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House of Commons

Wednesday 27 October 2004

The House met at half-past Eleven o'clock

PRAYERS

[Mr. Speaker in the Chair]

PRIVATE BUSINESS

University Of Wales, Cardiff Bill [Lords]

Queen's Consent, on behalf of the Crown, signified.

Read the Third time, and passed, without amendment.

Oral Answers to Questions

NORTHERN IRELAND

The Secretary of State was asked—

Decommissioning

1. John Robertson (Glasgow, Anniesland) (Lab): If he will make a statement on progress towards decommissioning. [193187]

The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Northern Ireland (Mr. Ian Pearson): There have been four acts of decommissioning to date. The latest act occurred on 21 October 2003, whentheIndependent International Commission on Decommissioning reported that it had witnessed a third event in which IRA weapons were put beyond use. As the Prime Minister made clear at Leeds castle, the Government regard the completion of decommissioning by paramilitary groups as essential to progress in Northern Ireland.

John Robertson: The chairman of Sinn Fein is on record as describing any visible act of decommissioning as counterproductive. Does my hon. Friend agree that, for the decommissioning process to gain the confidence of the people of Northern Ireland, we cannot rely solely on the word of the paramilitaries or their political representatives? What steps does he envisage being able to take to convince the people of Northern Ireland that there is no prospect of the IRA retaining its arms while Sinn Fein exercises its authority in a future Executive?

Mr. Pearson: It is clear that, if there is to be public confidence in the decommissioning process, greater transparency is required in relation to the arms that are to be decommissioned and how long it will take to complete the process. We as a Government are clear that all paramilitaries must give up violence completely in a way that satisfies everyone and enables the people of
 
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Northern Ireland to move the process forward. Every party that wants to be in government must abide by the same democratic rules.

Rev. Ian Paisley (North Antrim) (DUP): Will the Minister confirm that Government policy is unchanged in the matter of decommissioning with regard to the IRA? I refer him to what the Prime Minister said in the House of Commons. He said:

Will the Minister confirm that that is still the policy of the Government and that they will carry it out?

Mr. Pearson: I am happy to confirm that. The Prime Minister put it far more eloquently than I could. The hon. Gentleman is right. We are adamant that all paramilitaries must give up violence completely, in a way that satisfies everyone in Northern Ireland. That remains our position.

Mr. Eddie McGrady (South Down) (SDLP): Following the Minister's answer to that question, will he refer to the fact that in March this year the Government declared at Hillsborough that there must be

Do the Government intend to apply that requirement to the current process of decommissioning and/or peace, in view of the fact that paramilitaries associated with political parties with which the Minister is in dialogue are increasingly involved in drugs, extortion and protection rackets, or have the Government simply changed their mind?

Mr. Pearson: As Security Minister, I am well aware of the links between paramilitaries and organised crime. They are graphically demonstrated in the Independent Monitoring Commission report that was published earlier this year. The Government are clear that we want an end to all paramilitary activity. We want to take the gun out of politics for ever. That is what the people of Northern Ireland want and that is what, in the continuing dialogue that is going on at present, we are all aiming to achieve.

Lady Hermon (North Down) (UUP): Will the Minister explain to the House how the Government intend to address the serious problem arising from the deficit of confidence in the Unionist community that General de Chastelain is the person best placed to verify further acts of decommissioning?

Mr. Pearson: As a Government we have total confidence in the integrity and abilities of General John de Chastelain. We accept, however, that there is an issue of public confidence in decommissioning and that greater transparency is required in the process. That is currently under discussion and it would not be appropriate for me to comment further at this stage.
 
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Mr. David Lidington (Aylesbury) (Con): Will the Minister confirm, to put the matter beyond any doubt on the record, that the Government still believe that, to secure the enduring peace that we all want, decommissioning must be visible and conducted according to a clear and finite timetable?

Mr. Pearson: I am happy to make it clear that decommissioning is a vital component of the Good Friday agreement, which the Government want to see implemented. It is important that there is greater transparency. We have trust and confidence in General John de Chastelain, but as I said earlier, we need to ensure that paramilitaries give up violence and their weapons in a way that satisfies everyone. Greater transparency is required as part of that process, and we also want a definite time scale; the hon. Gentleman is absolutely right on that point.

General Practitioners

2. Mrs. Iris Robinson (Strangford) (DUP): If he will make a statement on changes to the provision of general practitioner out-of-hours services in Northern Ireland. [193190]

The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Northern Ireland (Angela Smith): From 1 January 2005, where GPs have chosen to opt out of providing out-of-hours services to their patients, statutory responsibility will pass to the health and social services boards. The boards are well advanced in detailed planning for out-of-hours services to ensure a smooth transition from the current to the new arrangements and to continue to provide a safe, effective service.

Mrs. Robinson: I thank the Minister for her response, but does she agree that, until now, the true costs of the out-of-hours work of GPs have been disguised? The funding required to establish and sustain new out-of-hours arrangements from 1 January will be a new cost. Has she made an assessment of the expected resultant costs over the first 12 months, and can she reassure me that other current services will not suffer as a result?

Angela Smith: I know that the hon. Lady has been concerned about the service provision, and I am pleased to be able to reassure her. She will no doubt be aware of the recent article in Doctor magazine that stated:

which shows how well the service is making that change. The cost of providing the service will be about £21 million in a full year and a good service will be provided. I assure her that the funds will be available to ensure that we have effective, safe and efficient out-of-hours services for all patients in Northern Ireland.

Rev. Martin Smyth (Belfast, South) (UUP): Will the Minister confirm that there are doctors who do not want to work out of hours and that there are areas in Northern Ireland where there is great concern that people may not be getting the services that they require, particularly in rural areas?

Angela Smith: There may be some confusion about what is happening. The days when the doctor put on his
 
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overcoat over his pyjamas and rushed out in the middle of the night were a long time ago. What we are saying is that, where doctors wish to opt out of providing out-of-hours services, responsibility for them passes to the boards. I am well aware of the concerns about rural areas. That is why the boards have been carrying out detailed planning to ensure that we have a safe, efficient and effective service for patients throughout Northern Ireland.

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