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Dr. Harris: I am grateful to the Minister for having clarified the points raised by my probing amendments, and I am satisfied with her answers. In respect of the amendments on directors' and shareholders' confidentiality, I think that the hon. Member for Huntingdon made some important points. I, too, am
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not convinced that they can be wholly addressed by an awareness-raising exercise that puts the onus on the shareholder. We shall consider our position on such amendments for later stages of the Bill.
Before I come to new clause 32, I should like to clarify another point. After I spoke, the hon. Gentleman was rather critical of the Government's position, and the Government rather objected to the tone or the content, or both—
Mr. Djanogly: The tone.
Dr. Harris: Was it the tone? Right. I suspect that it was the content, too, because I am not sure that the Minister pleaded guilty. It is worthwhile to an extent to come to the aid of the hon. Gentleman, who has similar concerns. The point that I was trying to make is that the Home Office and the DTI, particularly the DTI, are fully apprised of the situation and are keen to make progress. DTI Ministers have been extremely supportive of businesses based in my constituency and of the university. That is not the same as saying that it was inevitable that we should be in this situation. Some actions that are being taken now could have been taken some time ago. There has been a pattern of such activity and only recently have the correct police structures been introduced. That is no criticism of the Minister—from the moment she took up her position, we saw rapid progress on appointments.
We could go further back and look at the Labour party's decision to withdraw its investment from Huntingdon Life Sciences on the basis that it thought that its work was unethical. I know that that is not the Government's responsibility—it is not responsible for the Labour party or, indeed, sometimes, the other way round. Nevertheless, that was a bitter blow, as I know from speaking to people at HLS, because it gave the imprimatur of political approval to that sort of approach. In saying that the current office-holders are doing a good job, I want to associate myself partly with the remarks that some criticism can be made of what happened previously.
I appreciate the offer of a meeting with the Minister in respect of new clauses 32 and 36. I hope we will be properly consulted, rather than presented with an approach at the meeting on a take-it-or-leave-it basis. I am sure the Government feel that they have a majority for this measure. The point of tabling the amendments in Committee was to advance the debate. I am grateful for the Minister's clarification on dealing with things before they become a problem. It may be the words ''seeks to induce'' need to be inserted in new clause 32. I understand the Minister's point about the list of connected persons not covering fully all those who may need to be covered, using the example of the niece in the pub in the north-west. The new clause may not be perfect in that respect
There are still issues around the broader provision. The more I think about that, the more difficult it will be for my colleagues and me to be persuaded that there is a basis to go further than legislation restricted at this point to animal rights extremists. There may be a
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middle way, whereby secondary legislation requiring affirmative action by both Houses could be used to add to a list of areas where there is regulation, and so on. I was hoping we could have that debate today on the record, at least generally, but we have not been able to do so.
On the basis of what I have said, it may be difficult for us to support new clause 26, even though we sympathise with the reasons behind it. The hon. Member for Huntingdon indicated he wanted a vote, and we do not want to pre-empt the discussion we want to have, nor any decision, about whether the legislation should be extended. In view of the fact that the Government are seeking to engage with us on the question of animal rights extremism and economic damage, it is not our intention at this point to press our new clause to a vote. I beg leave to withdraw the amendment.
Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.
Clause 116 ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Clauses 117 and 118 ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Clause 119
Racial and religious hatred
Question proposed, That the clause stand part of the Bill.
The Chairman: With this it will be convenient to discuss the following:
Clause stand part.
No. 327, in schedule 10, page 178, line 29, leave out 'RACIAL AND RELIGIOUS HATRED' and insert
'HATRED OF RACIAL AND RELIGIOUS GROUPS'.
No. 328, in schedule 10, page 178, line 32, leave out
and insert
No. 323, in schedule 10, page 178, line 34, leave out from 'Part' to end of line 36 and insert
'''religious group'' means a group of persons defined by reference to their religion or belief'.
No. 322, in schedule 10, page 178, line 35, leave out
'religious belief or lack of religious belief'
and insert
'their religion or belief'.
No. 330, in schedule 10, page 178, line 37, leave out
'racial or religious hatred'
and insert
'acts intended or likely to stir up hatred against racial or religious groups'.
No. 331, in schedule 10, page 179, line 1, leave out 'racial or religious hatred' and insert
'hatred against racial or religious groups'.
No. 226, in schedule 10, page 179, leave out lines 3 to 7.
No. 312, in schedule 10, page 179, line 4, leave out
'having regard to all the circumstances'.
No. 332, in schedule 10, page 179, line 4, leave out from 'circumstances' to end of line 7 and insert
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'he recklessly risks that hatred against a racial or religious group will thereby be stirred up'.
No. 313, in schedule 10, page 179, line 7, at end insert
'or the person is reckless as to whether they are (or it is) likely to be so heard or seen or likely to stir up such racial or religious hatred'.
