---

Hazelwood House, Devon

Q3. [181148] Mr. Anthony Steen (Totnes) (Con): If he will make an official visit to Hazelwood House, Kingsbridge, Devon.

The Prime Minister: I have no current plans to do so.

Mr. Steen: Although Hazelwood provides reconciliation and hope for the few, there is no hope for the rest of my constituents if they are in pain because there is not one NHS dentist in the whole of south Devon to help them. What can the Prime Minister say to a low-income family from Kingsbridge whose children have teeth problems and cannot afford to go private or a pensioner who has an abscess but nowhere to go for treatment? Is not he, as the Prime Minister, ashamed to preside over a Government who tolerate such neglect of the people?

The Prime Minister: I agree entirely that there are real problems in relation to dentistry and dentists at the moment—that is why my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Health will bring forward proposals on that in the next few weeks—but I hope that the hon. Gentleman would agree with me about the origins of the problem: a 1990 contract for dentistry that was disastrous and, in addition, a massive cut in the
 
30 Jun 2004 : Column 280
 
number of training places for dentists. So although we have been describing some of the real progress that has been made in the national health service, I agree that, in respect of dentistry, there is a lot more to do, but I do not believe that the Conservative party is in any position to criticise.

Engagements

Q4. [181149] John Barrett (Edinburgh, West) (LD): Will the Prime Minister tell my constituents how far he thinks it is reasonable for them to walk to their nearest post office?

The Prime Minister: I obviously do not know the exact details of the hon. Gentleman's constituency, but we are putting between £300 million and £400 million a year into support for post offices. It is true, particularly in urban areas, that closures will take place, but the only way to stop those closures is to provide even greater subsidy and money. I am afraid that we cannot afford to do that, so we will continue to work with the association of sub-postmasters to provide as much help and cover as we possibly can. We set down minimum targets for the distance that people would have to go to a post office. The hon. Gentleman will know that the reason for closures is that more and more people are putting the money that they get directly into their bank account. As I say, the only answer is an even bigger subsidy, which is not viable. So we are putting in, as I say, between £300 million and £400 million, which is, frankly, the most that we can afford at the moment.

Mr. Kevin McNamara (Hull, North) (Lab): My right hon. Friend will be aware of the decision of the United States Supreme Court about the conditions under which prisoners are held at Guantanamo Bay and their entitlement to legal representation to appeal against their conditions. He will also be aware of the statement of my right hon. and learned Friend the Attorney-General that the British Government are not satisfied that British detainees at Guantanamo Bay can have a fair trial. In those circumstances, first, to what extent are Her Majesty's Government prepared to help to fund any appeal that may made by British detainees to the Supreme Court to examine their cases and, secondly, will the British Government seek to appear as an amicus curiae before the court to make representations on their behalf?

The Prime Minister: Our position is that the British detainees should be either tried fairly in accordance with international standards or returned to the UK. We have concluded that the military commissions process does not provide guarantees to the standards that we require. As my hon. Friend will know, five of the detainees were returned to the UK in March. We continue to work to resolve the situation of the remaining four detainees, and discussions with the United States are continuing.

Q5. [181150] Mr. Jonathan Djanogly (Huntingdon) (Con): Following the weekend revelations that the Home Secretary is or was the patron of an anti-vivisectionist society, what comfort can the Prime Minister give to the British scientific community and the hundreds of my constituents who continue to be
 
30 Jun 2004 : Column 281
 
terrorised by animal rights terrorists and who feel that the Government, and specifically the Home Office, are not giving them the protection that they deserve?

The Prime Minister: First, it is wrong of the hon. Gentleman to run a perfectly fair point with a totally unfair point. The fact is that the Government are doing everything that we possibly can to protect people against what are clear abuses, and we have tightened the law, not loosened it, since we came to office. We are now looking at what we can do further, but let me make it absolutely clear that the activities of those who harass and intimidate people engaged in legitimate research are completely unacceptable. It is for that reason that we have, as I say, already tightened the law. We are prepared to do so even further. The hon. Gentleman will know that many of his constituents have been in direct contact with us about this matter.

Indonesia

Q6. [181151] Mr. Win Griffiths (Bridgend) (Lab): If he will visit Indonesia after the presidential elections there later this year to discuss with the newly-elected President what further support the UK can give for its programme of reform.

