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House of Commons

Wednesday 15 March 2006

The House met at half-past Eleven o'clock

PRAYERS

The unavoidable absence of Mr. Speaker having been announced, The Chairman of Ways and Means took the Chair as Deputy Speaker, pursuant to the Standing Order.

Oral Answers to Questions

NORTHERN IRELAND

The Secretary of State was asked—

Northern Ireland Assembly

1. Daniel Kawczynski (Shrewsbury and Atcham) (Con): What recent assessment he has made of the prospects for the restoration of the Northern Ireland Assembly; and if he will make a statement. [57301]

5. Mr. Tobias Ellwood (Bournemouth, East) (Con): If he will make a statement on the future of the Northern Ireland Assembly. [57305]

The Secretary of State for Northern Ireland (Mr. Peter Hain): All the Northern Ireland political parties support the principle of devolution. All of them support the principle of an Assembly and devolved government. They differ on how to achieve it. Our challenge is to bridge those differences, but one thing is certain: the current impasse cannot and will not continue. We cannot keep the Assembly standing idle; we cannot continue to pay Members of the Legislative Assembly indefinitely during suspension; and we cannot have meaningless elections in May 2007, to an Assembly that does not exist. This year is decisive, and all the party leaders will be facing some hard choices.

Daniel Kawczynski: I thank the Secretary of State for that answer. What is the single biggest impediment to the Assembly being reinstated? Who is to blame for the fact that the process is dragging out?

Mr. Hain: In the end, the Assembly can only be re-established and power-sharing governance instituted if the parties agree. Neither the Prime Minister, myself, the Irish Government nor anyone else can force Northern Ireland's parties to agree—it is a decision for them—but they will face a hard choice later this year if they do not reach that agreement.

Mr. Ellwood: Although the Assembly is suspended and has not met for three years, it continues to cost the taxpayer more than £100 million and 108 Members of
 
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the Legislative Assembly continue to draw their salaries. Two months ago, the Secretary of State said:

"I'm not giving a particular month, but I am saying that if we haven't seen progress by the summer, the first decision that I'm going to have to make is over continued payment of salaries and also allowances."

Can he update the House on what progress has been made on the re-establishment of the Assembly and the cutting of salaries?

Mr. Hain: What I said previously—the hon. Gentleman quotes me accurately—remains the case.

Mr. Eddie McGrady (South Down) (SDLP): After an ill-advised deadline of 8 March has come and gone, will   the Secretary of State now address the proposals of   the Social Democratic and Labour party, which called for the re-establishment of a fully devolved Administration—if necessary, with a temporary Executive appointed from non-elected members or, indeed, consisting of the Northern Ireland Office Ministers themselves—until such time as an agreed Executive can be formed? Does he not agree that that would encourage the parties to participate and that their failure to do so would be a rejection of their mandate and, in a sense, an illustration of the fact that they are putting party before people?

Mr. Hain: I understand the point that hon. Gentleman makes, but he has not persuaded, nor has his party, any other party to support that proposition. That is his problem, and there is no point in inviting me, as Secretary of State, to back that policy, when no party, apart from the SDLP, will subscribe to it.

Lembit Öpik (Montgomeryshire) (LD): The Secretary of State talks about the restoration of the Assembly, but he allows his Ministers to make extraordinarily important decisions—for example, about the Northern Ireland education system—that should be left to a reconstituted Assembly. If he is so sure that we can get the Assembly running again, why does he allow the Under-Secretary of State for Northern Ireland, the hon. Member for Basildon (Angela E. Smith), to talk about doing away with the selection process, which, as everyone knows, needs to be the subject of considerably more consultation and discussion in Northern Ireland? Surely, regardless of where individual Ministers stand on selection, the Government need to agree that such a decision should be left to the Assembly. If they do not, it raises questions about how optimistic they are about the reconstitution of the Assembly.

Mr. Hain: Is the hon. Gentleman telling me that he supports a child's future being decided on the basis of a test at the age of 11? Is that what he supports? Is it new Liberal Democrat policy that a child can either be relegated to a secondary school in Northern Ireland, with no decent future, or go to one of the excellent grammar schools? Is that the Liberal Democrat policy? Of course, such a decision should ideally be made by a devolved Assembly. However, until there is a devolved Assembly, we must govern in the interests of Northern Ireland on the economy, on health, with waiting lists coming down, and on reforming the school
 
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14 to 19 curriculum in the interests of all those children in Northern Ireland who have been failing so consistently under the system for so long.

Rev. Ian Paisley (North Antrim) (DUP): Why does the Secretary of State not face up to issue that there is one party that will not agree to the so-called basis of the agreement, namely that we all should be democrats? When will the Government be prepared to say, "There's only one way in, and that way is for everyone. You have not kept that way. Therefore, you have to be excluded."? The time has come when he has to decide whether he will tell those who agree with terrorism that they can be in the Government.

Mr. Hain: If the right hon. Gentleman is saying that Sinn Fein has not committed itself following the IRA statement—and, to be fair to it, for many years before—to a democratic, peaceful and political path, I do not think that he is judging the evidence as it has been presented to us. If he is also asking me to bar a very important part of the Northern Ireland political constituency from representation in the Assembly or a power-sharing Government, I cannot agree with him on that. We have got to make progress. His party needs to talk to the other parties and, at some point sooner rather than later, his party needs to talk to Sinn Fein, because it is the second largest party in Northern Ireland.

Mr. David Lidington (Aylesbury) (Con): As the Secretary of State knows, we hope that these talks succeed. However, can he confirm that the Government accept the principle that no one should serve as a Minister in a Northern Ireland Executive unless he or she is willing to accept the legitimacy of the police and the courts and give firm support to both those institutions?

Mr. Hain: Obviously, it is essential that all parties subscribe to the rule of law, and I agree with the hon. Gentleman on support for policing as well. We have repeatedly called for Sinn Fein to come into line and support policing in Northern Ireland. There is absolutely no reason for it not to do so. Indeed, there is increasing pressure from within republican communities for their elected representatives to co-operate with the police in combating ordinary crime. So we are absolutely agreed on that.

Mr. Lidington: I am grateful for that assurance from the Secretary of State. If, as we hope does not happen, these talks do not succeed in allowing for the reconstitution of the devolved institutions, can he give the House an assurance now that, although we welcome and value close co-operation with the Irish Republic, joint authority as a means of governing Northern Ireland in the absence of devolution would be at complete variance with the principle of consent in the Belfast agreement and, therefore, should be rejected?

Mr. Hain: I do not think that anybody is talking about joint authority. I very much welcome the hon. Gentleman's support for the general strategy that we have adopted, and I acknowledge that and the constructive role that he is playing in seeking to persuade all the parties to find a common way forward.
 
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But I am not anticipating failure. I think that there is a real prospect of getting the Assembly up and running and getting power-sharing governance at the end of that. Let us work on that together, as I am sure that he wants to do.

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