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Mr. Hain: I congratulate my hon. Friend on his tireless campaigning and strong leadership on the issue. Although the issue is specific to Croydon, I am sure that it is of general interest throughout the country. I pay tribute to the good work of the forum, the trustees and similar people throughout Britain who work tirelessly without reward for the good of their local communities. If it is possible to find time for him to raise the issue in another place, I am sure that he will seek to do so.

Dr. Julian Lewis (New Forest, East) (Con): The Leader of the House will remember the point of order that I made last week about the troubles in Parliament square—not on the question of the permanent demonstration that has been alluded to today, which does indeed require primary legislation, but on the abusive, antisocial behaviour not only of the permanent demonstrator but of visiting demonstrators who fill the square with amplified noise, which can only serve to spoil the amenity for visitors and imperil the security of the House by distracting the police and security guards who are trying to protect us. I asked whether he would pick up the phone and ask the police why they are not taking action in respect of that noise, which they would take if it were occurring elsewhere. Has he made that call? If he has not, may I suggest that he ring 0207–321 7501 and ask to speak to Superintendent Peter Terry? If he does not do that, I will, and I hope that many colleagues will do so and that, in the unlikely event that the politically correct media report this, members of the public will do so as well.

Mr. Hain: I am glad that the hon. Gentleman is going to ring that number, and I wish him well. I have been
 
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involved in a lot of detailed discussions and consultations about this matter, which is difficult because of the state of the law, but it is irritating—hence the announcement that I made only moments ago.

Keith Vaz (Leicester, East) (Lab): May we have a debate on violent video games next week? My right hon. Friend will know that I have raised in the House the case of Stefan Pakeerah, the Leicester schoolboy who was murdered by a friend who was obsessed with the game Manhunt. Next Friday, the makers of that video will release a new version of Grand Theft Auto that is said to be even more violent than the previous game. May we have a statement or a debate, or some kind of ministerial action before that new game is released?

Mr. Hain: I share my hon. Friend's amazement about such videos, which are monitored by the authorities, both the police and the Government. No doubt his points will have been noted because they are very serious.

Dame Marion Roe (Broxbourne) (Con): Will the Leader of the House confirm that there have been ongoing discussions about a proposal to extend the remuneration of Chairmen of Select Committees to include members of the Chairmen's Panel and other officers? Can he give any further information on that subject?

Mr. Hain: I reassure the hon. Lady that we have, in fact, agreed to ask the Senior Salaries Review Body to consider the remuneration arrangements of members of the Chairmen's Panel. The Chairman of Ways and Means has made representations to me. Obviously, it is a matter for the SSRB—an independent body that sets all our pay and allowance conditions in the House. It is important that people remember that we do not set our own levels; they are recommended by an independent report. I hope that the SSRB will consider that request sympathetically. I am personally sympathetic to it because the hon. Members who serve on the Chairmen's Panel do a very good job, which is often not properly acknowledged, and the Chairman of Ways and Means has come up with a good proposal, which I personally support, although it is for the SSRB to make a recommendation.

Mr. Gordon Prentice (Pendle) (Lab): I appreciate that a defence debate will be held in a few moments, but is there not a case for a separate statement on the four Upholder class submarines, which the Royal Navy decommissioned a decade ago, that were sold to Canada? My right hon. Friend will know that one of those submarines, HMCS Chicoutimi, caught fire, with loss of life—sparks as big as golf balls ricocheted down the submarine—and that an inquiry has been set up by our sister House of Commons in Ottawa, where the incident is causing huge concern and tremendous controversy and press comment. It warrants a statement from the Secretary of State for Defence.

Mr. Hain: Like all hon. Members, I am aware of the concern about and problems with that matter, and my hon. Friend is right to raise it. The Secretary of State for Defence will follow me to make a statement on another
 
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matter, but my hon. Friend will have an opportunity to raise the issue in the defence debate later this afternoon if he chooses to do so.

Annabelle Ewing (Perth) (SNP): The fact that the Cabinet discussed this morning the redeployment of the Black Watch in Iraq clearly shows the importance of the issue and that, ultimately, a political decision is involved. If the Cabinet can have a political debate about the redeployment of the Black Watch in Iraq, why cannot the House of Commons?

Mr. Hain: The Secretary of State for Defence will come to the House in a matter of minutes to answer any question that the hon. Lady might want to put to him, if time allows. Those issues should be raised with the Secretary of State for Defence in the proper fashion. He is coming to the House to make a statement at the earliest opportunity following the Cabinet meeting today, and I should have thought that she welcomed that.

Dr. Alan Whitehead (Southampton, Test) (Lab): Last week, my right hon. Friend indicated that he would consider the suggestion that the House might debate the House of Commons Commission's annual report. Has he had an opportunity to consider that suggestion in the past week? If not, when will he be able to do so? Will he consider scheduling an annual debate on the publication of each annual report? Will he perhaps put that at the back of the estimable calendar that he has introduced today?

Mr. Hain: I am not sure that it would be sensible to put such a debate in the calendar because of the nature of arranging business. However, having consulted informally with Mr. Speaker, I will provide time for a debate on the annual report of the House of Commons Commission, as requested by the hon. Member for North Cornwall (Mr. Tyler). There is universal support for that, including from the shadow Leader of the House. The report is a fine one, which I would say as I am a member of the Commission. It shows the important work that the Commission undertakes and will provide us with an opportunity to debate all sorts of matters that come under its remit.

Richard Younger-Ross (Teignbridge) (LD): Will the Leader of the House find time for a statement on business rates to be made by a Minister from the Office of the Deputy Prime Minister? The Government have recognised the problem with small businesses and are considering a discount scheme. However, the businesses in my area are concerned that they have come up with the wrong solution. In particular, the National Farmers Union argues that its rates are increasing by £1,000 and it is struggling to employ another person. If it could be part of a discount scheme, it would employ someone else, as would other businesses.

Mr. Hain: The Minister for Local and Regional Government will make a statement on those matters in the usual way as part of the normal cycle, as he does every year. The hon. Gentleman will have an opportunity to scrutinise that.
 
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David Taylor (North-West Leicestershire) (Lab/Co-op): The Leader of the House, in various parties over the decades, has campaigned effectively on libertarian issues, including in the '80s on the level of the UK prison population. Does he share my dismay that it is heading inexorably towards 80,000? Does he not believe that the time is right for a full debate on penal policy, not least because in the past few days Martin Narey, the new chief of the National Offender Management Service, has threatened the Prison Officers Association with prison privatisation? Does he have that power? Is my right hon. Friend as dismayed as I am at that negotiating tactic?

Mr. Hain: I am not sure that that description is accurate, but no doubt my hon. Friend will pursue it. I think he will welcome the fact that the publication of the latest quarterly report from the British crime survey shows that the risk of being a victim of crime is the lowest since the survey began under the Conservatives in 1981—in other words, for more than 20 years. Crime in England and Wales has fallen 7 per cent. Violent crime is down by 6 per cent. and violence involving any injuries has dropped by 12 per cent. There has been a 10 per cent. fall in the use of handguns, and firearm offences show a 15 per cent. drop in fatal injuries. There are still big problems, including gun crime, but we are making incredible progress compared with where we were years ago.

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