Examination of Witness (Questions 40-47)
Wednesday 7 May 2003
Mr Doug Henderson, Chief
Executive, Fresh Produce Consortium, examined.
Q40 Mr Mitchell: Let me ask you about
the existing operations. You have participated in Operation Gang
Master. How successful has that been?
Mr Henderson: Operation Gang Master
has been helpful in a number of ways. First of all, it has been
very helpful in raising awareness of this issue amongst the industry.
It has been helpful in the training of the people within the industry
as to how to identify people who are acting outside the law. In
terms of tackling this problem, it has not been successful. It
may have stemmed the tide but it has certainly not reversed it.
Q41 Mr Mitchell: Why has it not been
successful? What is the problem?
Mr Henderson: Part of it is a
resource problem. There just are not enough people on the ground
to deal with the scale of the problem that exists.
Q42 Mr Mitchell: Can this issue,
given sufficient resources, be dealt with under the existing law
or do we need a new legislative framework?
Mr Henderson: This was a question
that Lord Whitty asked. It is our belief that the existing law
is adequate. What we require is additional legislation to register
gang masters. It is the registration of these people to give them
the authority to carry out their business and being strict on
the way in which they operate.
Q43 Mr Mitchell: What activity has
there been? We have had cases where asylum seekers in Grimsby,
no less, which is a haven of peace and security, have faced dawn
raids, sudden incursions, and have been dragged from their home.
Have there been raids on gangs? Have there been checks of papers
on gangs?
Mr Henderson: Yes. There has been
continuous activity by Operation Gang Master in Spalding and Lincolnshire
since it was established in 1998. Also, there has been a considerable
amount of activity on the industry side. The major supermarkets
have all held seminars with the suppliers. These codes of practice
have been promulgated throughout the industry. There have been
training sessions. They have involved people from the Customs
and Excise and the Immigration Department. They have all cooperated
in these activities. There has been a lot of work done but it
is reliant on a voluntary system.
Q44 Mr Wiggin: You want a kite mark
of approval for every gang master?
Mr Henderson: That is correct.
Q45 Mr Wiggin: How would you pay
for that? Who would effectively pick up the bill? How would the
licensing be paid for?
Mr Henderson: I think there would
be two costs involved in this. The first cost would be a cost
of registration to get on to the register and that would be paid
by the gang master and defray the cost of running the register.
Secondly, there would be the cost of an annual audit which would
be an independent audit of his activities to demonstrate compliance
with the code of practice. In other words, to demonstrate that
he is operating within the current legislative framework. That
would be a cost for the gang master. He would have two additional
costs which he would pass on to his customers.
Q46 Mr Wiggin: Am I right in thinking
that essentially what you are really asking for is the law as
it was in 1995 to come back again? They should have registered
in 1995?
Mr Henderson: No. We wish —
and I understand we need to have primary legislation passed —
to enable this scheme to be established.
Q47 Mr Wiggin: If the government
does decide to go ahead with your plan, what will you do in the
interim period?
Mr Henderson: We will continue
to use our best endeavours to work with the existing codes that
we have and to work with the existing voluntary scheme that we
have, and to cooperate with the Agricultural Investigation Team
and all the enforcement agencies that we can.
Chairman: Thank you very much. You have
given us a lot of information. You have referred frequently to
the need for primary legislation. It would be quite helpful if
you could send us a note saying what piece of legislation is necessary.
Let us pretend that somebody on the Committee has a Private Member's
Bill slot in which to do this. They may be amending existing employment
law but it would be quite useful to have a note saying what actually
is required in terms of legislative action if we were to go down
the route of amending primary legislation. If you would get your
people to look at that, it would be extremely helpful. Thank you
very much indeed for giving evidence to us today.
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