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Grammar Schools

6. Sir Teddy Taylor (Rochford and Southend, East) (Con): How many pupils were being educated in grammar schools in England (a) on the latest date for which figures are available and (b) five years ago. [194097]

The Secretary of State for Education and Skills (Mr. Charles Clarke): In January 2004, there were 152,610 pupils in grammar schools in England—4.6 per cent. of all secondary pupils. In 1999, the figure was 140,880—4.5 per cent. of secondary pupils then.

Sir Teddy Taylor: Is the Secretary of State aware that one of the few pleasant surprises provided by the Government is the positive attitude that they have taken to the survival and development of grammar schools? Can he give us an assurance that that policy will continue?

Mr. Clarke: The hon. Gentleman's surprise is inaccurate, in that that is not exactly the course of action that we have been following; I am sorry to disappoint him. The Select Committee on Education and Skills produced a carefully considered report on this matter, which was published a couple of months ago, and we will provide a detailed response to its proposals in the
 
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next week or so. The hon. Gentleman will have to wait until then to see precisely how we deal with those proposals.

David Taylor (North-West Leicestershire) (Lab/Co-op): Does the Secretary of State agree with the 1997 quote from a Labour colleague of ours? He said that the grammar school system

"was a response to the needs of a vanished society which required a small educated class and a large number of manual workers. It is no longer the appropriate model for a world where most jobs require educated men and women."

Given that the Member in question was my right hon. Friend the Member for Sedgefield (Mr. Blair), when is the Secretary of State going to do something about this dodo in the educational aviary?

Mr. Clarke: My hon. Friend will be shocked to hear that I agreed then with every word of that speech by my right hon. Friend the Member for Sedgefield and I agree with it now, which is why our recent policy proposals—the five-year plan—focused directly on the needs of every child, using the slogan "every child matters". Society has changed in precisely the way set out by my right hon. Friend, and our education system has to meet the needs of every single person. That is now the test for every school, institution and the Government in this process.

Mr. Damian Green (Ashford) (Con): The Secretary of State will doubtless be aware that the grammar schools in my constituency do an excellent job not just for their own pupils and the wider community, but in working very well with all other schools in the area. Will he confirm that the Government have no intention of lowering the percentage needed in a parental ballot to abolish grammar schools, so that I, in turn, can assure all those members of the Labour party in Kent who are trying to destroy Kent's grammar schools that they are wasting their time?

Mr. Clarke: I must refer the hon. Gentleman to the response that we will give to the Select Committee in couple of weeks' time, which will address precisely that point. However, it is worth examining in some detail, and in precisely the way that I have identified, Oftsted's report on education in Kent and the selective system's impact on every child in that county. I know that he will want to be sure that every child in his constituency is getting the support that they need to achieve in every respect, and I commend the Oftsted inspector's report on that matter to him.

Children's Centres

7. Mrs. Joan Humble (Blackpool, North and Fleetwood) (Lab): If he will make a statement on the provision of children's centres. [194098]

The Minister for Children, Young People and Families (Margaret Hodge): We have already announced 71 children's centres and we will shortly be announcing more. We are committed to providing 2,500 such centres by March 2008, which will include one for each of the
 
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20 per cent. most disadvantaged areas. We are working up plans to provide a children's centre in every community.

Mrs. Humble: I thank my right hon. Friend for that reply. Is she aware of the great benefit that children's centres have already brought to Blackpool, of the enthusiasm with which parents and professionals have greeted them, and of the welcome for the £1.6 million for the second phase of such centres? However, is she also aware that in order to continue delivering the quality service of the first phase, she might need to consider yet further additional resources?

Margaret Hodge: I am pleased that my hon. Friend is getting such a positive response to children's centres in her community. We are certainly gathering huge amounts of evidence about the impact of Sure Start children's centres on outcomes for children—from the relationship with the mother in the early days, to a child's readiness for school as they move through those early stages. We intend to pursue this programme, and by 2008 we will be spending some £4.4 billion—just from the Department for Education and Skills budget—on early years and Sure Start. I do wonder what would happen to that extremely successful programme, were the Conservative party ever to get back into government.

