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The Prime Minister: I do believe that I followed entirely the right and proper course in the statement that I made to the House. I point out to the hon. Gentleman that, in relation not just to the dossier itself but also to its foreword, Lord Hutton specifically finds that no improper pressure was put on the Joint Intelligence Committee and that it was satisfied not only with the document but also that the foreword properly reflected the intelligence evidence it had received. I would have hoped that the hon. Gentleman would recognise that Lord Hutton found the accusations of lack of integrity not to be true.
Mr. George Howarth (Knowsley, North and Sefton, East) (Lab): Now that my right hon. Friend has been exonerated from any allegation of impropriety, untruth or dishonour, does he not believe—along with me—that the public will draw a stark contrast between his measured response in the Chamber today and the response of those who have made such allegations in this place, who have tried today to wriggle and squirm around the report, have lifted sections of it out of context and have shown that they—[Interruption.]
Mr. Speaker: Order. I do not want the Prime Minister to respond to that. The Prime Minister has made a statement and the questions should be on that statement.
Sir Patrick Cormack (South Staffordshire) (Con): Does the Prime Minister agree that Lord Hutton, in his
long statement earlier today and in his report, makes two things abundantly plain? The first is that the death of Dr. Kelly was a great personal tragedy, but not a great public scandal. The other is that those who have charge of our public service broadcasting should really consider their position.
The Prime Minister: I want to add only this to what the hon. Gentleman has said: he has been exemplary throughout in drawing the right distinction between legitimate questions about the conflict and accusations of impropriety that should never have been made.
Mrs. Lorna Fitzsimons (Rochdale) (Lab): In the Prime Minister's statement he referred to page 19 of Lord Hutton's report, which specifically refers to the editorial systems needed to ensure that what we believe to be in the best interests of a democracy—that is, not impugning anyone's integrity, especially that of our Government and the Prime Minister—are in place. What does the Prime Minister believe that the governors of the BBC and the rest of the British media should now do to ensure that that happens?
The Prime Minister: I am sure that the lessons of this will be reflected on carefully by the BBC. It is important, in all the focus that there will inevitably be on the procedures of the BBC, that we make it clear that there is sometimes a strain of journalism—certainly not shared by all journalists or all parts of the media—that is willing to make some of these accusations far too readily. I hope that that reflection will go a little bit broader than the BBC.
Mr. Richard Shepherd (Aldridge-Brownhills) (Con): Once the decision was made to name Dr. Kelly, did not the Prime Minister share the great unease about the cat-and-mouse process involving the 20 questions asked by The Times newspaper, for example, in order to identify a public servant? It does not seem straightforward, and it leaves unease in one's mind.
The Prime Minister: The hon. Gentleman should study the part of Lord Hutton's report in which he says that he first came to this issue asking precisely that question, and heard the evidence explaining exactly why this was done. Let me go back to the situation on 7 and 8 July, because the context is extremely important. What had happened was, we had known literally at the very last minute that someone had come forward saying that they might be the source. We did not in fact know whether they were, but we increasingly believed as the days went on that they were. We had the Foreign Affairs Committee literally about to report on 7 July. On 9 July, the Chairman of the Joint Intelligence Committee, John Scarlett, was due to give evidence. I was due to give evidence, too. I was also in front of the Liaison Committee on 8 July.
As was described not merely by me but by the civil servants, Sir David Omand and Sir Kevin Tebbit, there was a dilemma as to whether to name somebody in circumstances in which we could not at that stage be absolutely sure—because the BBC was refusing to confirm even whether it was not the source, which would have cleared the matter entirely—or whether we had to
be careful about naming someone when we were not sure, and indeed given that other people then could be speculated upon.The reason for this way of proceeding, as was explained in the evidence, was that it became increasingly clear that there was a risk of the name leaking out in any event, and that there were other Ministry of Defence officials being harassed as the potential source. So that was the reason why it was done in that way. What Lord Hutton describes in the end is that process, and he concludes that it was conducted in good faith. I entirely accept what he says, that in retrospect it could have been done in a number of different ways. But in the end, one thing was for sure: the name was bound to come out because it would have been wholly improper for us to have realised that we had the person within the Ministry of Defence who was supposed to be the source of this story and not once disclose the fact that we knew that someone had come forward and admitted that, given that we had two Committees looking into it and we were going to go and give evidence to those Committees, and they were focusing on the truth or otherwise of the Gilligan claim. That is the reason for it. I think that the hon. Gentleman is a fair-minded person, and I would just ask him to read what Lord Hutton says about this in detail. I think that he will find it properly described.
Mr. Gerald Kaufman (Manchester, Gorton) (Lab): Does not the Hutton report confirm what some of us have been reviled for saying for months, namely that the BBC broadcast a lie, that the chairman of the BBC railroaded an acquiescent board of governors into endorsing the lie, that Richard Sambrook withheld from the board of governors information showing it to be a lie, and that Kevin Marsh and John Humphrys endorsed and built on the lie? How can the BBC continue as a public service broadcasting organisation, funded by a tax, unless these people are cleared out and a new regime appointed?
The Prime Minister: Well—[Hon. Members: "Make him chairman!"] No, I shall not do that. I will simply say that I am sure that the BBC will reflect on the findings of the Hutton report. I also say to my right hon. Friend and to other hon. Members that there are some wider lessons, as well as those for the BBC. Although I am sure that the BBC will reflect on those lessons, there may be too great a willingness to focus only on the BBC, because it is not only particular journalists there who make such allegations at the drop of a hat and do not really bother to correct them once they are found to be untrue.
Rev. Ian Paisley (North Antrim) (DUP): As the leader of the largest party from Ulster, I should like to pay tribute to Lord Hutton, an Ulsterman. I congratulate him on the speed with which he brought his findings to this House and on the fact that one does not need to get a dictionary to understand what he is saying.
The Prime Minister finished his speech by quoting Lord Hutton, who said:
- "false accusations of fact impugning the integrity of others . . . should not be made".
The Prime Minister knows of the turmoil and division in the nation that this matter has caused, and now is the appropriate time for him to discuss with Her Majesty the Queen a national day of prayer that we may return to the old paths and remember this: that justice and judgment are an honour to a nation, but sin is a reproach to any people.
The Prime Minister: In relation to the hon. Gentleman's first point about his party, if he talks to the Conservative party he will discover that a large party can become smaller in time.
In respect of the day of prayer, I do not think that I shall be suggesting that to Her Majesty, but what he says about the importance of allegations of impropriety being properly sustained or withdrawn must indeed be correct. We do not need to engage in a great deal of prayer to achieve that: we could achieve it perfectly simply if we merely acted on it.
Mrs. Alice Mahon (Halifax) (Lab): A great deal of time has rightly been spent on producing this report, because, tragically, a very well-respected civil servant died. Given the thousands who have died in Iraq since the invasion, and given the weight of evidence that we now have that Iraq did not have weapons of mass destruction, will the Prime Minister now undertake to call an independent and non-partisan inquiry with terms of reference wide enough to allow us to discover why we went to war with Iraq? Millions of people opposed this illegal war. Do we not owe it to our democracy and to the citizens of this country to find out exactly why we went?
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