Examination of Witnesses (Questions 220
- 223)
MONDAY 10 JANUARY 2005
MR PETER
NEWELL AND
MS MARY
MARSH
Q220 Valerie Davey: But you are talking
about a country the total population of which is smaller than
the number of children we are talking about our English Commissioner
being responsible for.
Mr Newell: Yes, but if we are
not talking about a commissioner, which I am certainly not, who
should deal with individual cases, then I do not think the problems
of scale are so big. I feel that the commissioner should not get
involved in individual cases but should from the beginning look
at what means children have to have their concerns taken up, whether
they are at home, in schools, in juvenile justice institutions
and so on. That is an absolutely vital role and clearly there
is an awful lot that needs doing, but none of us is suggesting
that the commissioner should take on those cases.
Q221 Valerie Davey: If I can come
back to Mary Marsh, the listening to children aspect in the English
Commissioner's role I feel is possibly stronger than in others
and however effective the United Nations rights and the European
rights of the child are, they are a piece of paper as opposed
to what our Commissioner for England is being asked to do, which
is to continue to listen to children. Is there not something there
which is perhaps more valuable in really still listening to children?
Ms Marsh: There is absolutely
no doubt at all that we are entirely supportive of the emphasis
on listening to children and their voice being heard and being
sure that people are hearing their concerns and are indeed acting
on them. However, there is a context in which that listening happens
to be where there is a robust and clear understanding of their
rights being promoted and safeguarded. It is exactly what we are
doing everywhere else in relation to human rights legislation
and indeed the Equalities and Human Rights Commission. It seems
entirely inconsistent with that whole wider agenda that the rights
are not here for the commissioner. If you look at the Commission
for Social Care Inspection (NSSI as it was previously), the Children's
Rights Director there has been very clear in his role. Roger Morgan
has listened to children with great care and with huge benefit
to the way in which the inspectorate has developed its work. We
have all learned a lot from what the young people have been telling
him and how he has articulated their views and disseminated them
and challenged people. The framework that he has used, and indeed
in the Commission for Social Care Inspection it is built right
into their work, is the importance of using the UN Convention
on the Rights of the Child to underpin it. I think you should
listen to children but you should make sure that you are listening
to them within that framework of the UN convention.
Q222 Chairman: Many of my constituents,
while stoutly defending the UN and European rights of children,
would also like some sort of charter of responsibilities of children
in certain circumstances. Any hope of that coming on the scene?
Ms Marsh: All rights come with
responsibilities for all of us.
Q223 Chairman: Jolly good. Can I
thank you very much for coming before the Committee? As I say,
every time we have people giving their expertise and time, if
on your way home or when you get home you think of something that
the Committee did not ask you that is germane to their inquiry,
will you e-mail or write to us?
Ms Marsh: Absolutely. We would
be happy to do that.
Chairman: Thank you very much for your
time.
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