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Bob Spink: Has my hon. Friend addressed the question of the drop-off points for coaches? At the moment, people are dropped off just to the west of Victoria Tower before entering Victoria Tower, but under the proposal, they must walk even further to St. Stephen's entrance, which is a point that must be addressed.

Derek Conway: The Administration Committee does not intend to change the line of route, and tourists who come to the Palace, particularly during the summer recess, will find that it has not altered. The new building is for those who visit to see Committees of the House, the Chamber and Members of Parliament themselves. The House may change the line of route in future after consultation with their lordships. Such matters develop, and the Minister has made it clear that the proposals before the House are not the end of the story—everyone wants access to this place to be easier and more understandable.

I want to record the thanks of the Administration Committee and the Accommodation and Works Committee to the Officers of the House, our external advisers and our Clerk for the quality of their guidance. A great deal of effort has been put into this project by a small group of experienced officials, and I hope that they accept our appreciation.

This is not the end of the changes that our evolving institution will face. As merely its current guardians, we act not only with caution and great care in our duty to preserve its historical character, but with the responsibility of being an accessible working centre for democracy. I therefore urge the House to endorse our joint report.
 
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5.39 pm

Mr. Tony Banks (West Ham) (Lab): It is a pleasure to follow the hon. Member for Old Bexley and Sidcup (Mr. Conway), who is a very distinguished Chairman of the Accommodation and Works Committee.

I apologise to my rather sensitive hon. Friend the Member for Thurrock (Andrew Mackinlay) for talking through parts of his comments, but I was merely imparting information. I assure him that he can amiably chat, or indeed break wind, throughout the course of my speech, and I will take no offence whatever.

I very much welcome the report. As the hon. Member for Old Bexley and Sidcup reminded us, it has taken us years even to refer to those who come here as visitors rather than strangers. When I was first elected in 1983, I was appalled by the way in which we treated our visitors, who were kept outside in long queues in inclement weather. Despite the fact that everyone in the House expressed concern about it, nothing was ever done, so it is about time that it was. It is a pleasure to see that we have very much changed our attitude towards those who come here.

The business of Parliament is not something to be done behind closed doors— nor, in my opinion, behind glass screens. We must welcome visitors who come here, and encourage others to do so—not to gawp at us, but better to understand how the place works. I sat through the previous debate behind that screen. There is a good view, but it is a bit like sitting behind a pillar at a football ground and being unable to see what is happening on the pitch. I understand that the permanent screen is to be somewhat more attractive.

During that debate, many hon. Members referred to this place as the mother of Parliaments. This might sound like nitpicking, but originally it was England, not this place, that was described as the mother of Parliaments. Parliament is an important place, however—not because it is full of MPs, although there are not many of us around tonight, but because it is so central to our democracy. For too long, we have allowed the sneerers, the cynics and the ignorant to belittle this place. The development of democracy in this country is an inspirational story that is by no means complete. However, we cannot just rest on that statement. We need to help people to understand the development of this institution and our history better, and history has to be taught—one cannot simply absorb it by walking around. A visitor centre would be very much part of that teaching process.

The report is a modest step in that direction. I speak as a member of the Accommodation and Works Committee and as Chairman of the Advisory Committee on Works of Art—the two Committees are very much linked. I was encouraged by one of the conclusions in the report's summary:

"In considering these proposals, we recognise the demands for a large-scale interpretative visitor centre. We support this concept but believe that this is not feasible within the Palace of Westminster, and therefore recommend that suitable accommodation outside the building be sought."

That chimes with a proposal that I made to the Works of Art Committee in a position paper in January 2001. I recommended that we should establish a museum of political democracy in the vicinity of Parliament. Such a museum or centre should be purpose-built and adjacent
 
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to the Palace: I thought that at the end of the building by the House of Lords and Embankment gardens would be ideal. It should tell the story of how our democracy has developed and how all the individuals and movements inside—and, more significantly, outside—this place have shaped our history over the centuries. The Committee accepted my proposal, and it went to the House of Commons Commission. There is some sympathy for it. It is a long-term project, but entirely appropriate to teaching people our history. We have a great story to tell—we should be proud of it and do far more to encourage people to understand it.

Mr. Mark Lazarowicz (Edinburgh, North and Leith) (Lab/Co-op): Given how long a project that is described as short term takes to come to fruition in this place, I am worried about the description of the proposal as long term. Will my hon. Friend give some idea of the time scale for the completion of such a long-term project? The celebration of the institution's third centenary in three years might be an appropriate time to ensure that we have such a centre.

Mr. Banks: The proposal that I put to the Committee would probably take 10 years, because it is for a purpose-built building in Embankment gardens. One can envisage all sorts of problems with that, but there is no reason not to think big. At times, this country's approach is small-minded and we are mean about funding. We are always trying to find someone else to fund projects. I have spoken to potential donors to such a museum and centre. If we are not prepared to pay for the construction of a museum or centre out of Government taxation, I know that many people in the outside world would be delighted to be associated—and have their money associated—with it.

Mr. Lazarowicz: I am grateful to my hon. Friend for giving way again and clarifying the proposals. I misread the report and believed that the proposed centre outside the building would be an interim facility until we had a visitor centre inside. If it is envisaged that such a visitor and interpretative centre would not be constructed for some years, is there not merit in providing some temporary centre near the House? The Scottish Parliament is an example of a short-term project that is taking a long time, but there is an excellent visitor centre in its temporary facilities. Could not such a facility be established? I do not believe that the proposal provides for it.

Mr. Banks: Well, it does. If my hon. Friend reads the summary, which is short, it states that the report recommends a temporary facility. I do not know how long temporary is. Perhaps it will be like the screen and remain for many years. The report provides for a temporary solution. I took the point slightly further because the report also mentions a large-scale interpretative visitor centre, for which the proposal does not provide. I believe that it should be our long-term objective and I proposed it previously. We are in a working building, not an arts centre, museum or gallery. However, we are surrounded by so many beautiful works of art that teach us our history that we should do more to bring them to people's attention. We can do that in the context of the current proposals, but we can also have long-term plans.
 
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I am delighted that the report highlights the central role of Westminster Hall, which is the architectural gem of the Palace—indeed, it is one of the architectural gems of northern Europe. I found the attitude in the report of English Heritage to Westminster Hall annoying. I should like us to make available reproductions of the paintings, the sculpture and the literature in this place. We are desperately short of facilities. The pathetic facility at the entrance to St. Stephen's Hall, which is often not even open, passes as our only centre where people can buy books, literature and souvenirs of this place. I mean no disrespect to those who run it because it is not their responsibility but ours. After all these years, that is all we can offer. We must be much grander in our thinking about providing the sort of things that we see in museums and art galleries, while bearing in mind the fact that, although we have many works of art, the building is not a museum and art gallery.

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