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Mr. Pickthall: I am about to finish.
I urge support for the Bill, whose passage will be met with acclaim by everyone outside Parliament.
10.16 am
Mr. David Atkinson (Bournemouth, East) (Con): I greatly support the Bill, conscious of the fact that, unlike my hon. Friend the Member for South Staffordshire (Sir Patrick Cormack), I gave full support to the Conservative Government's Shops Bill 1986, which was intended to allow shops and other businesses to open on a Sunday. The House will recall that that Bill did not succeed. It was the largest revolt by Government Back Benchers ever, until the Higher Education Bill this year—and, perhaps, until next week! Opposition to the Shops Bill was encouraged by an unholy alliance between the Churches and the trade unions, which both wanted the law to restrict what people could do on Sundays. I supported the Shops Bill because it included protection for those who did not want to work on a Sunday.
The Bill before us today confirms the protection that this country has always given to the special place of Christmas day in our society. Such protection is much the same as that which every Christian country gives to Christmas day. Many more Christians go to church for mass or a service on Christmas day than attend church regularly on Sundays. As the hon. Member for North Durham (Mr. Jones) said, Christmas is the one day of the year when most families come together and when good people go out of their way to find and provide for those with no families. There is therefore no case for our high streets to be busy on Christmas day. That is the purpose of the Bill, and I believe that few people in this country would wish other than for it to be passed.
I felt one hesitation when the hon. Member for North Durham announced his Bill, following his good fortune in the ballot. It arose from my own experience in my first job, which was working in a family business in the motor trade. It had two petrol filling stations and was a small business with an enviable reputation for fair dealing and service to customers. To provide such service, we opened to supply petrol every Christmas day. I well recall opening Chalkwell motor company in London road, Westcliff-on-Sea, Essex at 9 o'clock on Christmas day for several years, closing at 1 o'clock to speed home for Christmas lunch. We provided a service that was appreciated by our regular customers and by many others who found that most filling stations were closed on Christmas day. I am encouraged by the fact that the Bill excludes petrol stations, as well as small convenience stores.
I congratulate the hon. Member for North Durham on introducing the Bill, and I congratulate USDAW on its campaign in support of the Bill. Half the union's members appear to be in the House today. I hope that the Bill succeeds.
10.19 am
Mr. Roger Gale (North Thanet) (Con): I shall be brief, because I want to see the Bill go through as quickly as possible. However, I wish to give a little support to my right hon. Friend the Member for Bromley and Chislehurst (Mr. Forth). He is old enough, and certainly
ugly enough, to look after himself, but to attack him for seeking to wreck the parliamentary process is undeserved. He is probably one of the greatest proponents and defenders of parliamentary democracy on either side of the House, and always has been. He and I disagree honourably on occasions, as on this, but I defend his right to use such parliamentary measures as he sees fit to promote what he believes in, as I now propose to promote what I believe in.In that context, I hope that my right hon. Friend will retain his seat for the rest of the morning and not see fit to intervene on this occasion. I am one of those who proudly and—I hope—honourably voted against the Shops Bill in 1986. It was not so bad. My toenails grew again, after the Whips' attentions. I was equally proud to have my name on the list in the handbag for several years afterwards.
When the Sunday Trading Act 1994 went through, it was on the clear understanding that as there was an established Church in this country, we had two specific, very holy days in the calendar. One was Easter Sunday, which is protected because it always falls on a Sunday, and the other was Christmas day. It was wrongly and—it transpires—naively assumed that Christmas day would also be protected. Setting aside all the other arguments that have been made this morning, all the Bill seeks to do is to correct an error in that Act.
My right hon. Friend is acutely aware of the fact that those hon. Friends of ours who helped the 1994 Act go through—I must say that I voted against it—did so on the clear understanding that Easter Sunday and Christmas day would be protected. This morning's debate is about the restoration of that tiny piece of democracy, to put right what is now perceived to have been a wrong and to reinforce the will of the House at that time. I hope that my right hon. Friend will understand that and give the Bill the fair wind that it deserves.
10.22 am
Mr. Owen Paterson (North Shropshire) (Con): I do not wish to get involved in arguments that our party may have had in the past—which are still obviously very much alive—so perhaps I could find a third way: I wish to take issue with the definition of a large shop. I congratulate the hon. Member for North Durham (Mr. Jones) on coming so high in the ballot and bringing this Bill before the House. It is a great opportunity.
However, I hope that the hon. Gentleman will consider the case of Stan's Shop in my constituency. It was started by a gentleman called Stan Faulks, with his demob money, shortly after the war. At the time, it was a little shop. It has been a tradition that the shop opens for a couple of hours on Christmas morning, originally to provide batteries for disappointed children whose parents had forgotten to buy them when they bought electronic toys as presents. It was a community service and there was no pressure on staff. I endorse everything that has been said about preserving the nature of Christmas and would not want to see any compulsion on people to work.
The problem is that Stan's Shop is no longer a little shop: it is a large shop. It now covers an area of 22,500 sq ft, having been developed by Stan's son and grandson. The family work in it and it is—in terms of the
Bill—a large shop, but it has all the attributes of a little shop. It provides a wonderful local service and it is very popular. It also maintains the tradition of opening for two hours, from 10 to 12, on Christmas morning. Does that really impinge on the nature of Christmas in my area? It is a strong farming community, where the cows have to be milked on Christmas morning and evening. Stan's Shop is a family enterprise. Half a dozen girls and boys come in to help in the shop and, although I have not been there on Christmas day, I understand that there is a festive atmosphere. As I said, it also provides a useful service. For instance, last Christmas, a lady in Shrewsbury found when she defrosted her turkey that it had gone off. Her Christmas would have been spoilt, but she drove up from Shrewsbury and Stan's Shop provided—as always—what she needed.I entirely endorse the comments by my hon. Friend the Member for South Staffordshire (Sir Patrick Cormack); I do not want to see Christmas being spoiled. I also agree with him about the nature of Sunday having changed in London. However, I hope that we can look at the Bill a little more carefully with regard to splendid institutions such as Stan's. It is a small family organisation that provides a valuable local service, but it would be swept up in the Bill as if it were a monster multiple. I hope that the hon. Member for North Durham will reflect on that point and be willing to tighten up the definition of a large shop.
10.25 am
Mr. Eric Forth (Bromley and Chislehurst) (Con): I oppose the Bill and I shall explain why. I hope that those Members who do not often grace us with their presence on a Friday will understand that taking a position on a Bill is part of the parliamentary process and that Members are always free to turn up on Fridays and express their views one way or another on private Members' Bills. I am slightly surprised—although not shocked—that my attendance every Friday the House sits to express my views on private Members' Bills should attract such opprobrium. I thought that that was what we were here for, but perhaps I am a little old-fashioned and things have moved on.
I wish to discuss the Bill under several headings. I shall not speak at excessive length, because that would be of little relevance on this occasion, given the time of day, although it has extreme relevance on other occasions. I have a good feel for the way in which such days work. I will, if I can persuade any of my colleagues to assist me, seek to divide the House at the end of the debate, because I wish to discover how many Members of Parliament, of the 659 of us, have taken the trouble to be here today to support the Bill. It is always important to demonstrate that and I am sure that Labour Members will also wish to do so. Those who have taken the trouble to be here would surely like that to be a matter of record, and I am sure that the public would wish to know just how much support there is for the Bill. It has been claimed repeatedly in this short debate that there is enormous support for the Bill, but I am in favour of quantifying that support, and the only way to do so is to divide the House.
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