Examination of Witnesses (Questions 20-27)
11 MAY 2004
MR IAN
BRAMLEY, MS
LINDA JASPER,
MR KEN
BARTLETT AND
MS PIALI
RAY
Q20 Chris Bryant: Many dancers one sees
either on television or in a show might also be actors and might
have a mixed career?
Mr Bramley: Some of them do, particularly
if they have trained in musical theatre. There is a different
diversity in terms of careers in dance, as Piali as already described;
there are a lot of what we call independent dance artists, individual
dance artists who work in many different fields, who may be performers
or, on occasion, may choreograph things, may do work in the community,
and may do work in schools.
Q21 Chris Bryant: That sounds extremely
entrepreneurial?
Mr Bramley: Yes, it is.
Q22 Chris Bryant: How do you make sure
that those people have the financial skills, all those marketing
skills, to be able to survive?
Mr Bramley: I think there are
lots of organisations, including all of us, who work on continuing
professional development—trying to ensure that both those
artistic skills and those practical skills are more developed—and
we try and support them; but there is an awful lot of pressure
on the individual to be entrepreneurial.
Mr Bartlett: Indeed, they are.
In any given community project people are fund-raising, marketing,
programme planning, getting the people involved and evaluating.
Q23 Chris Bryant: One of the things presumably
that enables more of you to grow audiences is when people are
able to see the really best locally for themselves. Is there a
problem with many local theatres, which I guess would be the most
normal venue, being totally unsuitable for the dance, either because
the stage is raked, or because you cannot put a decent drugget
over it, or whatever?
Mr Bramley: I think there are
issues around this, technical requirements in some theatres, and
around having a sprung floor to allow safe dance performance;
it is around them being cold and draughty and having an adequately
sized stage. What I would say is, dance is very good at touring,
particularly with the small scale, and reaching those local audiences.
Q24 Mr Flook: It appears to me that what
we are really trying to talk about is encourage more people to
participate in dance, and also more people to go and watch dance.
As somebody who occasionally participates every time Dexy's Midnight
Runners come on with Come on Eileen, and over the next
30 years will be getting even worse as, no doubt, the booze kicks
in at a big party, I am probably past any chance of participating
in any form of dancing and never had any decent rhythm either.
How do we get people to get out of that, even as they get older,
and participate in dance and not make them too scared if they
ever go and see Michael Flatley and see that dancing is all about
athleticism, immense athleticism? It would appear to me that boys
tend to think that dance is very athletic—probably no problem
with that—but is not very aggressive; and it is things like
rugby they like playing and football because they can go and kick
someone hard; or they look at a dance like the Maori Haka and
they see that is aggressive. Is it sometimes perhaps that, in
doing dance with boys and girls, they cannot be as aggressive
and they inwardly want to be, which is one of the reasons why
we do not get more boys involved in dance?
Mr Bartlett: Can I start with
the question about older people. Certainly there is a tremendous
amount of activity involved in engaging older people and the 50
plus.
Q25 Mr Flook: I am not that old!
Mr Bartlett: I had put you back
into the boy category when I answered that question! I have got
a quote from an assistant director of public health for South
Birmingham, who is concerned with health and regeneration, who
said that dance has done more in the last five years for the health
of the elderly than any other funded aspect of an NHS activity;
which I think is a fairly amazing state. It was a casual comment
but he said it. There are projects right across the country engaging
older people, either active elderly people or dancing on their
own and going to tea dances and all kinds of things.
Q26 Mr Flook: Not just a social thing
but, going back to the PCT, I presume more towards getting them
to get out of the couch and start doing some exercises?
Mr Bartlett: Yes, and all those
issues of isolation contributing to quite specific health things.
There was a project in North Nottinghamshire around falls, and
the impact of falls on the elderly where everybody is involved.
The fire service, the police service and all of those agencies
sent people to dance with the older people and it was amazing
to see the local fire chief putting in a performance piece with
elderly people. The other thing around boys, with athleticism
and competition, there are certainly images on those BBC intakes
of all those dance things which show men showing athleticism,
prowess and aggression. Certainly there is a lot of work being
done by young people right across the country using urban dance,
street dance, hip-hop styles, which are actually engaging them.
The way they are set up is in a competitive you-show-me-your-dance-and-I'll-show-you-mine
which grows out of that popular street culture. That is engaging
an incredible number of people right across class and gender as
well as various cultural sectors of the population.
Q27 Mr Flook: I am feeling like a lost
generation then!
Mr Bartlett: With Dexy's Midnight
Runners what do you expect!
Ms Jasper: As I go round the country
the quickest developing dance genre for young people is street
dance, hip-hop, break, and normally in single sex groups of boys.
Obviously that aggression and athleticism is being taken on by
the actual programming of that kind of activity. I also add to
that capoeira and martial arts as well, which is something that
dance, and the professional dance sector, has been particularly
influenced by. That aspect of movement and dance being eclectic
in its movement base can be very attractive. It is very adaptable,
using different movements, styles, genres from very different
cultural backgrounds. Therefore, audiences can hook into that
kind of display of athleticism, aggression, controlled finesse,
whatever; it is a wide pallet.
Mr Bartlett: Where it is programmed
it is bringing in completely different audiences, and I think
of companies like Jonzi D or Malakhi. If you excel in that area
of work and have taken it up to a very highly skilled art form,
if you go and see that work you are surrounded by a different
group of people than you might be in a far more traditional dance
experience.
Chairman: Thank you very much indeed.
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