Select Committee on Trade and Industry Minutes of Evidence


Examination of Witnesses (Questions 120-130)

BRITISH COUNCIL

25 MAY 2004

  Q120 Judy Mallaber: What sort of number of institutions in this country are we talking about?

  Mr Kemp: Nick, you have been looking at this.

  Mr Butler: To be honest, we do not know. I think we have the impression that there are possibly 2,000 to 3,000 private education providers operating in some form or other, but we are in discussions with the Home Office and DfES at this very moment discussing this and trying to put together, as I mentioned, this register of bone fide institutions which will be complete by the end of the year.

  Q121 Judy Mallaber: Does the British Council liaise with professional organisations to discuss with them the potential for educational opportunities in these other countries?

  Mr Kemp: Yes, one of the statistics we have is number of examinations and we manage a large number of professional examinations overseas each year. The British Council itself manages one million examinations overseas out of a probable total from the UK of three million. ACCA, for example, have 150,000 students studying outside the UK, of which I think we manage about 80,000 exams, something like that, so, yes, we do talk with them, we work with the Institute of Civil Engineers, for example, and other professional bodies, the surgeons but it varies a lot in country.

  Mr Upton: Those comments are absolutely appropriate. This is a mixture of examinations provision, specialist advice, the use of the agent network. For example in Thailand there is a whole range of institutions that we have relationships with which provide professional qualifications and we also work with those in country, in the UK, and we also work with the visa section to clarify their status if necessary.

  Mr Butler: Recently I was contacted by the Institute of Exporters who up to the present moment do not export qualifications overseas, which is interesting. We obviously are in discussions with them as to how we can help them with their work overseas and also recently the Institute of Motor Engineering. We are constantly approached by the professional bodies and we provide support where appropriate.

  Q122 Judy Mallaber: How does it work? Does the professional organisation take a cut out of the institution overseas that is doing the training or do they provide distance learning skills or a whole range?

  Mr Kemp: A whole range. The ACCA provide hard copy for study but then there might be local tutors that are providing support, whether it is with ACCA agreement or not. Similarly with London University externals, they are mainly mailed out reading lists with, in theory, no local tutor support, you have just got your exams at the end, but then there will always be some enterprising local tutor who will see an opportunity and offer those.

  Q123 Chairman: What about institutions like the OU which is the premier distance learning institution?

  Mr Kemp: OU has 30,000 students outside the UK. I did not check but I have got the number of how many in ASEAN nations somewhere. They are very active and very successful.

  Q124 Chairman: Some institutions like Heriot-Watt.

  Mr Kemp: Heriot-Watt is brilliant.

  Q125 Chairman: I was there on Thursday night. It is my old university of course.

  Mr Kemp: Great. In fact, the head of Heriot-Watt, John Archer, chairs the educational counselling service we have that represents a large number of UK institutions globally. Heriot-Watt have got 10,000 students on their MBA programmes overseas. That is what John was saying last week and they are very successful. The Scottish Interactive University is also developing a good suite of products that will be delivered globally including at the school level, and their Scholar programmes are really good.

  Q126 Mr Berry: What are the three most significant additional things that the UK Government could do to promote British education in South East Asia? What is on your wish list?

  Mr Kemp: If I could start off with mine and then I am sure my colleagues have got another three. The `biggie' is to keep the pressure on marketing the UK generically, its educational excellence and all the diversity that goes with it. I keep coming back to the point that even in well-established markets it is the country of education destination and the quality of qualification that is so strong in this. So that is one of the big things, continuing investment in the education UK brand and the generic marketing. That is my first start.

  Mr Upton: Just from a country's perspective overseas—to be making sure there is sufficient funding for an integrated marketing and strategic campaign to promote UK education. As we move into a far more competitive environment unless we are investing wisely in a marketing and promotion campaign we will lose out. The actual return that we get is phenomenal. For the amount of money that has gone into the promotional campaign for PMI the actual return in terms of number of students is a remarkable achievement so funding for a multi-campaign. Two, joining up and making sure that we have a strategic approach that brings all the key players together within the UK and making sure that is replicated overseas, so strategic integration. And finally, something that really matters, making sure that we care for the international students who come here because the pastoral care for international students is so crucial and that is one of the key things, when these students come back, they talk about how they felt, how they were valued, as well as the course. If we have those three then we will remain what we want to be, which is world class.

  Mr Butler: On a less strategic level there is the promotion of the excellence in IT and education which the DfES is developing at the moment and which goes down extremely well overseas. I think that is an area where we need to continue to be showing that the UK has excellence in this area.

  Q127 Mr Berry: Out of personal interest how do you view Vietnam as an emerging market for British education?

  Mr Kemp: Long term, ten years, it is potentially good.

  Q128 Mr Berry: Ten years is not that long.

  Mr Kemp: In 2015 you can begin to see it. The reason I say that is that there is still a relatively low higher education participation rate, the GDP growth is good but purchasing power parity is still very low and until we get that real incomes growth we are not going to take off. It is growing and it grew, admittedly from a small base, by about 35% last year.

  Mr Butler: No, over 50%, from 205 to 330 students.

  Mr Kemp: In higher education.

  Mr Butler: Not an enormous number.

  Q129 Chairman: Outside of the indigenous languages it is a francophone country so would France be the competition there, do you think?

  Mr Kemp: It could be. It goes back to something that has been reinforced particularly by Peter about word of mouth, family and friends. Because they have got family and friends in France, it makes it seem more accessible. It is funny I was in Brussels last night with some of my colleagues from the Czech and Slovak Republics and Poland and they were saying that they are getting Vietnamese coming to their countries to study because they have an associated history from the days of the Soviet Union and the Socialist tie-up with Vietnam and that has hung over. They are noticing quite a steady flow of Vietnamese into Eastern Europe. I was surprised.

  Mr Butler: My impression in terms of francophone is yes, the older generation were francophone but the contact I have had recently with officials and young people is that they want to speak English and therefore we will find they will be looking for an English-speaking destination.

  Q130 Chairman: On that note, thank you very much for your time. I hope you did not come just to see us, Mr Upton!

  Mr Upton: I was here anyway.

  Chairman: Thank you very much. It is very useful to have someone hotfoot from the area we are interested in and once again thank you for the help and co-operation you gave us when we were there, which was extremely helpful. It is useful to get this backdrop of hard facts rather than just individual experience and that will help us in the work that we are doing. If we need any additional information we will be in touch for hard copy. Thank you very much.





 
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