Mr. Paul Goodman (Wycombe) (Con): Children's centres are a good idea; perhaps in her next answer the Minister might refer to fathers, which she did not do a moment ago. She will also want to ensure that state-provided children's centres do not crowd out private and voluntary sector providers. For example, providers currently have to face some 28 separate funding streams and application processes. Is it not time to amalgamate some of these funding streams and tear down the artificial barriers to child care supply?

Margaret Hodge: I am delighted that the hon. Gentleman thinks that children's centres are a good idea, and I look forward to his party committing itself to continuing the expansion of children's centres in the way that we have. I agree that the role of fathers in children's centres is important, and some of our best Sure Start programmes are working hard to engage fathers as well as mothers in their child's early development. I also agree that we have too many funding streams, both for the private and voluntary sector and the statutory sector, to enable local communities to develop children's centres that make sense. That is being examined as we speak, and I hope to have some good news for him on that in the not-too-distant future.

Valerie Davey (Bristol, West) (Lab): An application for a children's centre is being made from a vibrant, multicultural, multilingual area of my community. Does the Minister have any advice for those making the application in terms of refinement of the criteria?

Margaret Hodge: It sounds as though there may be some problem in relation to the application to which my hon. Friend refers. I am happy to talk to her if she wants to write to me about it. In terms of criteria, we are looking for children's centres to provide services around
 
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the needs of the child and their family, bringing together early years education and child care, community health services, from health visitors and midwives through to speech and language therapy, and support for families, whether parenting support for mothers and fathers or support to enable parents to move from education and training into work. We are looking for that coherent set of services, around the needs of the child, in children's centre plans.

Angela Watkinson (Upminster) (Con): By the time that children enter formal education they need to be self-confident, well-adjusted and ready to learn. Does the Minister agree that child care settings should be used to ensure that children gain the personal and social skills that they need to succeed at school, and that high-quality early years provision could in due course help to reduce antisocial behaviour in teenagers? Does the Minister agree that the quality of child care is even more important than supply, eligibility and cost, on which the debate usually focuses?

Margaret Hodge: There is huge consensus across the Chamber today, but I am waiting for the Opposition to tell us whether they would match their intent with resources. Of course I agree with the hon. Lady that readiness for school is not just about the cognitive skills that we want children to develop but their social skills, emotional well-being and physical well-being. The joy of this Labour Government initiative to provide those services around the needs of the child is that we are beginning to see evidence from all those indicators that children are better prepared for school. I concur completely with her that if we develop all those facilities, children are far less likely to display antisocial behaviour later in life.

The hon. Lady talks about the quality of child care, which is very important, but we must bear in mind quality, supply and affordability. There is huge demand out there from many parents for high-quality, affordable child care and we must build that infrastructure as quickly as we can. High-quality child care is what makes all the difference to the child, and that is foremost in our minds.

Lawrie Quinn (Scarborough and Whitby) (Lab): Regrettably, in Scarborough and Whitby, the consensus that we have heard in the Chamber is not mirrored in the behaviour of the Conservative borough council—not a local education authority—which is in the process of withdrawing the current children's centre provision. Can the Minister give some priority to examining the problems that will face my constituents in the deprived areas in which she and the Government want to invest, so that we can make good the massive mistake that the Conservative council in Scarborough is about to make?

Margaret Hodge: I am sorry to hear what my hon. Friend says about his local authority.

If we are to deliver a really effective early years and child care infrastructure, we must deliver it through local authorities. Our whole agenda represents a huge vote of confidence in local government, but we depend on our local authority partners to deliver. We can provide the resources and support, but they must deliver.
 
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This is a popular policy, as is clear from what has been said here today. I think my hon. Friend's district council would be extremely unpopular if it did not provide these services: it would be letting children down, and not giving them a good enough future. We will highlight the authorities that do good work, as well as those that fail to deliver for children and families in their communities.

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