Examination of Witnesses (Questions 280
- 289)
WEDNESDAY 12 JANUARY 2005
MRS DOREEN
BROWN, MR
BRIAN WHITE,
MR ROBIN
MCMINNIS
AND MR
HARRY BAIRD
Q280 Mr Beggs: Some of us have always
suspected, Chairman, that those who paid for reports got results
which they commissioned. Given the current operating deficit of
around £1.2 million a year how realistic is it to try to
maintain the airport in public ownership in the longer-term?
Mrs Brown: This is a point that
I could not answer solely. It is a point, obviously, for Derry
City Council. At the moment Derry City Council is meeting that
operating deficit. Okay, the ratepayers of the Derry City Council
are meeting the operating deficit, and all the indications are
that, while they would love to be relieved of that burden if at
all possible, they are still willing to make that contribution
because of the importance that they attach to the continuing operation
of CODA. Clearly, the existence of an operating deficit is also
a factor which feeds into an economic appraisal of the case for
development and tends to reduce any possible net present value
to net present cost, but there is apparently the willingness to
pay.
Q281 Mr Beggs: What is the position
on the current application for funding to develop the terminal
and extend the runway and when do you expect to reach a decision?
Mrs Brown: This will be a decision
for the Secretary of State. He received early in November a report
from a joint steering group which comprised government officials
and representatives from the private sector in Derry as well as
the Clerk of Derry City Council and the CODA manager. The Secretary
of State, on reading that report, asked for some further work
to be carried out to try to explore further the economic benefits
that might derive from further investment and any possible state
aid issues that could arise, and also, going back to your last
question, which perhaps I did not say enough about, to look at
possible changes in the governance of the City of Derry Airport
for the future to give it a greater opportunity to operate more
effectively in a commercial context. That work is approaching
completion and officials hope that the Secretary of State will
in a very short period of time, a matter of a few weeks, have
all the facts and figures in front of him so that he can make
his decision.
Q282 Mr Beggs: What are the current
plans to upgrade the road between Londonderry and Belfast as this
would not only reduce the time taken to get to the Belfast airports
from the west but also bring wider economic benefit? Is this an
issue that is being taken into consideration in the current application
for funding?
Mrs Brown: Not specifically in
the context of the current application for funding but there are
documents being produced following the Regional Transportation
Strategy and one of them, the RASTN TP, which is the transport
plan which looks at the trunk road network across Northern Ireland,
is dealing with the road from Belfast to Derry along with the
other main trunk road links. There have been some improvements
to that road already, most recently the opening of the Toome bypass,
and the plan, which extends up to 2015, also includes provision
for further dualling from Castledawson, the Dungiven bypass and
possibly further dualling close into Derry. Another factor possibly
coming along is the Investment Strategy for Northern Ireland which
is only a draft document at the moment but if that were finalised
and the funding figures in that were achieved there could be a
prospect of further improvements to the road in quicker time.
Q283 Chairman: It is totally indefensible
of me, given my role as Chairman, but I have a strange affection
for Derry Airport and one of the issues that I would raise is
that it has shown some quite remarkable growth figures until most
recently. I hope that when we do look at its future we do so not
just in terms of the Northern Ireland context but within an island
of Ireland context because of course a lot of its passengers live
in the north of the island across the border who rely very much
on the City of Derry Airport for travel into GB. I do hope that
we take those matters into account. Also, it leads neatly onto
a couple of questions I have in relation to the island of Ireland.
In your submission you refer to the 2001 study which said that
the net loss of passengers through Dublin was 260,000. Has there
been any update on that figure since 2001?
Mr White: No, Mr Chairman, there
has not been an update on that figure since then.
Q284 Chairman: Given that there have
been road improvements between Belfast and Dublin, what is the
current estimate of numbers using Dublin? Although there is not
a study are there any estimates as to what the current numbers
are beyond that 260,000?
Mr White: I am not certain that
we do have an estimate of the figures of the passengers using
Dublin.
Q285 Chairman: Overall, and this
is a difficult question to answer, do we view the effect of Dublin
Airport as positive in as much as it is giving more choice to
Northern Ireland travellers, or negative in terms of loss of economic
benefit? Where do we stand?
Mr White: I think the Air Transport
White Paper took a fairly balanced view. I think it notes the
fact that there was to a degree a disbenefit in terms of the movement
of passengers south and money that would otherwise be spent in
Northern Ireland was being spent in Dublin but it also recognised
that there was obviously a degree of choice available in Dublin
to passengers from Northern Ireland that would not otherwise be
available. I think it also recognised the fact that Dublin is
an airport serving a national capital with a much larger hinterland
so these were all factors taken into account. The White Paper
also recognised that the Air Route Development Fund which we have
been discussing this afternoon was a policy response to that issue.
Q286 Chairman: You also suggest in
your evidence that there is the potential for the Republic of
Ireland to impose PSOs on other cross-border routes. What potential
do you consider there is for this and are other routes currently
under consideration?
Mr White: Not that I am aware
of. Obviously, there is a PSO currently on the route between Derry
and Dublin. It would be a matter for them to deal with. I understand
that there are five other routes in Ireland which have PSOs but
they are all to regional airports in the Republic.
Q287 Chairman: You have just raised
the PSO between Dublin and the City of Derry. Are you able to
share with us what the cost of that is and does Northern Ireland
contribute? We are trying to get our head around whether or not
it is totally funded by the Republic.
Mr White: It is completely funded
by the Republic.
Chairman: Is there not a case that it
should be partly funded by Northern Ireland given the economic
benefits—
Mr Pound: What a question!
Q288 Chairman: I am not trying to
give away the government's cash. I am just asking the question.
Mrs Brown: To my knowledge we
have never been approached by the Irish Government with any such
suggestion. In the absence of the suggestion we did not feel we
needed to make an offer. Certainly the Irish Government seems
quite content to pay the PSO for that route.
Mr Luke: If you are looking at PSOs though
I think Dublin will be looking at the greater economic benefit
in that part of the Republic of Ireland as well as Northern Ireland.
Q289 Chairman: Yes, it is a confused
picture, given the proximity to the border, and also there is
an airport within the Republic at Carrickfin, but there you go.
If my colleagues do not have any more questions are there any
questions that you expected to be asked that we have not asked
you?
Mr McMinnis: We have not been
disappointed.
Chairman: I promised to get you away
before six. It is five to, so we have achieved that goal. Can
I thank you on behalf of the committee for appearing before us.
It is much appreciated.
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