The Prime Minister: I have no current plans to do so, but we look forward to developing a strong bilateral relationship with the Indonesian Government following the presidential elections. We will continue to focus on areas including support for democratic transition, tackling poverty and co-operation on fighting terrorism.

Mr. Griffiths: I thank my right hon. Friend for that reply and urge him, whatever the outcome of the presidential elections, to make a quick visit to Indonesia to underline our support for its reform programme of rebuilding democracy, tackling human rights abuses, overcoming international terrorism, healing Muslim-Christian conflicts and strengthening the economy. Does he agree that such a visit would help to rebuild our relations with the Muslim world and encourage British industry to invest in Indonesia and help its economic recovery, which is vital if the reform process is to be a success?

The Prime Minister: I am sorry that I cannot promise my hon. Friend that I will visit Indonesia in the near future, but I can say that we are in close contact with the Indonesian Government. We continue our work with the consultative group on Indonesia and with the Indonesia-British Business Association. I assure him, especially because of the incoming President, that we believe that there is a real opportunity to make progress in Indonesia on democracy, human rights and trade. Indonesia, as he rightly points out, is an immensely important country in the Muslim world, and how it develops will have a crucial impact on relations between the west and the Muslim world. Even if I am not visiting the country personally, I assure my hon. Friend that we will continue to be closely engaged in its development.
 
30 Jun 2004 : Column 282
 

Rev. Martin Smyth (Belfast, South) (UUP): I am sorry that the Prime Minister's busy schedule does not allow him to pencil something in because as Indonesia is the largest Muslim country in the world, now is the time when a visit by a British Prime Minister would be helpful, especially following the inter-faith visit led by the hon. Member for Bridgend (Mr. Griffiths) several years ago. That visit helped, but will the Prime Minister accept that there has been a resurgence of atrocities in which moderate Muslims, as well as Christians, have been murdered by extreme Islamists?

The Prime Minister: I have to repeat what I said about visiting Indonesia, but I agree with the hon. Gentleman that it is important for us to continue to help the country to make progress. It is faced with a difficult situation regarding terrorism and extremism, as are many other countries. It is a tribute to the Indonesian Government and authorities that they are trying to make progress while not imposing undue restrictions on civil liberties. We will continue to work with them to ensure that human rights, democracy and, of course, freedom from terrorism are pursued.

Engagements

Q7. [181152] Ms Oona King (Bethnal Green and Bow) (Lab): On the subject of antisocial behaviour, does the Prime Minister agree with a survey of Tower Hamlets residents that concluded that the key drivers of antisocial behaviour were lack of parental control and drug misuse, and that the key solutions were more police and youth services? We have had more police appointed, so will he tell us what further improvements might be made and what can be done to alter the Cinderella status of youth services, which are important to the future of our young people?

The Prime Minister: I hope that we will be able to ensure that our youth services are put on a stable footing in the long term through the comprehensive spending review, because they are immensely important. My hon. Friend will agree that the new measures on antisocial behaviour are also important. It is important for us to continue to ensure that fixed penalty notices are issued for disorderly behaviour, that we close down drugs dealers' houses and that we place antisocial behaviour orders on people who continually abuse the rights of their local communities. We are tightening up the law for those who are on drugs but refuse to have treatment. I only hope that when new measures are brought before the House, we will for once have the support of the Conservatives and the Liberal Democrats in taking them forward.

Mr. Alex Salmond (Banff and Buchan) (SNP): Will the Prime Minister confirm that in the 1960s the islanders of Diego Garcia were cleared from their island to make way for a military base? In 2000, they won a High Court judgment that established their right to return, but in the past few weeks he has overturned that with an Order in Council because America wants to hang on to the base, perhaps to use it as another Guantanamo Bay. How is any of that compatible with natural justice for the 2,000 islanders
 
30 Jun 2004 : Column 283
 
and their descendents? How can the Prime Minister pursue a shoulder-to-shoulder relationship with George Bush when he seems to spend most of his time on his knees?

The Prime Minister: First, in respect of Diego Garcia, my right hon. Friend the Foreign Secretary set out the position in a recent statement. Secondly, there is no
 
30 Jun 2004 : Column 284
 
question of using Diego Garcia as another Guantanamo Bay and, thirdly, I am sorry that the hon. Gentleman exhibits his usual lack of judgment in thinking it a bad thing for this country be a key ally of the United States of America. That may be something that the Scottish National party resents, but I think that the vast majority of people in this country realise it is an important part of our security.

 
30 Jun 2004 : Column 285
 

---