ipswich.
Amendments made: No. 3, in page 4, line 9, clause 7, at end insert—
'(1A) The activities are—
(a) using the material (whether or not such use necessarily involves the making of a temporary copy of it);
(b) copying the material (other than by making a temporary copy where this is necessary for the purpose of using the material);
(c) in the case of relevant material comprising or containing a computer program or database, adapting it;
(d) lending the material to a third party (other than lending by a deposit library to a reader for use by the reader on library premises controlled by the library);
(e) transferring the material to a third party;
(f) disposing of the material.'.
No. 4, in page 4, line 10, leave out 'the use by'.
No. 5, in page 4, line 11, leave out 'of' and insert
'to do any of the activities listed in subsection (1A) in relation to'.
No. 6, in page 4, line 14, at end insert 'or copied'.
No. 7, in page 4, line 30, at end insert—
'(iii) a copy of a work to which section (Exemption from liability: activities in relation to publications)(6) applies;
(iv) a copy (at any remove) of anything within any of subparagraphs (i) to (iii);'.
No. 8, in page 4, line 34, leave out paragraph (d)—[Mr. Mole.]
Amendments made: No. 9, in page 5, line 3, at beginning insert—
'( ) Copyright is not infringed by the copying of a work from the internet by a deposit library or person acting on its behalf if—
(a) the work is of a description prescribed by regulations under section (Exemption from liability: activities in relation to publications)(5) of the 2003 Act,
(b) its publication on the internet, or a person publishing it there, is connected with the United Kingdom in a manner so prescribed, and
(c) the copying is done in accordance with any conditions so prescribed.'.
No. 10, in page 5, line 5, leave out from first 'the' to end of line 6 and insert '2003 Act'.
No. 11, in page 5, leave out lines 11 to 18 and insert
'prescribing activities—
(a) done for a prescribed purpose,
(b) done by prescribed descriptions of reader,
(c) done in relation to prescribed descriptions of relevant material,
(d) done other than in accordance with prescribed conditions.'.
No. 12, in page 5, line 24, at end insert—
'( ) "the 2003 Act" means the Legal Deposit Libraries Act 2003;'.
No. 13, in page 5, line 25, at beginning insert '"deposit library",'.
No. 14, in page 5, line 32, at beginning insert—
'( ) Database right in a database is not infringed by the copying of a work from the internet by a deposit library or person acting on its behalf if—
(a) the work is of a description prescribed by regulations under section (Exemption from liability: activities in relation to publications)(5) of the 2003 Act,
(b) its publication on the internet, or a person publishing it there, is connected with the United Kingdom in a manner so prescribed, and
(c) the copying is done in accordance with any conditions so prescribed.'.
No. 15, in page 5, line 34, leave out from 'the' to end of line 35 and insert '2003 Act'.
No. 16, in page 5, line 41, leave out ', "relevant material" has' and insert '—
( ) "the 2003 Act" means the Legal Deposit Libraries Act 2003;
( ) "deposit library" and "relevant material" have'.—[Mr. Mole.]
Amendment made: No. 19,
That Clause 9 be divided into three Clauses, the first consisting of subsections (1), (7) to (7C) and (9) (Regulations: general), the second of subsections (2) to (6) (Regulations: Scotland and Wales) and the third of subsections (8) and (10) (Regulations: Trinity College, Dublin).—[Mr. Mole.]
Amendment proposed: No. 17, in page 6, line 38, at end insert—
'(7A) Regulations under section 1(4) or 6 may not be made so as to apply to works published before the regulations are made.
(7B) Regulations under section 1(4) or 6 may not be made unless the Secretary of State considers that the costs likely to be incurred as a result of the regulations by persons who publish works to which the regulations relate are not disproportionate to the benefit to the public arising from the delivery of copies of such works.
(7C) Regulations under section 1(4), 6, 7 or (Exemption from liability: activities in relation to publications)(5) may not be made unless the Secretary of State considers that the regulations do not unreasonably prejudice the interests of persons who publish works to which the regulations relate.'.—[Mr. Mole.]
Amendments made to the proposed amendment: (a), in line 3, after '1(4)', insert ', 2'.
(b), in line 8, after '1(4)', insert ', 2'.—[Estelle Morris.]
Amendment, as amended, agreed to.
Amendment made: No. 18, in page 6, line 41, leave out from 'satisfied' to end of line 43 and insert
| Next Section
| Index | Home Page |