No. 333, in schedule 10, page 179, line 10, leave out 'racial or religious hatred' and insert
'hatred against racial or religious groups'.
No. 227, in schedule 10, page 179, leave out lines 12 to 15.
No. 314, in schedule 10, page 179, line 13, leave out
'having regard to all the circumstances'.
No. 334, in schedule 10, page 179, line 13, leave out from 'circumstances' to end of line 15 and insert
'he recklessly risks that hatred against a racial or religious group will thereby be stirred up'.
No. 315, in schedule 10, page 179, line 15, at end insert
'or the person is reckless as to whether they are (or it is) likely to be so heard or seen or likely to stir up such racial or religious hatred'.
No. 335, in schedule 10, page 179, line 18, leave out 'racial or religious hatred' and insert
'hatred against racial or religious groups'.
No. 228, in schedule 10, page 179, leave out lines 19 to 23.
No. 316, in schedule 10, page 179, line 20, leave out
'having regard to all the circumstances'.
No. 336, in schedule 10, page 179, line 20, leave out from 'circumstances' to end of line 23 and insert
'he recklessly risks that hatred against a racial or religious group will thereby be stirred up'.
No. 317, in schedule 10, page 179, line 23, at end insert
'or the person is reckless as to whether they are (or it is) likely to be so heard or seen or likely to stir up such racial or religious hatred'.
No. 337, in schedule 10, page 179, line 26, leave out 'racial or religious hatred' and insert
'hatred against racial or religious groups'.
No. 229, in schedule 10, page 179, leave out lines 28 to 31.
No. 318, in schedule 10, page 179, line 29, leave out
'having regard to all the circumstances'.
No. 338, in schedule 10, page 179, line 29, leave out from 'circumstances' to end of line 31 and insert
'he recklessly risks that hatred against a racial or religious group will thereby be stirred up'.
No. 319, in schedule 10, page 179, line 31, at end insert
'or the person is reckless as to whether they are (or it is) likely to be so heard or seen or likely to stir up such racial or religious hatred'.
No. 339, in schedule 10, page 179, line 35, leave out 'racial or religious hatred' and insert
'hatred against racial or religious groups'.
No. 230, in schedule 10, page 179, leave out lines 36 to 39.
No. 320, in schedule 10, page 179, line 37, leave out
'having regard to all the circumstances'.
No. 340, in schedule 10, page 179, line 37, leave out from 'circumstances' to end of line 39 and insert
'he recklessly risks that hatred against a racial or religious group will thereby be stirred up'.
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No. 321, in schedule 10, page 179, line 39, at end insert
'or the person is reckless as to whether they are (or it is) likely to be so heard or seen or likely to stir up such racial or religious hatred'.
No. 231, in schedule 10, page 180, leave out lines 4 to 7.
Schedule 10 to be the Tenth schedule to the Bill.
New clause 17—Racial and religious hatred (No. 2)—
'In section 17 of the Public Order Act 1986 (meaning of ''racial hatred''), at the end there is inserted—
''(2) The threat, abuse or insults that are relevant for the purposes of this Part are not restricted to those that are expressly directed against such a group if—
(a) he threatens those who hold a particular religious belief which is associated (wholly or partly) with the group, and
(b) the threat is likely to stir up hatred of the group.''.'.
And the following amendments thereto: (a), in paragraph (a) leave out 'he' and insert 'a person'.
(b), in paragraph (a) after 'threatens', insert ', abuses or insults'.
(c), in paragraph (b) after 'threat', insert ', abuse or insult'.
New clause 31—Racial and religious hatred (No. 3)—
'An offence under part 3 of the Public Order Act 1986 (c. 64) (Racial hatred offences) may be committed where the intention is to stir up racial hatred even though the words used refer to a religious group.'
New clause 33—Racial and religious hatred: procedure—
'Section 27 of the Public Order Act 1986 (c. 64) (procedures and punishment) is amended after subsection 1 by inserting—
''(1A) Before consenting to the institution of proceedings under this Part the Attorney General shall consider whether, having regard to all of the circumstances of the alleged offence, such proceedings are likely to be consistent with the Human Rights Act 1998, Schedule 1, in particular the rights and freedoms set out under Articles 9 and 10, and the prohibition of abuse of rights under Article 17.
(1B) In particular he shall consider whether the act or acts of the proposed defendant gave rise to incitement to racial or religious hatred so as to be likely to imperil the safety of persons of a particular race, religion or belief as set out in sections 17 and 17A.
(1C) In reaching his decision the Attorney General shall take into account such circumstances as he considers to be relevant to the proper balance between the rights contained in the Articles referred to in subsection (1A), including the way in which any speech or other means of expression is conveyed, the content of such expression, and the occasion on which it occurred.
(1D) The Attorney General shall each year publish details of each and every request for a prosecution for racial or religious hatred, showing the racial or religious groups involved, whether a decision was made to prosecute, and the outcome of any such prosecution.''.'.
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